Impact of RED on the competition
- Thread starter Denis Haineault
- Start date
I said message board
...(looks around at all the RED everywhere and the fact that the other makers have been relegated to the bottom of the list and the fact that this is a DVX message board and that someone must be making alot of money...shrugs shoulders..wonders how some peoples opinions can be so easily bought and why to even mention 'footage/buttons/viewfinder/' means being quoted as a non believer like in a witch trial...puts hands in pockets and scuffs ground)
...(looks around at all the RED everywhere and the fact that the other makers have been relegated to the bottom of the list and the fact that this is a DVX message board and that someone must be making alot of money...shrugs shoulders..wonders how some peoples opinions can be so easily bought and why to even mention 'footage/buttons/viewfinder/' means being quoted as a non believer like in a witch trial...puts hands in pockets and scuffs ground)
Aaron Koolen
Well-known member
I've heard it mentioned by many people before, Jim Jannard is a pro viral marketeer. That's why he's got us in on Red now. That's what he want's to do, get us hyped, talking, wanting.
I tend to be very cautious of companies that employ this tactic as often it is presented as an almost philanthropic offering to us when in reality it's about money in the end....BUT...If they were doing this marketing trying to get us hyped about 720p on a 1/3" sensor, we'd go..."Nice try Jim mate, whoopdee doo" because we're not all stupid here, and Jarred Land has sort of staked a bit of his rep on this by bringing RED fully onboard into DVXUser. If it is vapor ware, or doesn't deliver that won't be good.
The thing is, they're releasing specs and they're confident about it, so they have to put their money where there mouth is, and if a camera with RED's touted specs comes in at US$17500 + 10 K for basic lens and recorder...COME ON, it is going to nail every other manufacturer out there really - based on what is currently out there and announced.
The competition, later in the year is going to have to do something, or else they'll be poked. That said, the big guys do have the infrastructure and brand loyalty. There's issues of workflow, support etc that need to be overcome, so it' not going to happen overnight.
Maybe a few years and we'll see no Sony or Panasonic cams
I think RED speaks to the maverick in all of us. There is no WAY IN HELL I can afford a RED, I just will not be able to buy one but I still love the idea of it. I love that Jim comes here and other forums and talks about it. I love that people like Graeme Natress who we all know, is on the team. I love that someone is trying to do something to give the major manufacturers a kick in the arse for dicking us for so many years. We all know they could make better cameras at lower prices if they wanted to. Years ago I was thinking that cameras needed a slot to plug a hard drive in - it's obvious! I knew someone could do it, but noone did cause they're scared and they have investors who need to see profit returns and so the Status Quo needs to be upheld. It's basic business sense. With RED, there is no Status Quo; Jim, at present only has to please himself (AFAIK) - if it falls flat on it's arse, who cares cause he has the money to absorb that loss. This freedom is what can make people take risks, and this sense of breaking new frontiers makes people want to work at companies like RED. Man if I was in the US I'd be banging on the door for a job!
I tend to be very cautious of companies that employ this tactic as often it is presented as an almost philanthropic offering to us when in reality it's about money in the end....BUT...If they were doing this marketing trying to get us hyped about 720p on a 1/3" sensor, we'd go..."Nice try Jim mate, whoopdee doo" because we're not all stupid here, and Jarred Land has sort of staked a bit of his rep on this by bringing RED fully onboard into DVXUser. If it is vapor ware, or doesn't deliver that won't be good.
The thing is, they're releasing specs and they're confident about it, so they have to put their money where there mouth is, and if a camera with RED's touted specs comes in at US$17500 + 10 K for basic lens and recorder...COME ON, it is going to nail every other manufacturer out there really - based on what is currently out there and announced.
The competition, later in the year is going to have to do something, or else they'll be poked. That said, the big guys do have the infrastructure and brand loyalty. There's issues of workflow, support etc that need to be overcome, so it' not going to happen overnight.
Maybe a few years and we'll see no Sony or Panasonic cams
I think RED speaks to the maverick in all of us. There is no WAY IN HELL I can afford a RED, I just will not be able to buy one but I still love the idea of it. I love that Jim comes here and other forums and talks about it. I love that people like Graeme Natress who we all know, is on the team. I love that someone is trying to do something to give the major manufacturers a kick in the arse for dicking us for so many years. We all know they could make better cameras at lower prices if they wanted to. Years ago I was thinking that cameras needed a slot to plug a hard drive in - it's obvious! I knew someone could do it, but noone did cause they're scared and they have investors who need to see profit returns and so the Status Quo needs to be upheld. It's basic business sense. With RED, there is no Status Quo; Jim, at present only has to please himself (AFAIK) - if it falls flat on it's arse, who cares cause he has the money to absorb that loss. This freedom is what can make people take risks, and this sense of breaking new frontiers makes people want to work at companies like RED. Man if I was in the US I'd be banging on the door for a job!
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stokestack
Active member
Greg Lowry said:
Why? Look at digital SLRs or medium-format cameras with the same resolution; they're smaller than this thing.
As far as ergonomics are concerned, they're obviously a big question, but don't overlook the excellent idea of having holes all over the damned place on this camera "cage." It looks like there are places galore to attach braces, handles, counterweights, and accessories of all kinds.
The Erector-set framework seems like a good idea.
rogar-BigGrin(DBG)I don't see Sony moving even a milimeter from it's course because of the RED camera, they didn't change their ways after the DVX or HVX, which came from a competing big company.
I know many camera owners who buy sony thinking it's the best cameras, you can call them uneducated, but it's basically brand recognition power combined with strong PR.
That's how sony pushes technologies down are throats (HDV, and Blu Ray for example)
They don't need to compete with RED because they will still have a big enough market. it will take many years for them to loose enough of it to a company like RED before they change their ways and start thinking about the customers' needs
I know many camera owners who buy sony thinking it's the best cameras, you can call them uneducated, but it's basically brand recognition power combined with strong PR.
That's how sony pushes technologies down are throats (HDV, and Blu Ray for example)
They don't need to compete with RED because they will still have a big enough market. it will take many years for them to loose enough of it to a company like RED before they change their ways and start thinking about the customers' needs
Martin Hill
Active member
I mentioned this in another thread but I'll repeat myself - even if Sony drop the price of the F900 to $15k next year, I would still choose RED. It's so much more future proof, flexible and compact.
The DVX and HVX are 1/3" CCD cameras that, while offering good value for the money, don't compete directly with Sony's upper line in the slightest. The RED cam is a camera with five times the resolution of the F900 and costs five times less. The situation is completely different.EShy said:
Andrew Stefan
New member
stokestack said:
Stas_Tagios
Well-known member
EShy said:
Well, Sony wasn't offering 24p in anything but their $100 grand CineAlta, and wasn't offering any cameras with 1-60 variable frame rates prior to the DVX and the Varicam. Now they are, and I wouldn't be surprised if the popularity of the DVX and Varicam were in part responsible. After all, until the DVX100, 24p in a small, affordable package was just a no-budget film-maker's pipe dream, and Panasonic made it real. RED can do the same for high-end HD shooting.
If RED delivers on all its promises, I can't imagine it not seriously affecting Sony and Panasonic's bottom line with regards to HD shooting. As many others have pointed out, why would you blow $100 grand for a Sony when you can have a RED for $20 grand (or however much more depending on options, but still far lower than a CineAlta)?
I loved the idea of RED when I read about it here and on their site, but after seeing NAB presentation I'm really sold on it (save for the fact that I can't afford one
), not only as revolutionary in design and concept, and absurdly-low priced (compared to other high-end HD cameras), but also as a wake-up call to the rest of the camera-makers, who will hopefully realize that the days of predictable, mostly uninspired, and over-priced high-end HD cameras are numbered.So even though RED is prohibitively-priced for me (especially since I just bought an HVX), hopefully I can still benefit if Panasonic and Sony cut prices on their cameras.