"Location sound 101 - This is how it is"

the setting example is not for m Audio recorders , but for normal gain structure recording device which can hold +4dbm signal ( broadcast cameras and recorders ) , i night think that with 671 it would be ok if you run the mix Prue true the the -10DB signal directly to line ins
 
Woooow! ExileOnTheMainStreet

Can you give me the english version of this, i know it may seem like you were speaking plain enoch, but my head is already smoking?

What is a limiter?

Should i re-calibrate the mixer so that when i put the refrains tone ON it shows as being at -16 db in stead of 0db?

And than with the new setting i set the dialog so that it is peeking at +12db?

I feel like i have completely misunderstood you? :cry:
 
As for test #002,003,004.

Is the background noise from the traffic not going to create a problem when cutting together different shots?
 
if the m audio puts they specification right , that what you do - you buy or make 20 db
pads for you balance out if you go balance from the mix pre to balance input on microtreck. or 15 db if you go unbalance from your xlrs
or 10 db pad for your unbalance out ( mini pl) if you decide work from that point
now if you don't have another tone generator , hook your mike and supply level which will hit constantly your +18 dbu meter ( the last red) , bring the microtrack to 0dbfs - maximum scale , and decrise 2 db.
now when you will turn the tone on the mixer it would be -20 dbfs on the microtrack scale
now you can work in normal way when you kip your peaks on +8+10
you can set the limiters on the mix pre on every point that you like above ( +14 -16) is good enough for drama recording
the microtrack have hard limiter be for the analog to digital convertion so its always better to work with your mixer one which makes better job
 
I am cunfused as hell.

Exile, I think you know what you are talking about but it seems that this is a much less complicated topic. I don't think special cables with PAD's and such are needed at all.

Jon Oskar, I am not sure you understand the difference between analog and digital and the fact that your mixer is analog and your micro track is digital. 0 analog (vu) should never equal 0 digital (fs). There is a huge difference. Once you go over 0 digital thats it, distortion, no matter what. With analog you want your signal to be over 0 in fact +8 is great place to be.

That being said this seems to be the way to solve the problem.

1. Turn on tone.
2. Set to O vu on mixer.
3. Plug into micro track, be it main out or other I don't care.
4. Set the level of the Microtrack so that your tone is sitting at -20,you could do
-18 too for a little less headroom.
5. Turn off tone.
6. Bring mics up so that their levels peak at +6 or +8, be carefull don't to distort.

There you go. Same process as if you were going to a digital camera.

Forgive if I have overlooked a critical point in the past posts.
 
MattinSTL said:
If you switch on the 1kHz tone the mixer is at 0db... then set your recorder at 0db and you should be perfect. If you want a safety zone then back the recorder off just a bit. Setting my rig up like this is how I got to the optimal setting on the 671 being "4" on the dial. At 0db on the fp24 and 671 the 671 is exactly halfway between 4 and 5. I experimented with some dialog recording... running the mixer hotter and the recorder lower... and vice versa... and this is definitely the best sound... which is comforting because it's how you should logically set it up anyway.

Since mic output varies you'll need to adjust accordingly. If you're doing sound for a broadcast production facility then go with -20db levels... for your own NLE I'd probably go for -12db and accept the occasional "kissing" of the 0db led. (this is watching the fp24)

Rather then simply set for 0db on both you might want to set the MicroTrack for -6db down from the fp24's 0db output. That way you can just watch the fp24's leds and keep the MicroTrack display off. Even with the 671's peak hold and dancing lcd screen I still prefer a couple flickering leds.

The signal is so clean it's super-easy to bring up the level if you need to. Setting up both machines to zero is fast and easy, but I'd be wary of running the recorder with no peak buffer.

When I ran sound straight to the DVX I wanted no more then 3 reds to light up, but this stuff is totally different. -12db is a hot signal that you can still make great use of in your NLE.
Click to expand...

This post scares the crap out of me.
 
I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. If you have a digital recorder and mixpre or fp24 there is a switch that turns on a tone... beeeeeep. The tone goes on until you turn it off. When you switch this tone on it send the signal to the recorder and you just adjust the recorder gain until it's also at zero (or a little lower if you want a safety zone)... it couldn't be easier.
 
Droog, you are right i am confused. But note also the level meter on the M-Audio does not have any numbers on it, just a solid column, so there is no way of telling what it is saying. Beside that there are still some bug's with it and due to how the unit is designed when in the audio bag it is hard to see the screen. I would prefer to monitor levels on the mixer.

So????
 
MattinSTL said:
I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. If you have a digital recorder and mixpre or fp24 there is a switch that turns on a tone... beeeeeep. The tone goes on until you turn it off. When you switch this tone on it send the signal to the recorder and you just adjust the recorder gain until it's also at zero (or a little lower if you want a safety zone)... it couldn't be easier.
Click to expand...

You don't understand what I am getting at.

There is a huge difference between analog 0 and digital 0 and they should never be calibrated to be the same. Now unless somebody tells me the micro track is an analog recording device I am going to say that calibrating your micro track to
0 dbu = 0 dbfs is absolutely a bad idea. You said it your self your channel levels are well below 9 oclock, that means your peaks are at what -12 dbu? Thats means you got a lot of program in the noise floor man. Standard procedure is to set 0 dbu = -20 dbfs that way when you get your analog signals to a good level at the mixer you know you are going to be safe on the recorder, if you like live a little hotter set the digital device to -12 dbfs. Though I have yet to work with anyone in the field who wanted anything other that 0 dbu = -20 dbfs.
 
Jon Oskar said:
Droog, you are right i am confused. But note also the level meter on the M-Audio does not have any numbers on it, just a solid column, so there is no way of telling what it is saying. Beside that there are still some bug's with it and due to how the unit is designed when in the audio bag it is hard to see the screen. I would prefer to monitor levels on the mixer.

So????
Click to expand...

Yeah, I hate when companies do that, the DVX is like that too. I imagine you could either get intouch with M-audio and ask somebody there, but I bet somebody on a micro track forum has figured out which little dash is -20. If it were me I would set 0 dbu at about halfway on the micro track, and see how that works, if I felt it was too low or too high I would adjust accordingly. Somebody has got to know where -20 is on that thing, its only time. If somebody figured out where it is on the DVX they will on that thing too.

Remember, the ideal situation is that you want good levels in the analog realm (mixer) and good levels in digital realm (micro track, digital cam). Not one or the other, both. Poor analog levels means noise, poor digital levels means crappy quality. A little distortion in the analog world and nobody will notice, there is no such thing as un noticible distortion in the digital world it always sound terrible.
 
As far as I know you should be fine with running that B6 straight into the mixer. If it has an XLR on it then that would be the intended purpose. Make sure your mixer is set to send phantom power on whatever channel you use. Though the mod sounds kind of sketchy you should be good to go.
 
droog ( friend?) - i don't think you understand that not the meter is what not working here is that the microtrack cant take normal levels that other recorders take , so if you will be hit high peacksignal you will distort , thats why pads need to be inserted o r you have to work with lower signal
the maximum gain the microtrack could get is much lower then what go out from the mix pre
and if you was reed carefully - you could also understand that i get him idea how to find the -20 point on the microtrack pointless scale
now you maybe get why did 302 already come with adjustable attenuation on its output -
 
ExileOnTheMainStreet, can you explain further, and comment on my reply as im not quite understanding? Thank you.
 
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