C100: Need Wide DR Setting Suggestions- Lost Mine!

nedcam

nedcam

Well-known member
I downloaded and installed the firmware update and lost all my settings which would not be a problem except I lost the sheet of paper I had written my preferred settings on! I do remember I brought sharpness down to -6 and Noise Reduction I believe was on 2, the rest is a blank. So I could use some suggestions. I had gleaned my settings from observations on this board, especially Erik's, however, please know this about my work situation:

90% of the time I do not see the footage but pass a drive onto the client or their editor, so I can't shoot flat C-Log since I don't know if there will be any grading. I get great feedback so I felt my settings were optimized for Wide DR.

For instance, under Other Functions, should I have it set at clip at 100%? I ask because I have an Animal Planet show coming up where they are OK with AVCHD and that is a broadcast job. As to sharpness, the first time I used my 70-200 on a haircut closeup of a talking head, an attractive female, I did import and inspect that footage since I was new to the camera and was mortified when I could see her pores with the sharpness set at 0. After that I knew I needed to lower that setting but I didn't feel like going below -6 because I was worried my wide shots would be soft. What is the optimum sharpness setting that doesn't need tweaking per situation?

As to NR, on interiors I rarely go over 1200 ISO (unless it's a doc) so I don't think I need it too high, do I? I can't rely on the post peeps having Neat Video, I want to avoid complaints of creating any extra post work.

I tend to be on documentary style, fast moving jobs so I am not inclined to go in and change a setting for individual situations as I read some posters do, I have my hands full. What would some of you suggest knowing how I work?

So if you have a work style like mine, where every day is different doing corporate, docs and non-fiction TV, moving too fast to tweak settings per location, what Wide DR settings would be most pleasing and require the least fuss in post? Appreciate you sharing your Wide DR preferences.

Thanks!
 
My 2p:

- Stock CP8/WDR has given us great results for the past year. I think it's a very well thought through matrix and, in your shoes, I'd want to do some very careful studio tests with client agreement if I deviated off it. It's a great compromise, allowing for confident "offline" viewings, while giving plenty of latitude to grade, once the cut is locked. It sounds like our work is similar to yours in style and demand. The main difference, I guess, is that we don't shoot directly for other directors - so any cock-ups are my problem in post. However, most of our work is for BBC Online and goes through the same broadcast QA process as regular HD programmes - with an exception made for AVCHD acquisition.

- They can always reduce detail in post, not add it back - I think CP8 is generally very flattering to skin tone and detail. YMMV.

- I wouldn't clip anything - give them full dynamic range, or you might cut off super whites in skies etc. I'd expect them to run a broadcast-safe filter on the output of their grade. You'll get more noise/whinging from the editor/colourist, if you compress the whites.

- I'd personally double check Animal Planet are happy with AVCHD - they're selling their shows internationally, so I'm surprised they'd accept non-compliant acquisition, unless there's a compelling editorial reason - eg, using a GoPro for hostile conditions. Otherwise, your AVCHD material gets lumped into the "non HD" quota - which is generally around max 25% of the programme content. If they've got spare quota, that might suit them fine - but I think I'd want chapter and verse from the Production Manager, though!

Ben.
 
+1 on WDR, and yes I've made a couple of variants to cope with detail and chromakey.

I don't touch the matrix settings - I've seen too much damage done by people eyeballing these without access to grading monitors, calibration charts and so on. If you're in a studio matching four cameras together for a live or as live shoot, fill your boots. If checking things out in the garden or living room (like we do, like we ought to do!) I'd be extremely cautious about jiggling the matrix. Dodgy white balance, mixed colour temperatures, changing light, etc.

But after answering another question elsewhere, you may also want to knock up a third WDR based slot, changing the Gamma to Std 3 - this will give you a traditional Rec709 balance.
 
Thanks guys. Matt what do you mean:

"knock up a third WDR based slot, changing the Gamma to Std 3 - this will give you a traditional Rec709 balance." I don't know what Rec709 means.

I will double check the Animal Planet job, I am communicating with a non-techy field producer but he did say AVCHD is cool, but I will email the PM.

I use my 4:2:2 camera for any green screen. After all, what sense does it make to use a shallow DoF camera like the C100 if there is no background?

Thanks
 
nedcam said:
I am communicating with a non-techy field producer but he did say AVCHD is cool
Click to expand...

I've heard it confused with "AVC Intra" a few times now. That would be a painful error on their part - but good brownie points for you, if you alert them to it!

By the way, Ned, I got hold of an original Sony VCT-14 to mount the Tilta onto. Absolutely rock solid. It's currently sitting rather smugly on a freshly delivered end-of-tax-year Miller Compass 25 tripod head.

Mmmm... nice........

Cheers,

Ben.
 
With the last firmware update the color is improved. I just went back to stock C Log and WideDR. Works great. The green cast is gone.
 
LOL - +1 to Ben, spotting the Schoolboy Error. AVC Intra is not AVCHD of course. AVC Intra is sort of half way between ProRes and XAVC at a low bitrate. Jolly good as a shooting codec so long as your editor can read it.

What do I mean by knocking up a 709 Custom Picture profile?

Well, if my shibboleths fall upon untilled soil or unsullied ears, sod it. Don't worry.

To open it up a bit... Rec709 is a series of technical specifications to establish how HD video works, from shooting to display.

Rec709 says that your HD display device has a limited dynamic range - less than 6 stops. So you may have to do some highlight and shadow compression to make that detail 'fit' into the Rec709 display device. If you shoot Rec709 and display rec709, there's no change in the contrast or gamma or highlight/shadow rendition - it all kinda looks like video.

So we can cheat the acquisition of Rec709 material by compressing the highlights and playing with the shadow detail. Not as extreme or as exponential as Cine gammas on your camera, but a gentle and robust tweak.

So I'm suggesting that you take the Wide Dynamic Range profile from the C100, save it as a new pre-set in your Custom Profiles, then you can change the special and quite extreme gamma curve of WDR and tell it to use a more simplistic Rec709 curve by using Std 1 from the C100 gamma curves. You're taking a standard setting, and saving a copy so you can twiddle the standard setting to something of your own design.

A 'wide dynamic range' isn't necessarily the best thing in every circumstance (though IMHO WDR gets close), the biggest issue is in controlled lighting situaitons where you don't need expanded dynamic range. To shoot with a 'flat' profile under controlled lighting in an 8 bit codec is asking for noisy pictures with a fair bit of swill in them. A Rec709 Custom Picture puts the zap back in your lighting setup.

BTW, shallow depth of field and chromakey is like Angostura Bitters on chocolate, or 'Liver Icecream' - just don't go there unless you really know why you're attacking perceived wisdom with a drinking straw. Sorry for inappropriate metaphors. It's all down to watching progress bars on transcoding. Just when you thought it was finished, the second pass starts, so I get to write another paragraph.
 
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