HVX underwater

T

the frog

New member
Hi everyone,
Has anyone used the HVX underwater yet? Purposely that is? I am an underwater cameraman and it is time for me to switch gear. I have been using a Sony Vx1000 with an Amphibico housing for a couple of years now. Gates (underwater housing manufacturer) is coming out with a new housing for the HVX200 and it looks quite promising especially when coupled to the wide angle lens. I have read so much on the HVX thanks to this resourceful site; it is almost overwhelming. Anyway, I am wandering if the HVX is the right choice. The P2 is not ideal in terms duration, especially down below, but the 60p capabilities compensate for it. What I am most concern with is the light sensitivity at 30p and 60p. How would it compare to my current setup (vx1000)? Any info would be welcome.
Thanks
 
Underwater housing

Underwater housing

I'm in the process of getting an underwater housing for the HVX200...(Gates most likely). I'm working with a swimming instructor to produce swimming training videos and he was so blown away by the 24pn footage at 60fps, he said we had to shoot the next video from underwater that way. (previous shooting has been on PD150/DVX100s). As soon as this happens, I will post some footage shot in an 'Endless Pool'. I also want to use it for some board diving sequences at a college and of course, surf/sailing footage. Not sure of the availability of these yet...

-Bob
 
I have also been looking at the gates housing for the HVX. It looks like a nice rig and they are always built super tough. Optics were an issue in the past but with Fathom imaging they seemed to have solved that problem. I think the biggest concern will be having to surface and change cards unless you are shooting in "pn" modes. I love the HVX for topside but I think that I am going to hold out until the 16GB cards are out. As far as low light shooting, I think it will handle it just fine. Frog, what kind of stuff are you shooting anyway? I would be interested to hear from anyone who gets the Gates set up as I am sure it will be a good one.
 
Hi All,
I'm an underwater cameraman living in Palau. Been working and shooting commercially for 15 years. Clients include Nat Geo, WWF (World Wildlife Fund not the wrestlers!) YLE, Finland - SBS, Korea, Channel 7 Australia etc etc etc. I've also produced my own short films and am currently owning a filming and video concession at a large dive concern in Palau. I have also been looking at the possibilities for taking this camera underwater.

The first issue I address is the short recording time offered by the P2 cards. 16, 32 even 64Gb cards may well be introduced in the future but even with the current lack of stock, and difficulty in obtaining them, for thos wanting to get this baby wet the 8Gb option is all there is at the moment. So that leaves the possibility to look at utilizing the Cineporter with this camera. OK, I've been in touch with Gates, the underwater camera housing company, who are the only serious housing company with a housing available for this camera. IF I wanted to get this camera fitted with a custom enclosure for the Cineporter seeing as there is insufficiene space inside the housing for it the cost to develop a dedicated enclosure was quoted to me personally by John Fullerbrook, the owner of Gates, for a cost of ....... $15,000!!! Thats just the enclosure. More than the camera and housing combined.

Second issue is the lack of a dedicated field monitor of a size sufficient to work with underwater. I don't know about you guys but I like to look at a good well lit monitor when shooting. The Gates does not have any ports to see the camera monitor and neither is their viewfinder magnified so that leaves the requirement for a good 16:9 monitor for the housing. Gates were of the mind that their 4" 4:3 monitors were good enough for the job but I beg to differ. SO I looked at the Marshall V-R70P-HDA 7" monitor and asked for a quote for a housing to accommodate that. Gates again quoted me......$15,000 for the monitor enclosure.

Real term requirement to get this camera wet and be able to work in a way that will not require bounce dives to change out the cards is currently ballpark $43k. Then add all the peripherals for P2 workflow and you get the idea.......not cheap!!!

Just to give you a heads up on the potential costs involved.

I also hang out at an underwater forum, www.wetpixel.com and theer is one of the moderators by the name of Scuba Dru who has taken this camera underwater in a prototype Gates housing and he reported that the imagery he shot with the system seemed a bit soft. That could be down to the optics, maybe the Fathoms I'm not sure and it could also have been down to the issue of the monitor not being of a suitable rez for critical focus issues.

Just to keep you guys up to speed. I am still looking for the potential to adopt this camera as my main recording format but a bit more shopping around and tests need to be done before I part with what is in anyone's books a substantial pile of cash.

Cheers,
Mark.
 
the frog said:
Hi everyone,
Has anyone used the HVX underwater yet?
Click to expand...

I think this is perhaps not a good idea. the salt water might damage the camera. I heard it doesn't work good under water.
 
brianluce said:
I think this is perhaps not a good idea. the salt water might damage the camera. I heard it doesn't work good under water.
Click to expand...

It's fine as long as you plug it in, don't use the battery.. Run an extention cord topside.. Ziplocks are rated 300 meters! Make sure you hear the locking noise on them though..
 
CamDiver said:
Just when I thought I may get some constructive response to my posting.......LOL
Click to expand...

Crazy, ehhh?

I can not hold my breath for more than :30 secs at a time
anyway so 4 min record time is plenty.

But really, I guess with a big HD camera, VariCam, CineAlta
there are housings built that will work with these in longer
dives. Its no different than most extreme productions,
you are usually there and have a budget or you probably
would not be there?? The HVX opens up the playing field to allow no budget, spec work that otherwise would have been done with a DVX or other SD camera. People have been strapping the HVX to their hoods and driving around, something they would probably not do with a $65,000 Varicam. Once an in-expensive underwater housing
gets built for the HVX I am first in line for one.
Next will be a nose-mount for a surf board!!

Mike Schrengohst
www.MotionZoneHD.com
 
Justin Marx said:
.. Ziplocks are rated 300 meters! Make sure you hear the locking noise on them though..
Click to expand...


Like P2 cards, ziplocks are another expense associated with the HVX200 and point to yet one more reason why I prefer the JVC HD100.

To say the HVX200 is a 5300 dollar camera is really disingenuous.
 
I shoot a lot of wakeboarding (it's like snowboarding/skateboarding behind a ski boat). Anyways, I have a HVX200 and would like to shoot riders jumping the wakes over me, while I am in a tube being pulled by the same boat. So basically, I am needing something for splash-proof shooting. I don't plan on submerging the camera underwater. Of course there is always the slight chance that I might drop the camera. Anyways, is the Gates my best option for this? It seems almost like overkill, for what I need.
 
CamDiver,
That is interesting that you heard the underwater footage that was shot with the gates prototype was a bit soft. Who knows how the shoot went but it could come back to the fact that good focus with HD is critical. I don't know if the Gates is equipped with a focus assist button on the housing but that might be something to consider. Your down 80 feet peering through the viewfinder and it might be hard to tell if that nudibranch is really sharp or not when just looking through the back port.
As far as decking out the housing to accommodate the Cineporter, that does seem a bit steep. Who knows what that would do to the balance of the housing as well. Could also sink like a rock? Being a little negative isn't bad but you don't want to be fighting the thing when shooting.
For recording times, I think that two 16GB cards would be practical for underwater recording times. A solid 30 minutes of HD isn't bad. I guess we'll just have to be a bit more selective with the shots but I could live with half an hour of shooting.
 
the frog said:
I am an underwater cameraman and it is time for me to switch gear.
Click to expand...

Unless you need 24p down there I'd be testing the Sony ZR1 too. You can get to +12db at about the same noise level as the HVX... net result being more light sensitive. There are some other smaller cameras worth checking out too.

I've heard James Cameron is going to be doing a HUGE underwater spectacle after he completes his current movie. They are testing the F-950 at 60p for the underwater stuff (yes via cables) and Film for the rest of the movie. Cameron's attitude seemed to be - once you're under water it's a different world, so the different frame rate feeling won't matter. If a shark whizzes by do you really want to be at 24p? I'm not so sure.

I guess if you could get the Cineporter going then you could have the HVX at 60p and that might end up really cool. I'd still be testing for noise levels etc. The HVX isn't at it's best in murky light conditions. If you're doing closeups with a lot of light you'll probably be good.

TEST! :-)
 
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nice

nice

brianluce said:
Like P2 cards, ziplocks are another expense associated with the HVX200 and point to yet one more reason why I prefer the JVC HD100.

To say the HVX200 is a 5300 dollar camera is really disingenuous.
Click to expand...

LOL!
 
MrPolarBare said:
I shoot a lot of wakeboarding (it's like snowboarding/skateboarding behind a ski boat). Anyways, I have a HVX200 and would like to shoot riders jumping the wakes over me, while I am in a tube being pulled by the same boat. So basically, I am needing something for splash-proof shooting. I don't plan on submerging the camera underwater. Of course there is always the slight chance that I might drop the camera. Anyways, is the Gates my best option for this? It seems almost like overkill, for what I need.
Click to expand...

Dude.. what happens when you fall off? Shoot from the boat, or get a housing..
 
Exactly. I have shot it a few times.. and surfing too in my old home-made housing that worked great.. but would be too small for the HVX. You need a serious decidated and tough housing for all water stuff.

The bags are really only good for mild water action and not for extended times.


Also, I was thinking that the low record times wouldn't be that big of a deal as I would rarely shoot more than 20 minutes of footage without a break.. and diving for more than 45 minutes is not something I like to do either.


I found those other options. I personally... I know this is odd... plan on buying the single chip sony HD camera and the equinox housing. I can get both for less than 3K and I won't be sweating the camera as much... and in HD underwater... I think the single chip would be pretty sweet...

I say that now, but I know when the HVX is paid off and under insurance.. I'll be getting a housing for that too.
 
Thanks for the replies.
Concerning the P2 issues: Getting four 8gb cards would help with the workflow and give a decent amount of footage on one dive. Bigger cards will come along so with time things will get better. Of course there is a price issue that is starting to freak me out a bit. But then again, it all depends on the job and on how well it pays. I am also thinking that an external hard drive could be encased and mounted below the housing. I'm just thinking out loud here, but some of these battery housing are pretty big and they might be able to house a drive. Amphibico makes a flat looking one for its set of lights. I am sure Gates could install a bulkhead connector on the housing for a marginal price. Splicing teh cable could be tricky but not impossible. It would be an interesting setup. One thing for sure, when you are out on a Zodiac filming whalesharks in the middle of the ocean you got to think about the workflow. Things can get crazy quickly.

Concerning the zip-lock bag idea: Not sure about that! But if you are doing surface work you might want to use the professional version of the zip-lock, the Ewa Marine waterproof bags. I've used it in my early career with the vx1000 and it worked well. I am not sure if they make one for the HVX yet. Ideally, you would like to have a wide angle lens underwater and this waterproof bag is quite limiting, but it is also quite cheap in comparison.

Concerning the soft look: Well, it all depends on how soft the image is. I'm thinking the tolerance to this is quite subjective, but it would be nice to see that footage. My idea is to get HD quality underwater shots. The whole setup will be costly, the housing and the wide angle lens will be close to $12 000.00; the lights will add to that. By the way anyone uses the Halcyon 50 watts and/or 200 watts HID? Anyway you don't want to spend a fortune for a poor image quality.
 
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