GH4 MP4, MOV, AVCHD, IPB, All I?

blazer003

blazer003

Well-known member
I think I have the general gist of these modes, but coming from the GH2 I don't have the first hand experience that some here have, having used the gh3. So if some could share and correct me where I'm wrong, that would be wonderful!

MP4 vs MOV
What's the difference between recording to the mp4 container vs the mov container? Any difference in the video data within the files, or is it the same video data in an different wrapper? Have any had more or less luck using either in Adobe Premiere? I ask this because I had some weird errors rendering some 4k footage out of Premiere yesterday.

MP4 AAC vs. MP4 (LPCM)
Only differing from each other in audio codec? AAC being compressed while LPCM is basically WAV files?

MP4/MOV IPB 50M or 100M, FHD(1080p) or 4K (in its various flavors).
Uses motion compression between frames using I, P, and B frames for a good compromise of compression and quality?

MP4/MOV All-I 200M
All frame by frame compression like individual jpegs for each frame?

AVCHD
As it is still limited to 24M in 24p, does it (on the gh3 or 4) break apart sometimes in highly detailed (water or foliage) scenes like it did on the GH2?

Thank you one and all for your input and help!
 
Bump on this.

I can offer a couple answers to your questions.

-The various IPB formats all use the same compression scheme. (What is the GOP of the GH4 though? And does that only apply to AVCHD formats? (I remember the GOP was a huge factor to crappy artifact filled footage when shooting moving water and other fluids)

ALL-I scheme is in fact compressing each frame individually. I wish wish WISH the GH4 had a 4K ALL-I mode (even if it was a slightly lower bitrate than 100Mbps!)
 
I'd also like to know if it's in fact the same h.264 encoder used for both MP4 and MOV wrapping.
As for the AVCHD mode of the GH4, I wouldn't use that for any workflow that includes an editing process and/or is targeted at achieving the highest possible image quality.

slavensb said:
I wish wish WISH the GH4 had a 4K ALL-I mode (even if it was a slightly lower bitrate than 100Mbps!)
Click to expand...

I'm afraid I have to disagree with you on that. If you'd want to retain image quality compared to IPB compression in ALL-I mode, you would have to bump the bitrate significantly (because there'd be no temporal compression). Also, because the temporal compression is highly efficient in h.264 encoding (i.e. it is mostly a reduction of redundancy in consecutive frames and therefore mostly lossless), the only drawback from IPB compression that you get is reduced performance in your editing suite. But with a little bit of patience and preview rendering, I usually get it done without even having to reencode the footage beforehand (and I'm editing on a mobile workstation). And what you win in IPB mode is of course smaller file sizes.
 
wow! - no-one willing to comment on this? it's an interesting question, got the GH4 and thinking about this ATM
 
well, I'm staying in 4K, and everything I've read says MP4 and MOV are identical "quality" just a different container or wrapper. the container could make all the difference in speed depending on YOUR editor. I use MP4 because it seems more compaible with my editor, and more windows systems and everything really. I don't do MAC: mov
 
I have a GH4 and shoot mostly 1080P at 60fps and 28Mbps AVCHD

As far as I see the 23.98P is only available at 24Mbps
If you want to shoot 100Mbps you need to switch to MP4
MP4 (LPCM) or MOV for 200Mbps
 
Just a little of what I've learned since I posted these questions 8 months ago.

MOV vs MP4(LPCM) No difference to me. Premiere likes them both just fine and no quality difference in video or audio and same mode options.

MP4 (LPCM) vs MP4 (AAC). Just compressed audio vs uncompressed, though MP4 (AAC) gives you some lower bitrate and resolution options if you want them.

200Mbs All I vs 100Mbs IPB for FHD? I usually like the results of IPB just as well or better with smaller file sizes, and though I haven't done a head to head comparison specifically, I don't think Premiere plays one better than the other.

AVCHD? Very good with much smaller file sizes. I haven't ever purposefully stress tested it, but I've never seen it break apart. If I don't need 4K quality, I usually shoot AVCHD.

Most often used modes:
C4K 24.00 for quality dependant narrative work.
UHD 29.97 for studio greenscreen shots, and studio shots that will need multiple angles (through reframing 4K for HD).
AVCHD 23.99, 29.97, or 59.94 for anything where insane quality isn't needed. Probably my most used mode.
FHD 100Mbs if I do need more quality (though the difference between IPB and AVCHD is not huge and probably not noticeable to the average person) or if I need 96fps slow motion, though more often I just shoot in 60p for the extra detail, vs. extra frame rate unless I want a specific super slowmo shot.
 
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The main difference between mov and the other formats is how and where you want to open the files. mov has the advantage of being able to open just about anywhere directly from the card. No conversion, unwrapping or importing into a NLE needed. You can watch the files directly in Quicktime to check them out before importing. Not a huge deal but sometimes I like to quickly check the contents of a card without having to open a NLE to do so. It is also nice to be able to open the mov format directly in applications like Apple Motion or other FX software that can only import mov files.

Mov also has file names that are not gibberish which makes it much easier to quickly pass off the files to a client without having to convert or unwrap first.

mov has the disadvantage of spanned files for longer videos not always stitching back together in an NLE. AVCHD will stitch together since AVCHD has very robust meta data that tells a NLE how the multiple clips should span together. mov does not have this and you have to manually put them together in the timeline of your NLE. Not a huge deal but something to think about. mov may also be missing other forms of meta data but I haven't really explored that in detail yet. In FCPX the mov format so far seems to have all the meta data I would want excluding the spanned clips for longer takes.
 
Thomas Smet said:
The main difference between mov and the other formats is how and where you want to open the files. mov has the advantage of being able to open just about anywhere directly from the card. No conversion, unwrapping or importing into a NLE needed. You can watch the files directly in Quicktime to check them out before importing. Not a huge deal but sometimes I like to quickly check the contents of a card without having to open a NLE to do so. It is also nice to be able to open the mov format directly in applications like Apple Motion or other FX software that can only import mov files.

Mov also has file names that are not gibberish which makes it much easier to quickly pass off the files to a client without having to convert or unwrap first.

mov has the disadvantage of spanned files for longer videos not always stitching back together in an NLE. AVCHD will stitch together since AVCHD has very robust meta data that tells a NLE how the multiple clips should span together. mov does not have this and you have to manually put them together in the timeline of your NLE. Not a huge deal but something to think about. mov may also be missing other forms of meta data but I haven't really explored that in detail yet. In FCPX the mov format so far seems to have all the meta data I would want excluding the spanned clips for longer takes.
Click to expand...

Good points. When I'm working with Macs I always install VLC to play AVCHD/MPEG files natively, and I work in an Adobe environment so I don't worry about a format from that end. But a fair number of people I talk to don't trust VLC because it's open source, and they don't understand it, so for a lot of people MOV is the way to go.
 
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