HVX PAL vs HVX NTSC

well both. any camera that shoots 30fps (or 60i) how would you do all that 'pull down' stuff to get it to 25fps (50i)?

(this is not including the 24fps cameras that repeat frames to make 30fps)
 
It's not easy. It involves blending fields together, synthesizing new fields, and the better hardware includes motion prediction algorithms and such... getting a quality conversion from 50i to 60i is not easy nor cheap. There are easy/cheap ways to do it, but not necessarily quality.

Which is why the conversion from 24p to 25p is so preferred -- that's a frame-accurate freebie compared to the mess of trying to convert between 50i and 60i, or the near-impossibility of converting 30p to 25p.

However, I should say that I haven't kept up on this, so it's possible there are newer, better solutions available now... if you want to try the software way, you can download DVFilm.com's Atlantis software.
 
Barry_Green said:
I would presume they'd shift the 25p to 24 and then add pulldown to make it 60i. I would think a 50i to 60i conversion would likely look awful when the original is 25p and not 50i.
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So, if you are shooting for tv in a PAL country, but you want to sell the content to NTSC countries (for tv) also, what should you do? Shoot 50i on the PAL version, or buy the NTSC version and shoot 24p then convert back to 25p for tv in PAL countries?

I was so hoping HDTV would get rid of this PAL/NTSC crap! Sounds like it's going to be a pain in all our arses for many years to come.
 
You can't easily make one product that works cleanly in both territories. You just can't.

So, you pick the one that's most important to you, and optimize for that. If your home market is more important, shoot in 50i or 25p. If the American market is the biggie, shoot in 60i or 24p. You can easily convert between 24p<->25p, that's no hassle and provides the highest-quality conversion (but you have to stretch the audio). Converting 50i<->60i is more difficult, but it's done every day, you just may have to pay some bucks to get it done right. 24p<->25p can be done easily and flawlessly in Vegas, I'm assuming other editors can handle it as well.
 
Shoot 25P then convert to 24P for the NTSC version.

25 and 24 are the best mastering formats. From there you can go everywere.

Even if you shoot for the silverscreen in europe I still would recommend shooting 25P because

1. It will be released later on TV and DVD

2. It will be on TV and DVD for a much longer time than it will be on the silverscreen.
 
Not sure how but one way would be to do it backwards. 30->24 combining frames then speed up 4% to 25

Or blend every 5th and 6th frame.
 
I was so hoping HDTV would get rid of this PAL/NTSC crap! Sounds like it's going to be a pain in all our arses for many years to come.
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Powers of the word, hear this wisdom words. We can't stand PAL and NTSC if the final resolutions will be 1080p24 and 720p60!!!!
 
In the future it will not matter. We will have TV sets that can show any res at any framrate just like we wathing movies on the computer today.

The movie will just tell us in the beginning that it will be 1080P 24FPS PAR133

And the TV will take and show a movie with 1440*1080 24 frames/second at a pixel aspect ratio of 1,33.

PAL and NTSC will live on because a lot of source material was/is recorded like that.
 
Earlier in the thread it was stated that 25p will have a higher resolution than 24p. Is that correct? And if so wouldn't that be a reason to choose 25p as the mode to shoot in for making a movie?
 
In SD mode it does have some added vertical resolution - I think it increases from 480 to 576 pixels.

I'm pretty much down with using 25p now, but I'll be damned if the PAL camera variable framerates won't have 60 in 'em. That'd start a riot - a whole 10 frames a second of perfectly good slow motion material nixed?! 50 frames is ok but, you know, the more the better :)

(Gotta get me one of those 1500-1000000fps scientifical cameras... I'd just spend days breaking things in front of it :) shh... this is my lottery-winning dream)
 
I was actually referring to MovieSwede's statement earlier in the thread:

MovieSwede said:
You guys forget that the Pal version of the HVX vill have different chroma-res. As I understand the pal will have chroma of 1440*1080 vs the NTSC that will have 1280*1080. Because the pal has 100mbs/50i vs NTSC 100mbs/60i signal. that gives 4 mbs per frame vs 3,33 mbs per frame if you shoot progressive.
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As I understand it, it relates to the fact that you can fit more information per frame into a 50i stream than you can into a 60i stream of the same bit rate (ie 100mbs). So the codec allows a higher resolution in the 50i strean and since 25p fits exactly one frame into two fields this translates to 25p also being higher resolution.

Can anyone clarify if this is true and if in practice it means that you end up with a better image from 25p than you would from 24p? Maybe Jan or Barry?
 
Barry_Green said:
As far as I know, the 50i camera will not do 24p in any mode. It does 25p. The 60i camera won't do 25p, it'll do 24p and 30p. Similar to how the DVX works.
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Hello - I'm watching this lively forum for months now and this is my first post. Together with two US friends we are discussing the idea of a common HD project (shootings in US and Europe). We all will probably have a HVX200 by then - the US guys 60i's and myself a 50i version. What mode should we choose and how will it fit together in post production?
- JJ -
 
Shoot 24P in the US and 25P in europe and hope you dont have a phone conversion scene in the movie. ;)

You should be more worried that you dont light the movie the same way. Your personal skill will effect the movie more than the framerate.
 
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