FS7: New Sony F7 XDCAM 4K Super 35mm Camcorder

steve phillipps said:
According to who?

Steve
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According to Sony.

From the Sony press release:

"Sony has today launched the first 4K XDCAMcamera to feature a Super35 CMOS sensor. Capable of shooting in 4K Quad Full HDi (QFHD) andsuper slow-motion Full HD, the latest member of the XDCAM family has been designed fordocumentary, music video, online content creators and corporate filmmakers looking for beautifulpicture quality and an unrivalled choice of recording formats".


From Adam Wilt's article on Provideocoaliion:

"The Sony PXW-FS7 “Vérité”, being announced at IBC as I post this, is a large-single-sensor camera aimed specifically at shoulder-mounted run’n’gun work: things like documentary shooting, news, direct cinema, and (shudder) “reality TV”.


Reality will see it used on a whole host of different applications. Some will, no doubt, favour a RAW workflow, but I'm guessing a significant number will be content with the internal offerings.
 
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I think it's more correct to say that it was designed to be more useful than current offerings to those people, while still being useful for a whole range of other things. I agree that a lot of users will be interested in the self-contained nature of it, but it undeniably has the ability to get fully rigged and seriously high spec, enough for just about any current application.

Steve
 
To my one and only fan: :nads:

Original
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Skin
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Chemical
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Ahhh, thanks Dennis :laugh:
I think the second one certainly gives an idea of the sort of punch you can give the original flat image. I think it's also an indicator of how the "look" of these promo videos for new cameras won't tell you much, as there's so much room in post to make them look how you want them too, doesn't mean that look is the only one the camera is capable. of.
Steve
 
steve phillipps said:
I think it's more correct to say that it was designed to be more useful than current offerings to those people, while still being useful for a whole range of other things. I agree that a lot of users will be interested in the self-contained nature of it, but it undeniably has the ability to get fully rigged and seriously high spec, enough for just about any current application.

Steve
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I agree Steve. I see it as a bit of a Swiss Army knife of a camera. That's why I'm buying it. That said, I don't expect the crew on Downton Abbey to be handing back their Alexa's just yet.
 
steve phillipps said:
Ahhh, thanks Dennis :laugh:
I think the second one certainly gives an idea of the sort of punch you can give the original flat image. I think it's also an indicator of how the "look" of these promo videos for new cameras won't tell you much, as there's so much room in post to make them look how you want them too, doesn't mean that look is the only one the camera is capable. of.
Steve
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Really no one is ever happy. When DIG came out, it was crticized. I criticized it. With the Elephant movie (Manout I believe?!) it was kind of better, but again, it really depends what people look for in an image.

Really with these cameras serving such a broad market (doc, ENG, film, etc..) there isn't one single video that's going to make anyone happy. What can you do.

At the end of the day, Sony is not out to put out s*%tty products so sharing sensors with the F5 or not, I'm sure it will be very close to the F5 if not the exact same. Especially with RAW option of course, which really strips out all additional internal processing for the most part.

At $8000 I don't think anyone has anything to complain about. This camera will be a workhorse for the next 5 years easily. What else does anyone realistically need? (except highlights wrangling like the Alexa or F35 of course.. ain't going to happen)
 
Liam Hall said:
That said, I don't expect the crew on Downton Abbey to be handing back their Alexa's just yet.
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BUT, that's partially because they have plenty of cash - I'm sure that if they had the budget slashed and had to either bin several key actors or use an FS7 rather than Alexa they'd probably be quite happy to use it!

Steve
 
steve phillipps said:
BUT, that's partially because they have plenty of cash - I'm sure that if they had the budget slashed and had to either bin several key actors or use an FS7 rather than Alexa they'd probably be quite happy to use it!

Steve
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I'm guessing you've never worked as an AC? :-)

If you can't afford Alexa for a drama, there's the F55, then the F5. If I'm making a short, maybe FS7, but I'd want a camera with a dedicated PL mount.
 
Liam Hall said:
I'm guessing you've never worked as an AC? :-)

If you can't afford Alexa for a drama, there's the F55, then the F5. If I'm making a short, maybe FS7, but I'd want a camera with a dedicated PL mount.
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No, but I've worked with ACs.
There's obviously preferred tools for each type of job, but I just think that if you were forced to use an FS7 for a drama you wouldn't have any massive problems - not like using Beta SP to deliver 4k, or a 5D mkii to do super slomo. The FS7 looks like it will be well capable of doing a drama job. Got a PL lens that's too heavy? Use support bars, it's not a big deal. I've used a Sigma 300-800 with 1.4x converter on an Epic with a Nikon mount with no problems - you just need to rig up a decent support.
Steve
 
Even the closest comparison the F5 is twice the price. I think the price is probably the most startling bit of the FS7 announcement and it made me immediately think there must be some sort of gotcha - like a feeble codec, no slow motion, bad rolling shutter...but so far I can't find one. But I suppose we just don't know yet - maybe the higher frame rates all use line-skipping, or there are terrible motion artefacts or something. I don't think so though - I think it's Sony using its power to undercut or at least equal the price of the competitors, but with the Sony name and machine behind it, and give those competitors a really hard time - and I think they're going to succeed!
Steve
 
Not sure if this has been mentioned, but I got a note from my sales rep after he met with Sony. Most of this is already known, but what I can't understand is why the HDMI out gets dropped to 8-bit:

the FS7 has the same sensor as the F5, features XAVC-L for 4:2:2 10 bit processing, ISO 2000 with 14 stops of latitude, S-Log 3, magnesium frame, all the electronics are sealed with heat pipes for ventallation, the two SDI outputs are HD 4:2:2 10 bit only so the HDMI is the 4K and UHD output but can only manage 8bit 60P
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If someone wants Prores out of this machine why plunge down for the rear bolt on a V-lock batteries when you can use a low cost external Prores recorder? Sure internal Prores is nice but with the added bulk to me it would be better to just use a Blade or similar device. With the Shogun you might even get good UHD from the FS7 recorded into Prores.

Given the price point is there really any weak spots on this camera? I can see the LCD/EVF to be the most obvious thing and it would have been nice to have the raw SDI output included. Higher than 60p will be a bit compromised with binning but isn't that how's it done in the F5 also? There's not a bunch of connectors for TC and genlock but two SDI and HDMI works for me.

As long as there are no unpleasent surprises I think I can live with the above mentioned limitations. If I have any concerns it's more about the higher pixel density compared to my F3 and if that make the images more noisy or less refined.
 
You'd only plunge down if you were adamant against external recorders and cabling. Also I don't think there are DC outputs on the F7 so you're right away possibly looking at v-mount battery with taps to power the camera and/or ext. recorder so suddenly you're building up the rig.

Yes after 60p both F5/F55 use pixel binning to achieve HFR whilst providing for the ability to maintain adequate sensor sensitivity to keep effective signal-to-noise ratios at decent levels.

With the F5/F55 you have a swappable OLPF for $800 which helps reduce the aliasing you get when pixel binning. There's no telling if the F7S will have this option or not.

But really at the end of it the biggest differences with the F5 and F7S is the CineAlta badge, Mount. SR Codec (RGB 444 internal), and can't remember the story with LUTs... think the FS7 can load and burn them too...

This camera could have been $12k and still would be worth it. It's really what the F3 should have been 4 years ago IMO.
 
No swappable OLPF with the FS7. Is this a big deal? Adam Wilt told me flat outno, Alistair Chapman seems to think it was an issue though how big? Allistair wasn't looking at pictures when he mentioned it.
 
starcentral said:
To my one and only fan: :nads:

Original
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Skin
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Chemical
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You now have 2 fans. I like the second one much better this time around. Much smoother transitions in the background, maybe a touch of posterization on the face and hair in the upper right corner but much better overall. With the original files bit depth it would probably hold together up there. Bravo.
 
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Not downing your grade at all. Coloring is so subjective. Of the three, I personally like the original. Then again, I guess everything depends on context.
 
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