Less noise with you Canon DSLR (?)

B

BATman

Active member
Hey guys,

I met a photographer a few hours ago at a gathering for an upcoming film festival in Vermont. I told him how I am trying to get less noise on my video (I shoot with a 7D) because I still get noise when shooting indoors with the lowest ISO and 1k lights.

He suggested me to go way up on ISO, but very high shutter speed.

That sounded like baloney to me, but again; I am learning and he is a pro photographer.

Any of you using very high ISO and very high shutter speed to achieve low noise in video?

Thanks very much!! :cool:
 
This is a technique for still photographers. I have heard the same thing. If I recall, the guy I heard it from mentioned something about the cam needs to be in aperature priority to do this. I never even bothered, for video it's a different ball game.
 
For stills it makes sense, because higher shutter speeds usually means crispser images with less blur.
If you are getting alot of noise with low ISO's you might have an issue with your sensor.
 
BATman said:
very high shutter speed to achieve low noise in video?
Click to expand...

Anything other than 180 shutter will create other visual changes in the look of your footage.
25fps @ 50th sec. / 50fps @ 100th sec. are normal 180 shutter settings as it would be with a camera shooting motion picture film.
If you shoot at 25fps with a 500th sec. shutter angle for example, your frames will be very sharp, but with no motion blur the natural look will be gone, and your footage played back at 25fps may look strange.
Try a test on a natural moving object like someone running setting the camera with a 500th sec shutter at 25fps and you will know very quickly the result.
In the case of shooting slow motion with a DSLR at 60fps with a high shutter speed capturing something like water splashing will sharpen the image and look great, especially since water will rise up, and eventually gravity will stop it in space while it changes direction back down. In this situation the high shutter speed may work out well.
Again you must test to now for sure the result.
 
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It's baloney as you suspected. Keep the ISO as low as possible. May will tell you to stick to the 160/320/640/1250 settings.

If you are shooting at 25fps then use 1/50 shutter speed - end of story...... with one exception..... if you are shooting a scene that you KNOW you will want to slo-mo using something like twixtor then shoot at a higher shutter speed because it will give twixtor better chance of good results, but for regular video 1/50 is it for PAL & 1/24. NTSC needs 1/60.

BTW - I'm also a professional photographer and I still keep ISO low there too! While you can certainly get away with higher ISO in photos (because you only need to worry about the noise in one frame and not the changing noise in consecutive frames) the only reason to shoot higher ISO is if you are going under expose if you don't. Under exposing and then pushing in post is where the noise comes in.
 
Exact said:
Under exposing and then pushing in post is where the noise comes in.
Click to expand...

Extracting for emphasis. Not trying to be too harsh or generalize too much but this is where a lot of noise is created (aka user error).
 
Thank you guys!!

Thank you guys!!

NoahK said:
Um no. More ISO=more gain=more noise.

Noah
Click to expand...

That is what I've always knew... thanks Noah

maranfilms said:
This is a technique for still photographers. I have heard the same thing. If I recall, the guy I heard it from mentioned something about the cam needs to be in aperature priority to do this. I never even bothered, for video it's a different ball game.
Click to expand...

I thought so, it is good to hear I am not 'that' crazy... thank you maranfilms!!

yrpfilms said:
For stills it makes sense, because higher shutter speeds usually means crispser images with less blur.
If you are getting alot of noise with low ISO's you might have an issue with your sensor.
Click to expand...

You know, that is a great point. I didn't think about that. But could be. I do not get a LOT of noise, but I get a decent amount. I was shooting at 200 ISO with a 70-200mm at f/4 ...


koffee412 said:
are you shooting native isos?
Click to expand...

Well, I am not sure; but ISO 200 was the lowest my camera allowed me with the settings mentioned above. I was also 1920x1080 30p using the Cinestyle profile from Technicolor.


ROCKMORE said:
Anything other than 180 shutter will create other visual changes in the look of your footage.
25fps @ 50th sec. / 50fps @ 100th sec. are normal 180 shutter settings as it would be with a camera shooting motion picture film.
If you shoot at 25fps with a 500th sec. shutter angle for example, your frames will be very sharp, but with no motion blur the natural look will be gone, and your footage played back at 25fps may look strange.
Try a test on a natural moving object like someone running setting the camera with a 500th sec shutter at 25fps and you will know very quickly the result.
In the case of shooting slow motion with a DSLR at 60fps with a high shutter speed capturing something like water splashing will sharpen the image and look great, especially since water will rise up, and eventually gravity will stop it in space while it changes direction back down. In this situation the high shutter speed may work out well.
Again you must test to now for sure the result.
Click to expand...

Well, it is good to know. I've always been shooting with different shutter speeds just to adjust to the particular situation. But I will keep that in mind from now on. I did some slow motion test at 720p 60fps and did use 1/1000 or more to allow pixel motion in Motion to get better 'in between' frames. But I will keep that number in mind from now on, Thanks Rockmore!!

Exact said:
It's baloney as you suspected. Keep the ISO as low as possible. May will tell you to stick to the 160/320/640/1250 settings.

If you are shooting at 25fps then use 1/50 shutter speed - end of story...... with one exception..... if you are shooting a scene that you KNOW you will want to slo-mo using something like twixtor then shoot at a higher shutter speed because it will give twixtor better chance of good results, but for regular video 1/50 is it for PAL & 1/24. NTSC needs 1/60.

BTW - I'm also a professional photographer and I still keep ISO low there too! While you can certainly get away with higher ISO in photos (because you only need to worry about the noise in one frame and not the changing noise in consecutive frames) the only reason to shoot higher ISO is if you are going under expose if you don't. Under exposing and then pushing in post is where the noise comes in.
Click to expand...

Yes, I was watching the GREAT tutorial at Lynda.com with Douglas Kirkland and he mentioned he always shoots around the 2500 range, because he doesn't want to risk 'the perfect' pictures if it came 'shaky' with a lower shutter speed.

Great and very inspirational tutorials, I recommend you all 3 of them!!

maranfilms said:
Yeah, I thought it seemed odd to me to. I try to use the lowest possible iso.
Click to expand...

Agreed! Thanks again maranfilms!

John Froton said:
As another option, you might also check out Neat Video (The still image version is Neat Image) which is a software based noise elimination/reduction software that many say works very well


http://www.neatvideo.com/


http://www.neatimage.com/

Also, I would suggest you use a fast lens if you are not already doing so :)
Click to expand...

I have heard of Neat Video. I will buy it once when I switch over CS5.5 since I am still in CS4 and do not want to have to buy the plug in again. Not sure about Final Cut X yet. I will wait for more people to get it. It should be up for sale now, am I right?

Thanks to ALL for such a valuable input! Appreciated!
 
I think the photographer you talked to had some things mixed up. High iso noise (or grain as we used to call it lol) and motion blur induced by either a moving subject in front of the lens or camera shake induced by the operator of said lens.

In photography you want to keep your iso as low as possible (unless you want grain/noise for artistic purposes or you have no choice sports, fast action without the possibility of flash lights)

Low ISO will give you smoother images period. High shutter speed has no relation to noise. It just allows you to freeze action and reduce camera shake when not using a tripod.
 
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