Minimal distance from lens rear element to sensor

bogpetri

Active member
Hello Jim and all the hardworking team at Red,

I've touched on this subject a while ago, but now I see that a lot of people will indeed use old cine lenses with the camera. I myself have a set of Baltar old lenses that I like to use for a different effect sometimes, besides my other set of 35mm modern lenses that I use regularly.

Some of this lenses (especially non-reflex lenses lile Bausch & Laumb, Cooke Speed Panchro etc) have a very small distance between the rear element and the film plane. I hope the Red team will think of that and put only a thin glass above the sensor (and nothing else), in order to accomodate any lens as far as depth is concerned.

Also, another thing is to think which is the largest of the common 35mm mounts that exists (for example, Mitchell BNC or BNC-R has a diameter of 61.468 mm), and take that diameter into account when designing the front of the camera (not putting anything is the path of a lens that large).

I'm absolutely sure you guys know better than anyone how to build a camera, I just thought it's a good idea to reiterate this point. For what RED is trying to bring us, it would be a shame not to accomodate almost any lens out there.

P.S. Just as a further note, Kubrick had to completely modify a Mitchell to accomodate his f0.7 Zeiss lenses - for two main reasons: the shutter and the thick aperture plate. They aren't there with RED so one (who can afford it - Jim?) can only dream about renting those and testing them with RED. The distance from rear element to film plane is only 4mm by the way.
 
bogpetri said:
Hello Jim and all the hardworking team at Red,

Also, another thing is to think which is the largest of the common 35mm mounts that exists (for example, Mitchell BNC or BNC-R has a diameter of 61.468 mm), and take that diameter into account when designing the front of the camera (not putting anything is the path of a lens that large).


P.S. Just as a further note, Kubrick had to completely modify a Mitchell to accomodate his f0.7 Zeiss lenses - for two main reasons: the shutter and the thick aperture plate. They aren't there with RED so one (who can afford it - Jim?) can only dream about renting those and testing them with RED. The distance from rear element to film plane is only 4mm by the way.

Hi,

There are some great lenses available in BNCR, at 1/2 price or less than a PL mounted version of the same glass.

Stephen
 
Yes, a BNC(R) mount (from RED or a 3rd party manufacturer) is a must. However, it's (I think) the largest of them all, so hopefully the camera is designed taking all possible mounts into account. Especially BNC (not BNCR) lenses go very deep and also have very thick, big barrels at the rear of the lenses.
 
bogpetri said:
Yes, a BNC(R) mount (from RED or a 3rd party manufacturer) is a must. However, it's (I think) the largest of them all, so hopefully the camera is designed taking all possible mounts into account. Especially BNC (not BNCR) lenses go very deep and also have very thick, big barrels at the rear of the lenses.

Hi,

Its much easier for a 3rd Party BNCR conversion, than a Nikon, because the FDD is for BNCR is greater than that of PL.

Original BNC might cause problems, depending on what covers or is in front of the sensor.

Stephen
 
Stephen Williams said:
Hi,

Original BNC might cause problems, depending on what covers or is in front of the sensor.

Stephen

That's exactly what I meant. Since (at least theoretically) nothing has to be put in front of the sensor besides a glass for protection - no shutter, no aperture plate and all that stuff - this is an incredible opportunity to make the RED camera accept absolutely ANY 35mm lens. Leave as much empty space in front of the sensor, have a removable mount (as it's already suggested in the renderings so far) and then any lens would fit, no matter what the FFD or the diameter is.
 
How about a variable-depth sensor that slides in and out by user-adjusted amounts in order to accomodate any depth that a lens might require.
 
Lowkus said:
How about a variable-depth sensor that slides in and out by user-adjusted amounts in order to accomodate any depth that a lens might require.

Sounds like something easy to break. And need a great deal of adjustment.
 
Great suggestions guys:)


But........The price of any cine lens is a major investment/outlay for a lot of us. Given that there is a limit to the number of quality cine lenses in PL mount. What would happen to the price of these lenses and even the red lenses (although they possibly represent a better price to quality ratio) if the mounts mentioned and others were all available and working with the red one. Some have already bought used cine PL mount lenses others are looking to buy but are holding off. I am holding off getting a used s16mm zoom because i am concerned with buying something for say $7,000 that could go down in price if other more atractive/cheaper options became available.

Michael
 
mike the beginner said:
Great suggestions guys:)

I am holding off getting a used s16mm zoom because i am concerned with buying something for say $7,000 that could go down in price if other more atractive/cheaper options became available.

Michael

Mike,

I don't think the proposed new lenses & zooms will have much effect on the price of S16 zooms.

Stephen
 
Mike,

I don't think the proposed new lenses & zooms will have much effect on the price of S16 zooms.

Stephen

Thanks Stephen. Still trying to learn this stuff. Are s16mm lenses not also made on bnc mounts etc or different mounts as well? i assumed (dangerous to do i know) that the more mounts available would aslo apply to s16mm?

Michael
 
mike the beginner said:
Thanks Stephen. Still trying to learn this stuff. Are s16mm lenses not also made on bnc mounts etc or different mounts as well? i assumed (dangerous to do i know) that the more mounts available would aslo apply to s16mm?

Michael

Hi Mike,

AFAIK nobody ever (commercially) converted 16mm lenses to BNCR, it's probably the biggest & strongest mount ever made, Pavavision is quite similar before anybody chimes in!

Generally most S16 lenses are fairly new (or expensive upgrades) & would be PL mounted. This is why there is no cheap S16 zooms on Ebay.

Stephen
 
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