FS7: New Sony PXW-FX9 with venice features and 6k full frame

nyvz said:
I was playing around with the FX9 yesterday and I think I tested AF in 2K S35 HFR as well and it worked. There is a slight chance I'm misremembering though and I only tested it in 4K S35 60fps but I was talking to someone at NAB NY about how some cameras dont do AF in high HFR and we should test it so I'm pretty sure it was 120fps I tested it in...

Just now remembering I totally forgot to test the AF with a subject wearing glasses or dark skin, someone should definitely test those since those are the things I've seen Sony AF struggle with in the past. It seemed very good from what I tested though, and had good options for sensitivity and speed.
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I might be getting confused with the LUT implementation. LUTs only work up to 60fps, but...

...they have added gamma assist to the LCD/VF which uses the 709 LUT. However, it doesn’t change brightness as you alter EI.
 
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AF in HFR does not work but up to 60fps it does and just as on the FS7 up tp 60fps is within the normal frame rate the camera can handle with full funtionality.

I also think the footage shown looks really good. Clean and well resolved. Not to mention AF that looks natural.
 
Grug said:
Why?

Looking just at the image quality, the downsampled 4k does seem like a noticeable step up from the 4k-for-4k of the FS7.
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4k downsampled image is an improvement, no question about that. And, the autofocus and low noise performance are both really impressive. It’s is a solid improvement on the FS7, but for me, it doesn’t quite go far enough. I’d like to have seen a higher bit-rate codec for example.
 
J.Brown said:
AF in HFR does not work but up to 60fps it does and just as on the FS7 up tp 60fps is within the normal frame rate the camera can handle with full funtionality.
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A blooper. IMO. I mean when do you really need AF..?when spending a day at the races. Typical sony 'we have this feature apart from when you need it'.

Even the Nikon Z50 manages 120 (and audio) with with AF (in a 400g box for $1000) - Sony still seem to have some kind of crippled 1995 OS. Ive never known a nikon to turn features off in certain modes.
 
As it happens no af in S+Q can also be a pain at slow frame rates. In the studio I will do a mechanical slider product push in - again af is super handy here. Shooting at 5fps makes for a super smooth slide and as much DOF as you want due to long shutter time.

Clearly AF at low FPS is not demanding on the processor, so ommitting it is just slack.
 
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Agreed. Very poor footage from Alistair. Blown highlights, no detail in the shadows, poor dynamic range, not sharp, colours way out, over saturated. What is the point of showing such sub-standard stuff when trying to promote a camera? I would be embarrassed to show this stuff to a client. I'd show them and they'd show me the door. Rightly.
 
I think the camera looks OK, the subject /composition are just super cheesy.

The castle shots are not rich.

One thing is the backlit couple the trees behind are super compressed mudge that gain detail as the gain focus. Youtube or onboard.

The swans are held well IMO.
 
No wish to argue Sam because I have a lot of respect for what you say and how you say it, plus the work you do, but I really have to disagree about Alistair's footage. Especially the swans. They're yellow! Where I come from they're white. And they're not well held - the DR on them is awful. Here is a still from something I did on the FS7 a couple of years ago. Criticise it as much as you like, it was not one that got used, but IMHO it's better than A's in terms of colour and DR.

Except that having previewed my post, the highlights almost appear to be blown. In fact they're not when viewed before going through the process that gets them here. Honest!


swan_1.7.1.jpg
 
No worries. I was just giving the footy some defence. I noticed that they were not horrible. Not a major analysis. (and they would be yellow late in the evening)
 
Taking a second, more critical look, the highlights are not blown except for a few of the automotive headlamps which nevertheless are handled well, the Bugatti in particular. SLog3 has no inherent highlight rolloff, this shot was in Cinetone anyway, good highlight extension is evident here and in the shots of the boats on the water. For the waterfowl shots, you want the natural color of the light revealed; the human eye perceives CWF differently than warm sunset. White balancing that neuters the perception such that tungsten, daylight and CWF all look the same is not desirable. The detail in white feathers is unremarkable. This could owe to the observation of blown highlights. In any case I don't agree with it. The detail in any of the scenes is unremarkable for that matter, not seeing a notable benefit in 6k to 4k downsampling, nor is one necessary, footage is organic as is. Noise at 4000 ISO is evident, not excessive nor crushed. I find nothing to quibble with in any of this footage. It demonstrates good exposure and straight from the camera, ungraded, 709-lutted SLog3 or Cinetone stylized Custom mode.
 
Not to start a war here but....Alistar's footage looks fine. It looks like a Sony video camera, nothing more nothing less. Nicer than an FS7 but not a ton. However the noise levels are much lower at 4000 than what you'd get with the FS7.

Let's not forget this is footage from a $10k camera with a $400 lens, not a $60k Alexa with a $20k Cooke zoom and Company 3 doing the grade. You are not going to win the Oscar for Cinematography on the FX9. This should not be a surprise to anyone.

Sunlight in the evenings makes white objects look golden. Swans included.

Saying you'd lose a client over this sample footage is a little much.
 
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stewhem said:
No wish to argue Sam because I have a lot of respect for what you say and how you say it, plus the work you do, but I really have to disagree about Alistair's footage. Especially the swans. They're yellow! Where I come from they're white.
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Yes, the swans where you live are white. But do those white swans where you live appear white when silhouetted? Do they always appear as pure white regardless of the situation / color temp of the light the white swans are in?

Sorry, but I'm annoyed by this idea that each thing has a color and it should always appear that exact color no matter what. And any photographic rendering where the thing is not presented in the one exact color that "belongs" to it is wrong and a bad rendering. I often see this done in regard to human skin tone. Or read where an image criticized as bad because it is magenta, as if any image that is magenta is bad by definition. White swans in golden, late afternoon light should appear just as white as at high noon? And if they do not appear in an image as white as they do at high noon that image is a "bad" image and a "wrongly" executed image?

One of the most important things I learned early in my career from a DP who mentored me was a saying he had in regard to cinematography of:

"There is no right or wrong."

Another version of that which he'd tell me is: "There is no such thing as bad lighting. Only inappropriate lighting."

I've never worked with a Colorist. But I am pretty sure I would not want to work with a Colorist who had it in his mind that any given image has a "correct" or "right" color to it and anything other than that is "wrong". And his job is only to bring every image to its singular "correct" look.


Interesting to learn that there are no black swans in the UK and only white swans, btw. :D
 
There are black swans where I live. None of them is any good at ballet though.

As for Alister's footage, he was primarily shooting to test the autofocus on a couple of cheap lenses, I don't think he was shooting for his reel... My earlier comment was aimed at the the footage not the DoP's skill. It just felt a little 'videoish' to my eye.
 
Years, ago as I left my apartment there were a police car outside the building. As I returned there was one more and some police officers. Later that night I saw my building on the news. Apparently an old lady living there had 11 swans in her apartment. I'm pretty sure they were all white though.
 
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