Interested in an Ikonoskop A-Cam DII

petermullett

petermullett

Well-known member
I am thinking of getting an A-Cam D!!, most likely new if and when they update the viewfinder's diopter adjuster. But if there's a decent one out there that could be for sale now please get in touch via PM as I may well be interested. Europe or the USA works fine either way.
 
I've come across a total of 2 for sale in the past 4 months, both in Europe. My conclusion is that they are a relatively rare beast and the people that get their hands on one like what they have.
 
Thanks Lyle, yes I am sure you're right, there's few out there as compared with other digital camera choices.....For me it would be a great way to put my rather large collection of great S16 glass back into play as the S16 film gear doesn't go out too many times a year now. I also like the form factor of it, at least without actually having handled one I am assuming I'd like it as I love my Aaton A-Minima and Xtera.
A used European based camera for sale would be good, buying new means +25% VAT and that's too hard to swallow for a camera that will have limited use for me.
If you hear of one I'd appreciate you letting me know...I'm not in a hurry.
Cheers....
 
petermullett said:
Thanks Lyle, yes I am sure you're right, there's few out there as compared with other digital camera choices.....For me it would be a great way to put my rather large collection of great S16 glass back into play as the S16 film gear doesn't go out too many times a year now.
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This is almost entirely my motivation, I estimate I could do at least 90% of my work with a Canon 8-64mm, or even a Zeiss 10-100mm.
 
LyleGorch said:
This is almost entirely my motivation, I estimate I could do at least 90% of my work with a Canon 8-64mm, or even a Zeiss 10-100mm.
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Right, I have the 8-64, the 11.5-138, the Cooke 10.4-52 ( a really sweet lens )....a very sharp Fujinon 10-40 zoom, 2x Optex wide primes plus the set of Mk III Speeds. Too much good glass to leave in the equipment safe when not shooting film. Do you have the A-Cam DII? If so, what's your impressions?
 
petermullett said:
Right, I have the 8-64, the 11.5-138, the Cooke 10.4-52 ( a really sweet lens )....a very sharp Fujinon 10-40 zoom, 2x Optex wide primes plus the set of Mk III Speeds. Too much good glass to leave in the equipment safe when not shooting film. Do you have the A-Cam DII? If so, what's your impressions?
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Cooke 10.4-52! mmmmmm

No, I'm just an ex-Arri SR guy.

There is pathetic little information on the Ikonoskop, really important things, I don't even know if its possible to run a decent off-cam monitor with it. The appeal to me is all the sensor-format, lens mount, ccd characteristics. I think the form-factor is brilliant too. Its been out for what? 3 years? Definitely needs an evolution but there probably isn't enough of a user base to justify it. I keep waiting for the "dream deal" to appear on e-bay, but it seems unlikely.
 
go to their website and read up or e-mail them..they'll hit you back with any info you'd like...but yes, you can use an external monitor via HD-SDI
 
There's also a forum on the Ikonoskop website, which might help answer a few questions. I've found Ikonoskop really helpful and responsive with questions as well. My ACam dII should arrive at the end of next week, so if anyone wants to ask questions after that, I'm happy to help if I can.
 
I have an A-Cam in Los Angeles that I'll be using to shoot a year long documentary, http://resonanceimaging.tumblr.com/ I have it set up almost like an ENG cam with a Cineroid Retina EVF and its amazing for the most cinematic images. For more manageable data loads I convert the DNGs to Cineform RAW and maintain a 12bit Raw workflow at 1/5th the size. Its small, lightweight and very easy to use, expose for the highlights and create dailies in either Resolve or Speedgrade. Resolve now even links the audio files with the video files for output to your NLE.
 
resonance_image said:
I have an A-Cam in Los Angeles that I'll be using to shoot a year long documentary, http://resonanceimaging.tumblr.com/ I have it set up almost like an ENG cam with a Cineroid Retina EVF and its amazing for the most cinematic images. For more manageable data loads I convert the DNGs to Cineform RAW and maintain a 12bit Raw workflow at 1/5th the size. Its small, lightweight and very easy to use, expose for the highlights and create dailies in either Resolve or Speedgrade. Resolve now even links the audio files with the video files for output to your NLE.
Click to expand...

Hi, an interesting post, thanks.
As my search for a used DII continues I am trying to figure out exactly what I need to handle the post side of things with this camera. I have learned that the Macs I have at present will not unfortunately handle the workflow, i.e.: run Resolve, because they are all just a year or more too old and their graphics cards are not powerful or fast enough.
So into the mix I will have to add another computer so that I can process the Raw files from the camera....That's a pain because right now the Macs I have handle all I need by way of post, primarily working in FCP7.

Are there any other solutions that anyone is using other than Resolve? And what reasonable computer solutions are good so that one can play the Raw files in real time?

With my present camera kit, ( the digital kit, not the Aatons that I still have ), I've a PIX 240 that I'd like to see if I can "dual record" from the DII, jam TC so both units are running the same TC, and use the ProRes files from the PIX as proxy's to make an offline cut before going to the Raw camera files..........Rather like cutting the TC window video assist files from the Aaton Xtera and then going to the negative after deciding what works.
The very filmic workflow with the DII is one of the things that attracts me to the camera. You can see that it was developed by "real" film makers.

The post with the DII is still a "grey area" for me and I would be very interested in learning how others have dealt with handling the Raw files without having to invest too much time and money in that process. The relative ease of dealing with the output from my present kit, ( a Sony PMW-F3 with Zeiss CP primes and other S35 glass ), has spoilt me somewhat.....but at the same time I am tired of dealing with the complexity of most of the digital cameras that are around, wanting to get back to the cleaner more filmic way of working......exposure, framing, focus and shoot....then having a decent "negative" to work with in post. I have been looking for the digital Leica M equivalent in the digital motion picture world, the DII delivers that I think.

Also Audio. Again I'd love to know how DII users handle that. With the PIX 240 in the mix, ( if that works with the SDI out of the DII of course ), I'd have the option of recording audio to the PIX and maybe slaving that to the DII with an audio pass-through. If that would work that would be fine with me, again just like double system sound recording with the Aatons. Either the PIX, my OriginC+ or my Clockit TC Slate could master clock the TC......What do you think, would that work?

So, again, if anyone out there knows of, or has a DII that they'd like to sell.....please get in touch, I am interested. US or Europe, either works fine for me.
 
Peter!

If you obtain one, and are in Baltimore, Please! Please! let me come and help out on a shoot or test of the camera.

I've wanted to check one of these out for awhile, but have not come across one.
 
homestar_kevin said:
Peter!

If you obtain one, and are in Baltimore, Please! Please! let me come and help out on a shoot or test of the camera.
I've wanted to check one of these out for awhile, but have not come across one.
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Sure, will do. I will be over here in France for at least another 3 months I think though. I would buy a new D II over here but the +25% VAT tax on everything has put the brake on doing that. If I find a used one in Europe though I will go for it, otherwise I will wait until I return to the US and buy a new one there, it'll be cheaper even with import duties. There is a D II owner in Washington DC who I've been in contact with, he's very enthusiastic about the camera. He too posts here on the DVXUser Forums at times.
 
petermullett said:
Hi, an interesting post, thanks.
As my search for a used DII continues I am trying to figure out exactly what I need to handle the post side of things with this camera. I have learned that the Macs I have at present will not unfortunately handle the workflow, i.e.: run Resolve, because they are all just a year or more too old and their graphics cards are not powerful or fast enough.
So into the mix I will have to add another computer so that I can process the Raw files from the camera....That's a pain because right now the Macs I have handle all I need by way of post, primarily working in FCP7.

Are there any other solutions that anyone is using other than Resolve? And what reasonable computer solutions are good so that one can play the Raw files in real time?

With my present camera kit, ( the digital kit, not the Aatons that I still have ), I've a PIX 240 that I'd like to see if I can "dual record" from the DII, jam TC so both units are running the same TC, and use the ProRes files from the PIX as proxy's to make an offline cut before going to the Raw camera files..........Rather like cutting the TC window video assist files from the Aaton Xtera and then going to the negative after deciding what works.
The very filmic workflow with the DII is one of the things that attracts me to the camera. You can see that it was developed by "real" film makers.

The post with the DII is still a "grey area" for me and I would be very interested in learning how others have dealt with handling the Raw files without having to invest too much time and money in that process. The relative ease of dealing with the output from my present kit, ( a Sony PMW-F3 with Zeiss CP primes and other S35 glass ), has spoilt me somewhat.....but at the same time I am tired of dealing with the complexity of most of the digital cameras that are around, wanting to get back to the cleaner more filmic way of working......exposure, framing, focus and shoot....then having a decent "negative" to work with in post. I have been looking for the digital Leica M equivalent in the digital motion picture world, the DII delivers that I think.

Also Audio. Again I'd love to know how DII users handle that. With the PIX 240 in the mix, ( if that works with the SDI out of the DII of course ), I'd have the option of recording audio to the PIX and maybe slaving that to the DII with an audio pass-through. If that would work that would be fine with me, again just like double system sound recording with the Aatons. Either the PIX, my OriginC+ or my Clockit TC Slate could master clock the TC......What do you think, would that work?

So, again, if anyone out there knows of, or has a DII that they'd like to sell.....please get in touch, I am interested. US or Europe, either works fine for me.
Click to expand...

I process everything on a 2011 Macbook Pro and either edit proxies in Premiere generated in Speedgrade which plays DNGs in realtime unlike Resolve Lite which barely hits 14fps or I convert the files to Cineform Raw in Parallels and then edit and CC with the Cineform masters which play in realtime. Either of these workflows is very simple but would require either a switch to Adobe or upgrading your computer. The Ikonoskop card reader and all their software is Mac only as well.

The SDI can be used with a Pix 240 and that would be a great workflow since you would have your proxies in ProRes already and could do edits and then just relink in Resolve or Speedgrade since they both will match TC, same with audio, just record on the Pix and not have to bother rendering the audio from the DNGs with Ikonoskops Audio Tool software. I use a SD Mixpre straight into the camera for a documentary setup and then just strip out the audio files from the DNGs and drop them in the NLE sequence. Resolve Lite will automatically link these for you as well, just drop all your audio files and video clips into the media pool and right click link audio w video and voila.

The main obstacles are that no one has them so you have to figure a lot of what works for you out in the first couple of weeks with the camera but if you love the image then your put up with some of the quirks and just enjoy the 12bit organic CCD global shutter goodness.
 
Thanks "resonance" for this extremely informative post, it helps me a lot.
I'd already figured that I might have to change NLE with a switch to Abobe, hate the thought of having to leave FCP7 behind but the move may be easier than going to FCPX.....Which doesn't to my knowledge handle DNG files anyway.

As Raw becomes more popular with other digital camera systems, as I think it could well do so, I am hoping that there will be other software solutions down the road.

Another question if I may....How was it importing the DII into the US, did customs sting you in anyway? Any hidden or unexpected charges? I ask because it could influence whether I will in fact just bite the bullet and get one here from Ikononskop before returning to the US. You can PM me on this if you wish, better than open forum.

Thanks again...PM
 
petermullett said:
Thanks "resonance" for this extremely informative post, it helps me a lot.
I'd already figured that I might have to change NLE with a switch to Abobe, hate the thought of having to leave FCP7 behind but the move may be easier than going to FCPX.....Which doesn't to my knowledge handle DNG files anyway.

As Raw becomes more popular with other digital camera systems, as I think it could well do so, I am hoping that there will be other software solutions down the road.

Another question if I may....How was it importing the DII into the US, did customs sting you in anyway? Any hidden or unexpected charges? I ask because it could influence whether I will in fact just bite the bullet and get one here from Ikononskop before returning to the US. You can PM me on this if you wish, better than open forum.

Thanks again...PM
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And just to clarify the vast majority of A-Cam users do use Resolve Lite because its free, matches audio files, and roundtrips with FCP7 are easier. It doesn't have the quirky magenta issue if you use the ACES color space which looks great and you can even do basic editing right in it. I need to work on the road on my laptop so Speedgrade is the only way to have realtime playback and doesn't have any magenta issues. its super easy to just do edits in Premiere and then export an EDL, drop that into the Speedgrade timeline and your clips are assembled with the originals. Also working in Adobe gives you access to Camera RAW and processing in After Effects or LightRoom. Lightroom may actually give the best images but you have to just work using a single frame from a clip, the amount of control is amazing though.
 
resonance_image said:
And just to clarify the vast majority of A-Cam users do use Resolve Lite because its free, matches audio files, and roundtrips with FCP7 are easier. It doesn't have the quirky magenta issue if you use the ACES color space which looks great and you can even do basic editing right in it. I need to work on the road on my laptop so Speedgrade is the only way to have realtime playback and doesn't have any magenta issues. its super easy to just do edits in Premiere and then export an EDL, drop that into the Speedgrade timeline and your clips are assembled with the originals. Also working in Adobe gives you access to Camera RAW and processing in After Effects or LightRoom. Lightroom may actually give the best images but you have to just work using a single frame from a clip, the amount of control is amazing though.
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Hmm....I've recently tried to make Resolve Lite work on the three Macs I have, two MBP's and one 27" i5 iMac. Unfortunately they are all just a little too old apparently, the "youngest" being the 13" MBP of early 2011. When trying to run the programme I get the message that basically tells me that the graphics card isn't up to the task......So I guess I have to add a new computer to the mix when I get the DII. Do you know if the Premiere / Speedgrade route has similar requirements for when you are dealing with Raw DII files?
What laptop do you use?
I would love to stay with FCP7 Studio, but it seems that when I do come to deal with the DII's Raw output I will have to change my NLE.
 
petermullett said:
Hmm....I've recently tried to make Resolve Lite work on the three Macs I have, two MBP's and one 27" i5 iMac. Unfortunately they are all just a little too old apparently, the "youngest" being the 13" MBP of early 2011. When trying to run the programme I get the message that basically tells me that the graphics card isn't up to the task......So I guess I have to add a new computer to the mix when I get the DII. Do you know if the Premiere / Speedgrade route has similar requirements for when you are dealing with Raw DII files?
What laptop do you use?
I would love to stay with FCP7 Studio, but it seems that when I do come to deal with the DII's Raw output I will have to change my NLE.
Click to expand...

"The MacBook Pro contains two GPUs; one for high performance graphics and the other for better battery life. It is essential to enter the Energy Saver preferences, in the System Preferences of Mac OS X, and select the high performance graphics option. Failing to do so will render Resolve unusable. On the mid 2009 model, set the Graphics radio button to Higher Performance. On the mid 2010 and early 2011 models, disable the Automatic graphics switching checkbox."

From the current Resolve Configuration Guide;

MacBook Pro Supported Models

17-inch, Mid 2009, 2.8GHz Core 2 Duo
17-inch, Mid 2009, 3.06GHz Core 2 Duo
17-inch, Mid 2010, 2.53GHz Intel Core i5
17-inch, Mid 2010, 2.66GHz Intel Core i7
15-inch, Early 2011, 2.0GHz Intel Core i7 with 1680 x 1050 display resolution
15-inch, Early 2011, 2.2GHz Intel Core i7 with 1680 x 1050 display resolution
15-inch, Early 2011, 2.3GHz Intel Core i7 with 1680 x 1050 display resolution
17-inch, Early 2011, 2.2GHz Intel Core i7
17-inch, Early 2011, 2.3GHz Intel Core i7



iMac Supported Models

21.5-inch, Mid 2011, 2.5GHz Intel Core i5
21.5-inch, Mid 2011, 2.7GHz Intel Core i5
21.5-inch, Mid 2011, 2.8GHz Intel Core i7
27-inch, Mid 2011, 2.7GHz Intel Core i5
27-inch, Mid 2011, 3.1GHz Intel Core i5
27-inch, Mid 2011, 3.4GHz Intel Core i7

I'd recommend trying the Adobe trial http://www.adobe.com/cfusion/tdrc/index.cfm?product=production_premium&loc=en_us to make sure it works for you.
 
Hi, thanks once again for the wealth of information!
My 17" MBP will run Resolve, but only just. It's the Mid 2009 2.8 steam driven model.
The other MBP is a 13" model, that's a no-go, the 13"'s will not work at all.
The iMac will not either, at 2009 it's too early a model.
So anyway, a new iMac's on the cards, I prefer to cut on the larger screen anyway. I just need to figure out what to use for if / when I will have to download "in the field". Maybe a newer Air will do the trick just for downloading the Raw media so I can clear / re-use the memory cards.
But above all first I have to get a D II......
 
I really wish someone would buy Ikonoskop and 'finish' developing it. This would be ideal for someone like Leica, who haven't impressed anyone with the video capability in the $7k M 240.
 
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