GH2 Managing, organizing and sorting LOTS of footage - Suggestions please!

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peripatew

Well-known member
I just got back from my trip to Cambodia. It was amazing. I went with an organization that is helping to restore girls rescued from the sex trafficking industry (I'd be happy to talk more about this project, but don't want to sidetrack from my editing question). I'd like to make some educational and inspirational videos now, but I'm overwhelmed by my footage. I did some light video blogging while I was there, incorporating some footage from the day (check the vids out if you're interested: http://lukemcfadden.com/ or http://vimeo.com/lukemcfadden/) but was soon exhausted as same-day-editing even small amounts on my slow laptop w/ slow internet was tiring after shooting all day.

So, now I'm home with 250G of data, editing with the Adobe Suite (on a Mac). I was shooting w/ one GH2, with a GoPro for an extra cam and wide angle shots. I captured half of the audio via a Zoom H1 (and will sync with pluraleyes). I have it all organized via folders by date, time, location, and event, but beyond that it's all just numbered .MTS files. What's the best way to sort all of this? I opened up Adobe Bridge to give it a shot, but it doesn't do .MTS files oddly enough.

Some clips are short and easy to identify, but others are long continuous recordings while run-n-gunning.

I'm not planning on putting this all into one documentary like video, but rather pulling out lots of shorter videos over the next several weeks and months, reusing some of the footage throughout the different videos for a long time to come. But I feel lost at the moment not being able to step back, and see everything I have in a snapshot type way.

Dropping everything into Premiere, and moving it all around into different sequences doesn't seem like a very good option, though that would allow me to quickly trim the clips into useable pieces. But good organization seems tough that way.

While in the field trying to do quick edits, I just used Evernote to quickly jot down descriptions of the video files (content, shot type, quality, length). This worked ok, but seemed like a poor way to do this, as I had to essentially do it twice. Once to watch and label everything, and then I had to rewatch everything when I pulled it in to do my rough edit.

Ideally, a solution that would allow me to add lots of metadata while at the same time cleaning up, and separating the clips would be great.

I'm a semi-noob, and so maybe it is just this painful, without a "best" way to do this. But, I thought consulting the DVX-hivemind would be a good idea before diving in on my own.

So, what's your workflow for something like this?

Thanks for the thoughts and advice!
 
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Welcome back.

Depending on your computer (is it fast enough) you might want to give FCP X a try. I'm not sure if you said you did multi-camera shots, but that is nicely covered now in the latest version. Also it has a very, very deep metadata based system that will allow you to relatively quickly sort your footage into various what used to be called "bins". But the arrangement is far more sophisticated than that. The great thing is that all of your footage can sit in a single Event but sorted by various keywords or other properties of your choosing. That single Event can then be the source for any number of Projects (movies).

Of course that all presupposes a qualifying Mac. If it does, I can recommend several near free or reasonably priced resources and tutorials which will get you started.
 
stoneinapond said:
Welcome back. Depending on your computer (is it fast enough) you might want to give FCP X a try .
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My computer is quite nice, but I can't make the switch to FCP X. Don't have the money, and I don't want to leave the Adobe Suite at the moment.I appreciate the suggestion, and am hoping for better features with CS6.
 
peripatew said:
My computer is quite nice, but I can't make the switch to FCP X. Don't have the money, and I don't want to leave the Adobe Suite at the moment.I appreciate the suggestion, and am hoping for better features with CS6.
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Well, just to be clear, you could experiment with FCP X on a trial basis to see if it works well for your situation. And the full version is only $300 anyway. You'll still be using the Adobe suite for everything else. Could be an interesting experiment to see how effective the new metadata system is at organizing such a vast quantity of footage.
 
There is no reason to spend $200 on FCPX just to get marginally better data sorting. You can do it using the Adobe suite, but it's really up to you on how you want to organize it.
 
Gary Huff said:
There is no reason to spend $200 on FCPX just to get marginally better data sorting.
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First off, it's $300. And I would strongly argue the "marginally" description. Light years would be a better choice of words. But the OP has already indicated that he's not interested.
 
Gary Huff said:
For some people, that's a lot of money. Especially when they can pretty much already get the job done with what they already have.
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Not arguing that. But the OP specifically asked for workflow suggestions. So since he's not interested in my solution and you say it can be done with what he already has, why don't you share with him some of your workarounds.
 
peripatew said:
So, now I'm home with 250G of data, editing with the Adobe Suite (on a Mac). I was shooting w/ one GH2, with a GoPro for an extra cam and wide angle shots. I captured half of the audio via a Zoom H1 (and will sync with pluraleyes). I have it all organized via folders by date, time, location, and event, but beyond that it's all just numbered .MTS files. What's the best way to sort all of this? I opened up Adobe Bridge to give it a shot, but it doesn't do .MTS files oddly enough.
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What you are looking for is an asset management package, that suppots AVCHD files and structure, and allows for display a thumbnail or playing of clips in some sort of preview mode.

I asked a similar question a few months ago, and got this reference for the Mac:

http://www.shedworx.com/cosmos

It seems to 'work', but the one problem I have is that it does not (when I evaluated it back when) support reading the EXIF info on stills. My ancient 'iView' at least did that... but alas, iView was eaten up by Microsoft, and never seen again... at least in a 'Mac' version... But it seems that you are more organized than I, so, if EXIF info not being displayed is not an issue... then this may allow you to preview and organize what your are doing. (Cosmos doesn't seem to have a 'play' function, but at least it has a thumbnail of the MTS file).

Don't know what's available for the Windows environment...

I think I will spend the $39 for it, as I'm going to have to upgrade to Lion to support iPhone development for iOS 5... and Lion no longer supports Rosetta which iVew required...

As a note, you should always import the entire AVCHD file structure, from the "PRIVATE" directory down on the SD card. This is because there are other files in the structure which tools may use, which would not be available if you just copy the MTS files out of their place in the AVCHD structure. The other files really don't take up space so there's no need to be 'conservative' and just copy the MTS files.

So, when I archive an SD card I copy all the folders, PRIVATE, MISC, and DCIM... That way everything is on my archive.
 
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NOt to be a stickler but 250gigs is not a lot of footage by comparison. I think you'd be well served to just go through everything and organize it all yourself.... Now, when I got back from my trip to the UK on a doc project I had 3 terabytes of files and I did that the same way. Just be logical... check it all out and don't allow a computer to do those selections for you cause you'll end up missing some happy accidents and some priceless moments...
 
Justyn said:
NOt to be a stickler but 250gigs is not a lot of footage by comparison. I think you'd be well served to just go through everything and organize it all yourself.... Now, when I got back from my trip to the UK on a doc project I had 3 terabytes of files and I did that the same way. Just be logical... check it all out and don't allow a computer to do those selections for you cause you'll end up missing some happy accidents and some priceless moments...
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Expand on that though, how do you "organize it yourself"? Do you rename all your files? Separate big files with multiple parts into small clips will throwing out the stuff that's complete trash? Are you putting everything in folders based on the shot type? Or by scene type? How do you annotate the clips outside of whatever structure you are using?

250G is a LOT for me (especially considering I shot at a fairly low bit rate (50-100) with one camera.
 
When starting a project or importing new footage, I always review my footage and annotate it. This can be a tedious and lengthy process, but it greatly speeds up work when you're building your sequences.

Sony Vegas Pro makes it very simple to annotate footage by adding named markers and regions while reviewing clips. You can then go through the list of regions and pull the shots that you want into your timeline.

While not as streamlined as Vegas, you can also annotate and organize your footage using Premiere's subclips feature.
Here's a reference: http://help.adobe.com/en_US/premier...D.html#WS6ECD368B-21F3-42b2-AB78-69DD63339987

Basic workflow:
  1. Import video files into a Premiere project
  2. Load video in source monitor
  3. Review footage and set in/out points for each clip you want to make note of
  4. Create subclip of in/out selection
  5. Name subclip (using a strict naming specification is recommended as it will remind you of the subclip's contents at a glance. e.g. "[MCU] Interview with John", etc.)
  6. I believe you can also add metadata to subclips to help you find clips that match certain conditions while building the edit.
  7. Continue until you've annotated all of your footage
  8. Organize your various subclips into project folders/bins for a cleaner project structure

Now when you're building a sequence, you can look through your subclips and see what kind of shots you have at a glance and simply drag them from the project pane onto the timeline.

Adobe has been previewing an app called Prelude that will hopefully make the logging process easier for CS users.
 
Well sure thing... i have a method that I call SLAM and I've taught a few classes on it and have had several converts in this method... and it's very straightforward and I use timelines and bins as organizational tools and I'll explain how I do it.


I first capture everything and throw it all on one timeline. I then make additional timelines for the various different types of footage, moods, moments, and select things that I know I want to group together, or separate, and or make sure that I use. So I'll end up with timelines like interviews, beauty shots, instructional, etc. So that as I'm going through the footage I'm arranging and organizing the footage onto other timelines so eventually there will be nothing in that original timeline.. except for footage that I don't want.

I also do the same thing with bins too in putting clips up there to organize and to go through... So then when you are done, you have logically grouped things and you have an idea of what you can use and what you have to work with...

So then, after you've done some assembly style editing, you can move onto really cutting and then go to the various bins or sequences and grab whatever you want and then place it into the working edit that you are working on. This way you won't duplicate clips and you won't miss anything cause you'll be logical in how you are selecting the clips... And then also as you go if something isn't working, you can go back to whatever you had in other sequences and use that... Also, you will maybe find patterns and trends in the footage and that'll be a great thing....


I remember reading a great article a while back where an editor said that you shouldn't rush the selecting cause your brain works on a subconcious level and you'll find unique ways to do things just by looking and observing and also taking notes..... This also leads me to the other thing you can do, which is noting the clips, renaming them, or making them individual clips, etc.... Also, you might want to nest sequences together, export them out and do whatever else you need to do to make sure that you are getting what you want...


Hope that helps and good luck. There's really no easy way to go through footage.. it's the most important thing to do and the worst part of editing. I don't like doing it, but it's essential and it will pay off. You might be slow at the beginning but over time you'll get faster and more proficient....


Good luck and share your findings and your footage when you get to that point. All the best!
 
Justyn said:
I first capture everything and throw it all on one timeline. I then make additional timelines for the various different types of footage, moods, moments, and select things that I know I want to group together, or separate, and or make sure that I use. So I'll end up with timelines like interviews, beauty shots, instructional, etc. So that as I'm going through the footage I'm arranging and organizing the footage onto other timelines so eventually there will be nothing in that original timeline.. except for footage that I don't want.
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Not very efficient considering that he's using a tapeless workflow (the GH2) and thus has multiple clips for each take. This sounds like you're still shooting on tape.

I also do the same thing with bins too in putting clips up there to organize and to go through... So then when you are done, you have logically grouped things and you have an idea of what you can use and what you have to work with...
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It's going to be a huge pain in the ass, but you have to do the work, there are no shortcuts. I would recommend you follow this step and open up your NLE of choice, import the footage, then name it so that you can easily find it later. If you're on Premiere, create bins to separate into categories (and even sub bins) and then accurately name each clip for what it contains. Premiere has a search function, so you can easily call up any clip later on in the future.
 
Just to second what other have said:

File structure wise I do everything by date. That's just how my mind works. I will make folders that are named (20120201-20120203 Thailand Islands Footage) or something of the sort. Gives me an idea of the timeframe and some pertinent data.

Then I bring it into Premiere in their folders (check import folders). Now I have bins in Premiere that have the date and some info about what's there. Now, it all depends on the type of project. If it's something that needs to be somewhat chronological, then I just start in from the first folder, and make sure and make a duplicate of clips that are "beauty shots" or B-Roll that I may want to use later (maybe a boat going down a canal that I can use a piece of later) and put them into their own bin named as such.

But it all comes down to work, one way or another. If you just have a big old folder of clips, it's time to start separating them out. Probably into folders within the OS, but if you really want to skip that (trust me, you don't), then in Premiere itself.
 
blazer003 said:
I will make folders that are named (20120201-20120203 Thailand Islands Footage) or something of the sort. Gives me an idea of the timeframe and some pertinent data.
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And that works fine for blazer, but wouldn't as well for me, which is why you need to decide how you are most comfortable organizing your footage instead of just duplicating any particular workflow. Decide how you are most comfortable with your footage being organized and then use a combination of file sorting and then Bins in your NLE to keep it all organized.

And, in my opinion, this is the most boring, inane thing you can do in editing, but it pays off in the end. You just have to grit your teeth and do it.
 
This might be cannon fodder. If you can figure out what you want to do with the footage, it might help. My structure (although small) is based on my storyboards for a project. Each story board carries the footage to get that scene done. So if you can figure out what you want to do with the footage (final film) in terms of scenes, then it might be a way to organise it that way.
 
I did an editing project for a market research firm where they had 32 respondents, from 4 different countries, submit video of themselves answering about 10 of 15 possible questions. They got to choose which 10 to answer, but the list of 15 was given to everyone.

The research company wanted video clips that gave them all answers from each individual. Then the research company wanted as well all submissions to each question that was asked. Each video needed titles to identify the person, the country and the question being discussed. This was to enable their client to cross reference others in the collection if they wished to further examine responses.

Within a day of getting into the project it became apparent this was going to be more of a data management job, than video editing. In order to visualize and organize everything I received, I went to Excel and built a spreadsheet that listed all countries, the respondents in those countries and all questions that could have been answered. The countries and respondents were places in the columns on the spreadsheet. The questions were then placed in the row sections of the spreadsheet. As I received video clips from the respondents, they were placed in a folder for the project and names of each clip inserted into the corresponding cell on the spreadsheet.

Organization was easily 25% of the total time spent, if not significantly more. But once the spreadsheet was complete, build out became a piece of cake. Everything a respondent answered was listed in order as you went down their column. Every answer to each question was listed going across the appropriate row. Titles were then built for each country, respondent and question. When it came time to load it into Premiere bins were created for titles, and each respondent's clips. Now it just was drag and drop onto the timeline, following either columns or rows on the Excel spreadsheet.

I have used Excel to do a lot of stuff but never thought of it as part of a video project, until I got this one. :-)

Good luck with your project !!!
 
Gary, you assume wrong my friend and I've been nonlinear since 2004, probably a lot sooner than most people here. Efficiency is maintained I assure you but my method isn't for anyone, but the results I get are quite awesome, and maybe idiosyncratic... but I've never encountered an editor who can go through more footage in a faster manner than I do. I'm like the Borg... assimilation...

And if you do a paper edit then that's so old school I can't even comment and I'd be half the way to a final master by the time you've finished even a pencil draft... Time to jump into a truly non-linear approach.... But what works for me and a couple dozen people that I've tough, doesn't work for everyone.... Some people still like to plod along.....


I just also like to follow the lead of editor's like Walter Murch and since I"m not cutting on film anymore, I do the next best thing and consider my footage as dailies and I slog through them while I make my organization in the head....
 
Blazer... sounds like a similar approach and there really isn't a shortcut to editing and you are doing yourself a huge disservice if you try to cut through the watching of footage.. and it all comes down to making decisions... Whatever they maybe. I really enjoy that aspect of cutting cause I try to let the footage show me the direction as everything has a real flow and message and it comes out through the process and I try to impose nothing on it, other than a possible direction that I think everything should go.. and that comes through watching it all and making decisions...

I also believe that bins and organization are so key. I'm always kind of alarmed when I go to other editors places and all of the clips are in one bin and all of the sequences are too and then in a little bit I hear them complaining and bitching about not being able to find anything.. and that's cause it's a mess.. Now, my editing room might be a mess, but my projects are neat and tidy... lol


Another thing that I also like to do is pre-edits of certain sequences just to see how little bits work by themselves and also as a backup option so that I'm always able to backup things that are important and or that have taken me a long time... And of course I have all source files backed up to atleast one other location, but I prefer two additional locations just to make sure murphey's law doesn't bite my booty.
 
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