Odds of getting paid from signing a deferred payment contract

Michael B. McGee

Michael B. McGee

Well-known member
I've been asked to shoot a Lo/No (I won't have a salary) budget feature. The Director/Producer/Writer is expecting to submit this project to festivals as well as the SyFy channel and he's mentioned direct to DVD sales as well. So, obviously he plans to make some money from this film. What I'm wondering is how do I make sure I get paid? I've never shot (DP'd) a film that's possibly had the potential to make any money. So, what questions do i need to ask him and what kind of "deals" should I be requesting, ie: daily/weekly salary, points, etc.? I'm a little hesitant at the start because he doesn't even want to go through SAG. This caught me by surprise because he's gonna run into a lot of trouble if he wants to sell this film to anyone. Anyways, what advise can you give me being that this is gonna be my first quasi-"paid" feature? And can you share with me some examples of contracts that has gotten you paid from a "deferred contract" situation?

thanks in advance,
Mike
 
Has he turned a profit before? On how many films? What percentage of films have made money since the first profitable film? How much was made off of them? If the answer to the first question is no, then you have an extremely slim chance of making anything resembling a fair fee on def. I made a little money from my first feature from a naive persistence and pure dumb luck, but the people with the highest percentages only ended up with about 1/10th of what I currently charge for a single day's work.

SyFy and other legit avenues are definitely not picking it up if you have SAG actors and no SAG agreement (which involves paying actors and if you can pay actors you should certainly be paying crew).

I don't know what your motivation is for doing the film is, but in general, filmmakers that make money can pay crew.
 
Michael B. McGee said:
I've been asked to shoot a Lo/No (I won't have a salary) budget feature. ...
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Translation: Will you do this project for FREE?

If you're one of the many who is being hired for access to free equipment then I give full credit to the asker. ( It never hurts to ask. ) The person asking has already mentally convinced themselves that they are indeed paying everyone, its just deferred ( Yeah Right ). When REAL money actually shows up for this project then the REAL story will play itself out. There will be lots of reasons to still not pay anyone a cent and those reasons will be very good ones and make perfect sense. What doesn't change is that in reality nobody gets paid.

As for the submitting to the "SyFy channel" and expecting them to pick it up, is also delusional. I DP'ed a television pilot exactly one year ago this month. It was called "La Fontaine". The creator/writer/director of that project is M.F. McDowell a 25 year veteran of the industry and represented by ITM. I found out a few months ago it had been submitted to the Banff World Media Festival. I only found out after it had been nominated. What I didn't know and likely would never have known except that it happened to win in the Drama category was that the company I created with a few partners, "TechYou Media" was credited as producer. ( http://www.banffmediafestival.com/pilots-competition.php ) Even with all that going for it, nobody has actually picked it up to this day. ( More links: http://www.bclocalnews.com/okanagan_similkameen/vernonmorningstar/entertainment/124459194.html )

Getting a project from idea to network program is way, way more difficult than people can imagine even when you know exactly how everything needs to be done.

Don't let any of this dissuade you doing the project. There is absolutely nothing wrong with doing something for free even if you're just starting out and want get a bit of experience. Go in with your eyes open, know your really not going to get a dime, sign the payment deferral and put the onus on the producer. Just don't kid yourself.
 
One thing that you can (hopefully) control in this situation is HOW the deferment agreement is written. You and the rest of the crew (I assume they are also deferring) should be paid from the first proceeds to be returned to the production...NOT after the "investors" have recouped. Your skill and experience is just a important as the minimal initial financing and are an integral part of the project's success.

Many years ago I did a picture with partial payment each week and deferred the bulk of my fee. Unfortunately, my agreement was with the attached distribution company. Soon as the film made $3 million (domestic and foreign) the distribution company conveniently folded.
Never saw a dime of the money they were into me for. That was my first and last deferment deal. Had I signed an agreement making the Producer responsible, I would have had some recourse for collecting.
Just FYI.

...and do pay attention to the excellent comments by David and Craig.

Ken
 
you have to expect that deferred payment means no payment. I can't think of anyone I know who has ever actually been paid on a "deferred" job. If you want to work on the project for the experience and the contacts, do it. If you're doing it for the money, move on.
 
kplo said:
Soon as the film made $3 million (domestic and foreign) the distribution company conveniently folded.
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And just because you don't think that the people you'd be working for would set out to screw you doesn't mean that they won't. We all have monetary needs, and when it comes to paying someone for a project they worked on three years before and giving more money to yourself with your "now" financial needs, well, we humans can talk ourselves into anything.
 
How does his past work look? Can you see any of his other stuff getting picked up by a basic cable channel or selling well via DVD?

Proposing deferred payment is basically asking you take on the risk that their project will make money. These kind of deals are offered in all industries by people who aren't willing to put their money where their mouth is. This also makes them a lot more likely to drop the project when things don't go their way.

If the project is interesting to you and you have faith in the director, then do the project, just don't expect to get paid. Instead, put stuff in the contract that will be more rewarding for you in the long run (production credits, etc.).

If you're hoping that you'll get paid at some indeterminate point in the future, run, don't walk, away from from this project as fast as you can. You could be working on your own projects for the same price :)
 
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Jive said:
If you're hoping that you'll get paid at some indeterminate point in the future, run, don't walk, away from from this project as fast as you can. You could be working on your own projects for the same price :)
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Wow, thanks for all of your input. every post had some very helpful tips. I really enjoyed reading Jive's tip from above.

thanks again fellas.
 
I have edited several features for deferred pay and have never seen a dime. I produced and edited my last feature and have sold into 4 foreign markets over the last two years via a sales agent and I am still waiting to make a dime. So the chances are, well, uh.... none.

Michael
 
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