Lav mics...

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Morox, sorry to tell you that Azden are rubbish. Any decent dual "receiver" alone is going to set you back around $2k.

Have you thought about just running two singles?
 
Noel Evans said:
Morox, sorry to tell you that Azden are rubbish. Any decent dual "receiver" alone is going to set you back around $2k.

Have you thought about just running two singles?
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What do you mean? Two receivers with a mic for each? I'm actually just learning about lav's, I don't really know a whole lot about them. Or one receiver with two mics (can i do this)? Please enlighten me, haha.
 
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Morox said:
What do you mean? Two receivers with a mic for each? I'm actually just learning about lav's, I don't really know a whole lot about them. Or one receiver with two mics (can i do this)? Please enlighten me, haha.
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The basics:

You can only have one transmitter per receiver. In other words, two transmitters on the same frequency will simply fight for control, and the receiver will here nothing but the sounds of RF battle.

Most systems consist of one transmitter and one receiver. However, there are dual systems out there. These systems may look like two transmitters with one receiver, but that one receiver is, in fact, two receivers housed in a single chassis. This dual unit will have two outputs, one for each receiver, and the two transmitters will run on separate frequencies.

You should also be aware that "lav" and "wireless" are two completely separate things. The lav is the microphone, and cannot run without a wire. Now, it can be wired to plug into an XLR line for hard-wired runs to mixers, or it can be wired with a connector for a wireless transmitter. The wireless system for these lavs features a belt-pack transmitter.

Azden wireless systems are rubbish. They have poor signal stability and generally don't sound that great. You'll find yourself struggling to make them work for you.

The least expensive dual-receiver system that you can expect to perform for you is the Audio-Technica 1800 system. But I'd really think about the need for a dual system. If it's for on-camera mounting and you need to conserve space, then get one. But if you're more likely to use these as part of a larger audio kit, and you think you might find it handy to be able to split the systems out for use in two places, then get the single systems.
 
C2V said:
The basics:

You can only have one transmitter per receiver. In other words, two transmitters on the same frequency will simply fight for control, and the receiver will here nothing but the sounds of RF battle.

Most systems consist of one transmitter and one receiver. However, there are dual systems out there. These systems may look like two transmitters with one receiver, but that one receiver is, in fact, two receivers housed in a single chassis. This dual unit will have two outputs, one for each receiver, and the two transmitters will run on separate frequencies.

You should also be aware that "lav" and "wireless" are two completely separate things. The lav is the microphone, and cannot run without a wire. Now, it can be wired to plug into an XLR line for hard-wired runs to mixers, or it can be wired with a connector for a wireless transmitter. The wireless system for these lavs features a belt-pack transmitter.

Azden wireless systems are rubbish. They have poor signal stability and generally don't sound that great. You'll find yourself struggling to make them work for you.

The least expensive dual-receiver system that you can expect to perform for you is the Audio-Technica 1800 system. But I'd really think about the need for a dual system. If it's for on-camera mounting and you need to conserve space, then get one. But if you're more likely to use these as part of a larger audio kit, and you think you might find it handy to be able to split the systems out for use in two places, then get the single systems.
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Well, I need two lavs with the two wireless transmitters and one receiver. I think this makes sense? Is it possible to get something like that in the $500 range that will be decent?
 
Morox said:
Well, I need two lavs with the two wireless transmitters and one receiver. I think this makes sense? Is it possible to get something like that in the $500 range that will be decent?
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As stated by C2V, you must have a receiver for every transmitter, unless the receiver is dual channel. And again a solid dual channel receiver is not cheap, no where near $500.
 
Morox said:
Well, I need two lavs with the two wireless transmitters and one receiver. I think this makes sense? Is it possible to get something like that in the $500 range that will be decent?
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Again, you cannot have two transmitters and one receiver. Not for $500. Not for $3000. Why are you trying to do this?

The systems that are able to run two transmitters have two independent receivers... whether the two receivers are separate, or are housed together in a single chassis. But they still require two audio inputs of your mixer or camera (though many of the dual-channel receivers have a "mix" feature that will send both receivers' signals through one common audio output).

But also note that the lav mics that come as stock with these systems are generally not the best. So factor in another $300 per system for a good lav (Countryman, DPA, Sanken, Tram).

And again, the Audio Technica 1800 series is the lowest you can go to get halfway decent results. That's around $1200 for the system. But the more you spend on wireless, the better (generally) your results will be. Lectrosonics, as Dan pointed out, is the creme of the crop. And if it's for a specific project and you can't afford to buy what you really need... rent.
 
C2V said:
Again, you cannot have two transmitters and one receiver. Not for $500. Not for $3000. Why are you trying to do this?

The systems that are able to run two transmitters have two independent receivers... whether the two receivers are separate, or are housed together in a single chassis. But they still require two audio inputs of your mixer or camera (though many of the dual-channel receivers have a "mix" feature that will send both receivers' signals through one common audio output).

But also note that the lav mics that come as stock with these systems are generally not the best. So factor in another $300 per system for a good lav (Countryman, DPA, Sanken, Tram).

And again, the Audio Technica 1800 series is the lowest you can go to get halfway decent results. That's around $1200 for the system. But the more you spend on wireless, the better (generally) your results will be. Lectrosonics, as Dan pointed out, is the creme of the crop. And if it's for a specific project and you can't afford to buy what you really need... rent.
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I meant in a single chassis, sorry for the confusion.

Also, renting is not an option. There is NOTHING in the area of where I live. I literally have to drop my money on something I can't even test. So I guess my best option for this is to buy two separate units? Seems like it would be cheaper than going for a 2 in 1 single chassis unit?
 
Morox said:
I meant in a single chassis, sorry for the confusion.

Also, renting is not an option. There is NOTHING in the area of where I live. I literally have to drop my money on something I can't even test. So I guess my best option for this is to buy two separate units? Seems like it would be cheaper than going for a 2 in 1 single chassis unit?
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any of the bigger shops will ship rentals to where ever..
trew,coffey, tai...
 
Stupid question, but what are my options to record the audio onto? Is it XLR into my camera or mixer from the receiver? How does it work?
 
I'm assuming that your camera has two XLR ins, which can be switched to mic or line level. With these you can:

Plug two wireless receivers into your camera, using the mic-level in.

Plug your wireless receivers into a mixer, then send line-level from your mixer to the camera.

And to second Rippie's suggestion, many of the big companies will ship rentals pretty much anywhere.

http://www.trewaudio.com/rentals/
 
Not to hijack the thread but my mint as new "absolutely NOT rubbish" Azden 320 ULT dual channel Wireless Lav set is available. It cost me around $900 new. I do prefer the sound from my Sennheiser EW100 but interference wise, it's the same, clear crisp reception as the single channel Sennheiser. True, the Azden is PLASTIC and they are a bit bulkier but at my low price how can you go wrong ;) ? Besides, channel interference is about channel selection more than anything else.
 
Morox said:
I meant in a single chassis, sorry for the confusion.

Also, renting is not an option. There is NOTHING in the area of where I live. I literally have to drop my money on something I can't even test. So I guess my best option for this is to buy two separate units? Seems like it would be cheaper than going for a 2 in 1 single chassis unit?
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Two separate transmitter/receiver pairs will give you more flexibility. If you were thinking of the single, dual channel receiver for the convenience of its physical mounting on the camera, you can get mounting kits that let you put two receivers together on the camera. But it's not likely to save you any money and you're certainly not going to get 'em under $500 total. The standard entry level for serious work is the Sennheiser G2 series and they'll set you back about $650 for each transmitter/receiver pair. Mid-range upgraded mic capsules to replace the so-so mics that come with them will add about $300 each.

$500 is just not going to be in the cards (adding my voice to those who caution against anything Azden). One channel of Sennheiser G2 runs about $650, so two channels using Sennheiser will run you about $1300 plus the replacement mics. An Audio Technica dual-channel receiver plus two transmitters will also run you about $1300 plus the replacement mics. Lectrosonics dual-channel receiver plus two transmitters will run you about $4000 or so.

You don't absolutely HAVE to get the upgraded mic capsules so let's say the minimum budget you're looking at to get decent gear is in the vicinity of $1250 to $1500.
 
you can get sennheiser g2s of fleabay from a reputable dealer for only $449 new and around $380 second hand sometimes in the marketplace. I had one shipped to australia from the fleabay seller and had no probs. best bang for your buck when it comes to sound quality.
you can also get a bargain when it comes to mke-2 gold lav mics. a good upgrade to the standard me-2 which aren't too bad themselves. i got a couple of mke-2 for around $200 from a seller that seems to sell them quite regularly. good considering they cost nearly twice that here for just one mic. i'm quite a cheaparse but i like having adequate audio on my shoots.
 
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If you absolutelly want two lavs into one receiver just plug the lavs into a mixer, mix the signals, send mono feed to one transmitter -> one receiver...

Cheap, and it works. Exept if there are two talents with those lavs who want to run around during the scene...
 
Simply put, $500 is NOT enough to buy you what you're looking for. But even in the middle of nowhere, renting IS an option, pretty much all the big rental houses will ship the gear anywhere you need it.
 
I think this whole argument is a load of crap. Zeph please post some audio from your Azden. I need to hear the absolute crapness of it...I need to hear its unusability for myself. I need to know that it can't be used to make a short for one of the DVX userfest, the same way the xl1 couldn't have possibly been used to make 28 days later. I read over and over again that Sennheiser is the absolute minimum wireless set up (of which I own two sets) & Azden is trash but no one has used any of their new stuff. Can they not redeem their rep? If you have no budget and you are shooting on a whenever the hell I can schedule in the middle of the mid west where your charged a 150 a day for a kino flo diva (trust me that's a real price) then buying your own gear is an absolute...read ABSOLUTE necessity. Sometimes I think people forget what forum this is...DVXuser...what was a descent but cheap mini dv camera for amateur filmmakers and news guys. Everything else you did the best you could with what you had. You Cali residents really take for granted the whole rental thing. That said man get what YOU can afford if it works great if not most places have a 30 day money back guarantee so you can send it back, but personally I don't have 500 a pop for the senn's and another 240-350 for the countryman B whatever the hells, and 1900 for the sound design mixer-ma-callit. WTF are we makin' films or having a gear tea party? Robert Rodriguez would roll over in his 16mm film can reading this bull shi*.
 
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cinebuddy said:
I think this whole argument is a load of crap. If you have no budget and you are shooting on a whenever the hell I can schedule in the middle of the mid west where your charged a 150 a day for a kino flo diva (trust me that's a real price) then buying your own gear is an absolute...read ABSOLUTE necessity. Sometimes I think people forget what forum this is...DVXuser...what was a descent but cheap mini dv camera for amateur filmmakers and news guys. Everything else you did the best you could with what you had. You Cali residents really take for granted the whole rental thing. That said man get what YOU can afford if it works great if not most places have a 30 day money back guarantee so you can send it back, but personally I don't have 500 a pop for the senn's and another 240-350 for the countryman B whatever the hells, and 1900 for the sound design mixer-ma-callit. WTF are we makin' films or having a gear tea party? Robert Rodriguez would roll over in his 16mm film can reading this bull shi*.
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no offence, but looking at your website..seeing the consumer level stuff you sell (or promote, i really cant tell what that site is, since it links to ebay)
of course its in your best interest to put down anyone actually saying something about "quality".
btw, i bought an HF100 just about a year ago for less then what you're charging now. Maybe you should catch up a bit and quit
promoting or selling overpriced gear to the people that cant afford it?

and the "WTF are we makin' films or having a gear tea party? Robert Rodriguez would roll over in his 16mm film can reading this bull shi*." statement?
haha just shows how clueless you really must be.
 
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