C100: Inexpensive gear recommendations for a documentary

S

SlyCooper

Member
Happy to be a new member of this community.

I recently picked up a C100 (quite an upgrade from the T4i I had been using), and I'm going to start shooting a documentary within the next month or so. All I have right now is:
  • C100
  • EF 24-105mm f/4 L IS USM Lens
  • RODE Videomic Pro

First off, I need a rig. I did some test shooting and I was a little shakier than I would have liked. I like the handheld look for what I'm going for, but the issue comes when I'm adjusting zoom and focus, my left hand has to come off the base during that process so I lose a point of contact. I've looked at rigs online (ones from Zacuto, Shape, and Redrockl), but they are way of my price range - something to build towards, but right now I need an inexpensive rig solution - a complete solution under $500. I have a CowboyStudio shoulder rig, and yeah.. that's just not going to work with the C100.

Renting is possible, but because I'll be filming over the course of at least a few months, I think it makes more sense for me to own whatever gear I'm using, and then transition into freelance work.

Other pieces of gear I need and would be open to recommendations on, and more open to renting these:
  • Tripod with Fluid Head and baseplate (largely just for sit-down interviews)
  • Mic for sit-down interviews (thinking a wired or wireless lav if the Videomic Pro doesn't satisfy)
  • 5-in-1 reflector (seems like a straightforward purchase, no advice needed here)
 
Hi,

I would not buy a ''rig'' for this type of work. My left hand never looses touch with the lens. The base of my C100 sits in my left palm and my fingers are on the lens rings...quite stable like this. If you want more stability, buy a monopod and of course a tripod for interviews.
I suggest a lavalier (wired or wireless...depends on your needs) and a small condenser mic like the Audix SCX1. And a mic stand.
Will you be by yourself or will there be an assistant with you?
 
Doug_EX said:
Hi,

I would not buy a ''rig'' for this type of work. My left hand never looses touch with the lens. The base of my C100 sits in my left palm and my fingers are on the lens rings...quite stable like this. If you want more stability, buy a monopod and of course a tripod for interviews.
I suggest a lavalier (wired or wireless...depends on your needs) and a small condenser mic like the Audix SCX1. And a mic stand.
Will you be by yourself or will there be an assistant with you?
Click to expand...

Hmm, I haven't tried the camera without the grip, I like my hand being strapped into it and that grip is handy for navigating the interface - but I'll see what it's like without it.

My plan is to be as agile as possible and be able to get personal with the subject without them feeling like they can't open up, which means ideally I'll be alone on most of these shoots unless I feel another hand is necessary.
 
SlyCooper said:
Hmm, I haven't tried the camera without the grip, I like my hand being strapped into it and that grip is handy for navigating the interface - but I'll see what it's like without it.

My plan is to be as agile as possible and be able to get personal with the subject without them feeling like they can't open up, which means ideally I'll be alone on most of these shoots unless I feel another hand is necessary.
Click to expand...
Who said anything about removing the grip? I too keep my grip on my C100.
 
The base of the camera sits in my left palm (with fngers on the lens rings) and my right hand is on the side grip.
 
Doug_EX said:
Who said to remove the grip? I too keep my grip on my C100.
Click to expand...

Ah, I read it wrong, I was picturing one hand holding the base while the other is on the lens (which sounded unstable). Maybe I just assumed I couldn't reach my fingers to the rings while still keeping it in my palm, I'll give that a shot.

Do you have any specific recommendations for a wired and/or wirless lav? (keeping within the idea of a smaller budget)
 
SlyCooper said:
Ah, I read it wrong, I was picturing one hand holding the base while the other is on the lens (which sounded unstable). Maybe I just assumed I couldn't reach my fingers to the rings while still keeping it in my palm, I'll give that a shot.

Do you have any specific recommendations for a wired and/or wirless lav? (keeping within the idea of a smaller budget)
Click to expand...
Wireless is far more pratical but cost more. In your case, a wired mic would be better (cashwise) I think. If I were you, I would buy something like a Audix SCX1 (really good mic for the price). It cost about 500$ ...and a good lavalier Wireless kit will cost at least 800-1200$. Depends really how you'll be shooting. Sometimes, having a wireless lavalier is cucial.
 
I use Audix mics and like them but I don't camera mount them. I either boom the Audix on a pole or on a fixed boom stand. Manfrotto makes a combination boom stand that works well and can be setup for solo operation. It's not too expensive and can be used as a regular light stand. If you're going to camera mount, an Audio Technica 875r is a nice cheap mic that works well for ambient sound or sync. I see a lot of solo broadcast stringers who use a wired handheld mic from behind the camera. They can actually keep focus with one hand and hold out the mic with the other. I use a Sennheiser MD46 but the RE50 is also pretty standard for ENG. Both are pro mics that are actually very cheap when compared to condensers.
 
DNN said:
I use Audix mics and like them but I don't camera mount them. I either boom the Audix on a pole or on a fixed boom stand. Manfrotto makes a combination boom stand that works well and can be setup for solo operation. It's not too expensive and can be used as a regular light stand.
Click to expand...
same here...on camera, I mount a Rode NTG3. But when I do a indoor interview, the SCX1 is just about perfect!
 
Is the Rode Videomic Pro really that bad? I know it's not XLR, but I was really just planning on getting a wired or wireless lav for interviews, and the Videomic Pro for everything else. I haven't had any issues with it up to this point.
 
SlyCooper said:
Is the Rode Videomic Pro really that bad? I know it's not XLR, but I was really just planning on getting a wired or wireless lav for interviews, and the Videomic Pro for everything else. I haven't had any issues with it up to this point.
Click to expand...
No, it isn't a bad mic.
 
I use my C100 on a monopod a lot. It takes some doing and isn't foolproof but is better than handholding. For lavs I have both a Sennheiser and/or an Audio Technica (dual mono/stereo). The AT is heavy, but does handle dual channels. The Sennh. is my choice when I only need one mic.

The Rode VMP is only something I use on a HDSLR. It's an ok mic for what it is, but is not a replacement for even a slightly longer shotgun. It also has a noticeable noise floor. Hiss can be quite bad on it.
 
SlyCooper said:
Other pieces of gear I need and would be open to recommendations on, and more open to renting these:
  • Tripod with Fluid Head and baseplate (largely just for sit-down interviews)
  • Mic for sit-down interviews (thinking a wired or wireless lav if the Videomic Pro doesn't satisfy)
  • 5-in-1 reflector (seems like a straightforward purchase, no advice needed here)
Click to expand...

Mics for sit down interviews? A little note from a European perspective.

Radio mics are convenient, but the cheaper ones (Sennheiser G3) do some tricks in compression to get a good signal from mic to camera. They are also sensitive to aggressive radio communications that aren't in the official spectrum. Taxis, police and (in the UK) mobile phones can create splats and interference that can ruin a good recording.

My budgets don't always tend to run to a good Soundie with the latest kit, and don't quite cover renting good wireless stuff unless I take a hit or a gamble. So I'm back to good old fashioned cable on mics for most work.

I like ECM-77 or COS-11 lavaliers for sit-down interviews. I have a 416 which is really, REALLY lovely in many situations, but is just a little odd in sit-down interviews indoors. Following on from my experience with the Neumn TLM103 and large diameter condenser microphones, I'm both recommended (by soundies) and tempted to find a half-inch condenser mic that will work well 12" or so over an interviewee.
 
MattDavis said:
Radio mics are convenient, but the cheaper ones (Sennheiser G3) do some tricks in compression to get a good signal from mic to camera. They are also sensitive to aggressive radio communications that aren't in the official spectrum. Taxis, police and (in the UK) mobile phones can create splats and interference that can ruin a good recording.
...
I like ECM-77 or COS-11 lavaliers for sit-down interviews.
Click to expand...

Completely agree with this. I have and use Sennheiser G1/2 wireless lav kits, and they work, but I only rely on them when the bits to camera are short and retakes aren't a problem, or when wired lavs don't make sense (walking-talking bits, etc). In other sit-down situations, even a cheaper lav like the Sony ECM-44b is more dependable and sounds just as acceptable.
 
Also Matt, aren't you required to pay a license for each wireless microphone you use? I did some shoots outside London last year and the year before and it was quite a process to notify the licensing authority about the frequencies my wireless mics were using and if I recall, it was something like £125 for a one day license for two channels? The good news was that bandwidth was allocated to my production so I didn't have to worry about interference, the bad news is that it was a website and paperwork hassle and was pretty expensive. But then again, everything is outrageously expensive in the UK to me. People who use wireless mics for sit down or stationary interviews are sacrificing a lot of quality for some minor convenience. As the saying goes, even the best $4,000.00 wireless mic sounds worse than the cheapest $25.00 XLR cable.
 
Another mic recommendation, if you're filming IVs indoors. Like Matt, I use a 416, but for indoors/more reflective environments, we've started using a Russian-designed/German-made Oktava MK12-01 with hypercardioid head. It's much more "airy" and natural sounding than a shotgun/interference tube.

We jut did a load of IVs in a glass-walled meeting room (http://www.matobo.co.uk/?p=1088 - 2nd picture), where we've used a 416 and NTG3 many times before - the results were tangibly better, cleaner and needed far less EQ to get a pleasing natural vox. Not bad for a £170 mic package: http://www.oktava-shop.com/Small-and-medium-diaphragm-condenser-mics/Oktava-MK-012-01-movie.html

Also, @puredrifting, £125 for two days sounds a lot - we pay £70 per year, per VHF radio mic - that is for a shared frequency, but we've never had issues - I guess it's pants down for exclusive frequencies.

In case it's useful for future reference - or for anyone else who stumbles on this thread - we get our PMSE licenses directly from Arqiva: http://www.pmse.co.uk/licences.aspx

Cheers,
 
Yes, if the interview is indoors (which mine seldom are) I use wired lavs. But since much of what I shoot is outdoors, I use the Sennheiser. I think that because I live far from a major city, I don't have the interference problems you in London might have. And we don't have to pay for any use of bandwidth. I had a matched pair of Oktava's very nice very 'bright' sound. They were extremely sensitive to any movement or touch. They didn't seem to be something I would use in a boom pole at all. I didn't find them that useful for interviews, personally, and only used them for music recording sessions, eventually selling them. I do agree that mobile phones can affect radio lavs, but I usually ask talent and whatever amounts to a crew to shut theirs off. I've found that there seems to be more interference close in (3 to 5 metres) but really only within 3 metres or less. Obviously, if you can run wired you should, but I mentioned the Senns because I wasn't sure the OP had the budget to buy two sets of lavs.
 
bengiles said:
Another mic recommendation, if you're filming IVs indoors. Like Matt, I use a 416, but for indoors/more reflective environments, we've started using a Russian-designed/German-made Oktava MK12-01 with hypercardioid head. It's much more "airy" and natural sounding than a shotgun/interference tube.

We jut did a load of IVs in a glass-walled meeting room (http://www.matobo.co.uk/?p=1088 - 2nd picture), where we've used a 416 and NTG3 many times before - the results were tangibly better, cleaner and needed far less EQ to get a pleasing natural vox. Not bad for a £170 mic package: http://www.oktava-shop.com/Small-and-medium-diaphragm-condenser-mics/Oktava-MK-012-01-movie.html

Also, @puredrifting, £125 for two days sounds a lot - we pay £70 per year, per VHF radio mic - that is for a shared frequency, but we've never had issues - I guess it's pants down for exclusive frequencies.

In case it's useful for future reference - or for anyone else who stumbles on this thread - we get our PMSE licenses directly from Arqiva: http://www.pmse.co.uk/licences.aspx

Cheers,
Click to expand...

Those shoots were for a large pharma client and we only had one shot to capture a live presentation perfectly so I convinced the client that spending the money for exclusive. Guess I am just spoiled because over here, while we do have to check for frequency allocation to make sure there is available bandwidth, we don't have to pay for a license to use it.

BTW, I checked out your reels on your website, very nice work, you are a talented guy! I will keep you in mind for the next time we need to hire a UK shooter.
 
Thanks for all the help so far. Definitely going with a wired lav. Will use the Videomic Pro for everything else until it proves me wrong.

Will likely grab a proper monopod for the camera as well, I just have one for my DSLR - tried it with the C100 and wasn't exactly centered well.
 
Who's done the C100 continuous auto-focus update? Seems like this would be incredibly beneficial in a run-and-gun doc. $500 is the only sticking point, seems like a lot to ask for just a software update.
 
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