Other: I am no longer a Sony fanboi

DLD said:
BMD 4.6 sensor is 4608x2592.
Which doesn't mean two cameras will perform similarly.
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Of course, it is a totally different poject, but this means that there's a quality sensor on LS300: the new sensor is a big upgrade in BMD camera world

Regards

Gary
 
basspig said:
But there is a curious dichotomy between the video and the audio halves of people's interest in cameras. It's like one exists but the other does not and nobody cares.
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You'll find people's interest in audio varies depending on what they do. Most fiction "cinematographers" will probably be in situations where sound is recorded separately and therefore don't really care. However, most "cameramen" (not a derogatory term) working doc or run 'n gun stuff may be recording audio and they WILL care.

Personally I find myself in the former category more often than not, but I do find it important to have working sound on my cameras. If it's there, I want it to be good - and easy to use (I don't like too many options buried in the menu if I know a soundie is going to be recording direct).
 
The Alexa Mini does NOT have good audio because it has a lemo and line-level only input. You need a lot more than a custom cable to deal with that. It really kicked itself out of some possibilities because of that. It's WAY expensive as well.
 
Maybe for better DoF, I should consider a used F3 instead of bothering with 4K. It's cheaper than a 35mm converter now, used, so maybe that's an option. I'm pretty sure F3's audio is good, since it's a CineAlta family product. And I don't have to worry about Premiere CS6 compatibility.
 
I can't imagine anyone would really be needing much more than a guide track feeding into the Alexa Mini audio-wise. I just can't see the kinds of productions that require onboard audio recording having the means to carry an Alexa as part of their camera package.
 
Grug said:
I can't imagine anyone would really be needing much more than a guide track feeding into the Alexa Mini audio-wise. I just can't see the kinds of productions that require onboard audio recording having the means to carry an Alexa as part of their camera package.
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So what about someone who does a lot of different kinds of productions that use an Amira which is around $40K? The Mini would be very cool as a sort of better Red body, plus it has built in ND's, shoots to Prores UHD/HD if you want, is light and easy to rig for shoulder use, can use an Amira EVF natively, goes on a crane, jib, stedicam, in a car, etc etc. I'd love one but I need audio when doing doc style work. The only main downsides I saw, other than audio, was having to velcro a battery plate onto it and come up with a bottom plate. It's carbonfiber so you can't mount things to it normally.
 
basspig said:
Maybe for better DoF, I should consider a used F3 instead of bothering with 4K. It's cheaper than a 35mm converter now, used, so maybe that's an option. I'm pretty sure F3's audio is good, since it's a CineAlta family product. And I don't have to worry about Premiere CS6 compatibility.
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So many people don't realize that the F3 is still the best deal by far, for the price. I have used its audio extensively on feature docs and its played in theaters nationwide with no complaints. Oh yeah and no one ever, including myself, thought the very clean HD it has was any kind of issue when its came to resolution, and Im a picky f***!

Avatar was in IMAX and it was all 1080p. Please remember this.
 
VinceinLA said:
So what about someone who does a lot of different kinds of productions that use an Amira which is around $40K? The Mini would be very cool as a sort of better Red body, plus it has built in ND's, shoots to Prores UHD/HD if you want, is light and easy to rig for shoulder use, can use an Amira EVF natively, goes on a crane, jib, stedicam, in a car, etc etc. I'd love one but I need audio when doing doc style work. The only main downsides I saw, other than audio, was having to velcro a battery plate onto it and come up with a bottom plate. It's carbonfiber so you can't mount things to it normally.
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The new Film & Digital Times issue has a fairly in-depth overview of the accessory line for the Alexa Mini, there'll be baseplate options and a cage available for rigging all of your basic accessories to it, and a rail-mounted battery plate which you can just position at the back of the camera.

I think the Mini would make a brilliant addition to an Amira shoot as a compact b-cam for specific shots. But again, if there's the budget for that kind of camera package, surely having a sound man with you is a given?

And if you really REALLY must have top notch audio feeding directly into a Mini - attaching something like a Sound Devices MixPre-D on to the camera, and feeding the output from that into the camera's Lemo audio port, is not a difficult or complex thing to do (and will give you better results than any built-in preamps ever will anyway).
 
By the time you add all of that stuff, you are into too much Frankin-rigging and the Amira would be easier to use, by far, and more reliable/tougher.

I dont know if you have done feature doc work but you need audio on-camera at all times. A sound guy can't be everywhere. Also they are often not rolling or near by on B-cam footage and surprise interviews, not to mention emergency make-up days or additional shooting days when the budget is wiped out, and so on. I just finished one a week ago and had an entire 4 hour interview to do alone with an F3. I had a shotgun and lav mic plugged into the cam and while its not as good as a pro sound guy would get, it is very usable.
 
VinceinLA said:
The Alexa Mini does NOT have good audio because it has a lemo and line-level only input. You need a lot more than a custom cable to deal with that. It really kicked itself out of some possibilities because of that. It's WAY expensive as well.
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most sound guys can feed in line level - have you heard how bad mic level is on the red epic and all that?
I don't think sound will be a problem on it - also all sound mixers record now with their own mixer and timecode they can jam

and it's nice to have a camera that you can make big or keep small - it makes the mini much more versatile.
I think the Amira is not the way to go.

I'm going to test raw out of the f5, f55, fs7 and then raw out of the blackmagic ursa mini and see who wins.

in the meantime, I love f35 DPX files 12 bit RGB - and I'm staying with it until these cameras die physically on me
 
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steve phillipps said:
I don't see why it's not an easy thing to fix - I don't know if this is right but it seems to me that when the sensor registers clipping in all 3 colour channels it turns them purple??? That's why if you lower your exposure eventually the sun looks normal again. Surely if this is the case a simple couple of lines of code could tell the processor - if 3 channels = clipped, make pixels white, or make same as neighbouring pixels that are not clipped?
Presumably much more to it than that then?

Steve
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Can anyone tell me why I'm wrong and why it's more tricky than that? I'm sure it must be or they would have done it?
Steve
 
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bill totolo said:
I've been reading that it's a BAE Fairchild LTN4625A image sensor.
The literature on the altasens states that it's a rollng shutter sensor only capable of 72fps.
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Maybe that's the confusion between the 4.0K and 4.6K versions?

Because ... well, because BMD also claims 15 stops and there's now way JVC LS300 gets anywhere close to that.
 
eddavid said:
most sound guys can feed in line level - have you heard how bad mic level is on the red epic and all that?
I don't think sound will be a problem on it - also all sound mixers record now with their own mixer and timecode they can jam

and it's nice to have a camera that you can make big or keep small - it makes the mini much more versatile.
I think the Amira is not the way to go.

I'm going to test raw out of the f5, f55, fs7 and then raw out of the blackmagic ursa mini and see who wins.

in the meantime, I love f35 DPX files 12 bit RGB - and I'm staying with it until these cameras die physically on me
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My guess is the CineAlta's win.
Hey, I'm just jealous that you've got two F35's. I don't think there's a single one being used here in Canada.
 
DLD said:
Maybe that's the confusion between the 4.0K and 4.6K versions?

Because ... well, because BMD also claims 15 stops and there's now way JVC LS300 gets anywhere close to that.
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Yes, the 4K and 4.6K are two totally different sensors. The 4.6K is brand spanking new and designed by BMD, the 4K sensor has been out for over a year and has less dynamic range.
 
eddavid said:
I'm back - I love the image out of the f35 - https://www.dropbox.com/sh/seekuaut4iry6an/AADQ0wUn4VvMW2OOeGLrSIlNa?dl=0
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So you own two Sony F35's and you never stopped to look at your footage before you decided to jump ship and preorder 200 Ursa mini's. Im confused by your opening statement.


"I had 2 sony ex1s
still have 3 sony f3s and 2 sony f35s

i also have a sony a7s and a samsung nx1 and 2 red one mx

As of today, I will become a blackmagic fan boi.

To all sony fans, I am sorry about this decision.

But I am putting a lot of money into the URSA Mini as the next great thing.

I tried the fs7 - I like it. I have used the sony f55 a lot.

there is some kind of beauty in the black magic sensor -

I will continue to love my f35s and f3s - but it's time to move on.

Sorry Sony, it's a whole new world

I still love you and will remember all the wonderful times we had together."


So your a Black Magic fan or a Sony fan?
 
I ordered 200 ursa mini 3.6k by accident and had to return them. the UPS woman was not happy. "I said, 4.6k" but she didn't care.
 
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