I hate asking a dumb question but...

PerroneFord

PerroneFord

Deals in Lead
Does anyone have an EX1 handy? Or know if the camera can do 24.00fps? I'm wondering if this is an option in the undercrank/overcrank mode.
 
I have the ex1r, so it can't be too different. I know with it you can undercrank @ both 1080/24p and 720/24p and overcrank up to 30fps in 1080/24p and to 60fps in 720/24p.
 
PerroneFord said:
Does anyone have an EX1 handy? Or know if the camera can do 24.00fps? I'm wondering if this is an option in the undercrank/overcrank mode.
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According to the Manual on page 35 it's 23.98 fps. Also, on pages 116-117, under S&Q Mode, it's still 23.98.

It appears the only true full-frame format is 25p for PAL.
 
I have an EX1 (but it's not with me now - I am traveling) and I have not extensively tested it in this mode (something I have been meaning to do) but my theory is that when it's in "PAL Area" mode rather than "NTSC Area" and S&Q are used, you can get a true 24.000fps. Again, I have not tested this, but I think it's worth a try if you are interested in it.

Of course there would be many difficulties in post dealing with the footage to convert it to 24fps. Time code would be off by 4% etc. etc. Probably need to convert your footage to uncompressed frames and back again to QT to get something useful at 24fps, if in fact this works at all.
 
Yea, I got to thinking about how to use the camera in conjunction as a B-Camera that was rolling to film or true 24p like you might see on the RED. If the EX1 could shoot true 24p, then the footage could be synced by visual slate and follow the same workflow, rather than having some stuff come in at 24.00 and B-roll at 23.98.
 
Again, AFAIK, the EX1 DOES NOT SHOOT "actual" 24P (or 24.00FPS). It shoots NTSC 24p, which is actually 23.98FPS).

Only some high-end cameras shoot "actual" 24P, and they're used when a film-out is the destination.
 
That's an interesting supposition on the slow & quick mode though; that might very well yield 24.000 fps. You'd have to adjust it in post though, slowing from 25 down to 24, which is probably the same amount of hassle as having to speed up from 23.976 to 24.000, so ... I guess you could do it, you should just ask the post-prod supervisor which way they'd prefer.
 
That's fine. I've not used S&Q motion yet so I was just curious. Not having to balance 2 workflows would have been lovely.

Thanks everyone.
 
Please excuse my ignorance, but couldn't one use a utility similar to Cinema Tools to simply change the headers from 23.97 to 24? Yes that would put sound at a slight sync risk over a rather long take (hey, it's a B cam and I'd happily shunt audio a little to cure the drift), but at least the two cams could co-exist?

Please, just would like to know - I'm from the land of PAL, so know little of your pains.
 
Tom Roper said:
True 24p *is* 23.976 fps. It's a 'video' spec, not a film spec.
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High-end sony cameras can shoot true 24p. That is 24.000fps rather than 23.976fps.

In practice, this mode is almost never used because of many issues, one of which is live downconversion needed for monitoring.

The EX1 in "24p" mode shoots 23.976fps. The method I described earlier in the thread might yield a true 24.000fps but just has to be tested. I have often postulated that the main reason there is a "PAL Area" vs. "NTSC Area" setting on the EX1 is the retiming of the clock to add/remove the .1% clock pulldown that we Yanks and Japanese need.

The reason this interests me is that I spend most of career doing visual effects on film, which is shot at true 24fps and I am always looking for an inexpensive reference camera which will stay in perfect sync with the film camera. I've used F900s for this and had hopes for the EX1, but never pursued it because the rolling shutter already limits its usefulness for this.

Perrone - why do you want true 24p, just out of curiosity?
 
How does only having 23.976fps on my camera affect me?

What limitations does that put on what I can offer? Is it fine as long as my project ISN'T going on to actual film? Will I run into problems if I do want to go to film?
 
Chadfish said:
How does only having 23.976fps on my camera affect me?

What limitations does that put on what I can offer? Is it fine as long as my project ISN'T going on to actual film? Will I run into problems if I do want to go to film?
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Unless you are doing a film out, it won't matter. And even if you ARE doing a film out, the 23.976 to 24p is a VERY common workflow. The trick is if you are shooting 24.00 with one camera and 23.96 on the other. You can only sync sound to one of them, so the other one is going to be off sync and will have to be resynced in post. Having two cameras that can sync the same is helpful for that scenario.
 
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