HPX170 First Look

[Jan_Crittenden]

By the way, I am aware that the HVX200A uses the same DSP and chip as the 170. I just don't know what smear resistance is. I'm not stating that is an advantage over the HVX200A.

Smear is when a CCD hits a very bright light source and it causes a vertical line through the picture. There is a new circuit that controls this artifact better than before and it is isn the 200A and the 170.


Hope this helps,

Jan

 

[Jan_Crittenden]

I have been looking around on the forums and still haven't found out if the 170 will be 1080p capable (not just 1080i). anyone?

Hi,

It will do 1080, in both 30 frames and 24 frames. In the 24, it has to do a pull-down as it will do progressive frames as a segmented frame recording. No worries there, we have been doing this with the DVX and the HVX for years, they really are progressive frames.

Thansk,

Jan

 

[Jan_Crittenden]

-What does it mean better "smear resistance"?

Explained below

-And with the LCD flip, does this mean I can get a 35mm adapter w/o having to spend a load of money for a a flip module?

This is true. Still will have to flip it on the timeline, but for composition, the LCD will be right side up.

-is it firm as Jan said that it will be coming out this September?

Yes. Should have one at HD Expo in Chicago next week and at Cine Gear in LA, come on by and check it out.


Thanks,

Jan

 

[SPZ]

Can we expect a "Barry Green hands on" next week?

Main concern is, of course, the 72mm lens vs the HVX200a lens, since, internally, both share the same CCD's...

 

[Concept89]

Thanks a bunch for your immediate responses, Jan! However, I'm still not understanding the idea of the flip situation. So the camera will show the image right side up, but when you import the footage onto a timeline, it would turn up upside down, therefore requiring you to flip the image? How would you go about doing that on FCP?

Now, if I were to use an adapter with a built in flip module, say, the Letus Extreme, how would that affect the LCD image and recorded image, if not at all?

Again, thanks, you helped clear many things up for me!

 

[mvb]

Thanks a bunch for your immediate responses, Jan! However, I'm still not understanding the idea of the flip situation. So the camera will show the image right side up, but when you import the footage onto a timeline, it would turn up upside down, therefore requiring you to flip the image? How would you go about doing that on FCP?

Now, if I were to use an adapter with a built in flip module, say, the Letus Extreme, how would that affect the LCD image and recorded image, if not at all?

Again, thanks, you helped clear many things up for me!

Raylight MXFX can be used to flip images, before editing, without loss of quality and retain metadata: http://dvfilm.com/MXFX

 

[Cees Mutsaers]

Hi Jan,

Is there any change that you can do a quick side by side comparison between the 170 and 200A regarding the low light difference if any? Maybe this time you are allowed to dig into the menue to see if there are more new features incorporated like Pal/NTSC switchablility. I won't ask about the LCD again ))

.

Yes. Should have one at HD Expo in Chicago next week and at Cine Gear in LA, come on by and check it out.

 

[Barry_Green]

Can we expect a "Barry Green hands on" next week?

No doubt. I'll have all the lowdown.

 

[Barry_Green]

So the camera will show the image right side up, but when you import the footage onto a timeline, it would turn up upside down, therefore requiring you to flip the image?

If your adapter renders the image upside down, then the camera will record it upside down. The 170 has the ability to flip its LCD, so you could monitor the image right-side-up even though it's being recorded upside down.

Now, if I were to use an adapter with a built in flip module, say, the Letus Extreme, how would that affect the LCD image and recorded image, if not at all?

I strongly encourage everyone to shoot rightside up. The Letus Extreme shoots rightside-up, so you don't have any hassles. You record the footage the right way, and you monitor the footage the right way. Everything just works the way you'd expect it to. I think at this point that every major adapter manufacturer has a rightside-up adapter.

For those who want to use an upside-down adapter, that's what the LCD Flip feature is for.

 

[Jan_Crittenden]

No doubt. I'll have all the lowdown.

Hi, Barry won't have everything but will have a goodly supply. For example the 50/60Hz question. This is still being hammered out. This is all about gray market issues. World money markets are not fair and customers pay for trips abroad with what they save in gray goods. The tough part is that the manufaturer is held responsible to try and support the product in the money market where it resides. This isn't right in that the money to pay for that support went to the country that sold the gray product. And while I think I can point to more gray cameras than any other country combined, it is the smaller countries that need the support of local sales. It is a very volatile issue.

Barry is also working with a prototype, it is not a production line sample. But we got some good stuff today and I am sure without my bugging him tomorrow, he will make greater progress. ;-) I really think this is a very nice little camera and with acouple of tweaks here and there will be great.

Best,

Jan

 

[Kholi]

Hi, Barry won't have everything but will have a goodly supply. For example the 50/60Hz question. This is still being hammered out. This is all about gray market issues. World money markets are not fair and customers pay for trips abroad with what they save in gray goods. The tough part is that the manufaturer is held responsible to try and support the product in the money market where it resides. This isn't right in that the money to pay for that support went to the country that sold the gray product. And while I think I can point to more gray cameras than any other country combined, it is the smaller countries that need the support of local sales. It is a very volatile issue.

Barry is also working with a prototype, it is not a production line sample. But we got some good stuff today and I am sure without my bugging him tomorrow, he will make greater progress. ;-) I really think this is a very nice little camera and with acouple of tweaks here and there will be great.

Best,

Jan

Oh so Mr. Green has a 170 in his hands right now? or am I reading this wrong?

Someone asked about the lowlight difference between 200A and HPX170: well they SHOULD be the same unless the actual LENS itself is much better than the HVX200A's? This is probably the only variable as far as image quality that should effect the difference in image between the 200A and 170. Or am I wrong?

 

[LuckyStudio 13]

Hi, Barry won't have everything but will have a goodly supply. For example the 50/60Hz question. This is still being hammered out. This is all about gray market issues. World money markets are not fair and customers pay for trips abroad with what they save in gray goods.

Jan, I understand the issue but Sony with the EX1 and all of the Canon HDV cams (h1, a1, g1) are capable of 50/60hz switchable (canon facotry upgrades).

Furthermore, B&H a Panasonic dealer is selling 60hz PAL dvx, hvx and other camcorders right under the nose of Panasonic America for years.

The hpx 170 is a PERFECT companion to the hpx 500 as a smaller B cam, crash cam, underwater cam and it is a mighty shame if those two cant be perfectly coupled up due to 50/60hz switchable option.

 

[Barry_Green]

Oh so Mr. Green has a 170 in his hands right now? or am I reading this wrong?

Right NOW? No. But earlier today, yeah... :evil:

I'm doing a preview "Second Look" article for DVXUser, and since the 170 is going "public" next week at the show, I'm getting a chance to check it out early to get the article ready. As Jan said, this is not a finished product, it's a prototype (after all, the final version is not due to ship for maybe 4 months,) but this is a mightily updated version from the one they had at NAB (for example, the menus work... how's that for an update?!)

Oh, and ... yes... there are some goodies under the hood, moreso than just the physical differences noted earlier. I probably shouldn't say anything yet, I mean, if I went and said something like "the LCD is astonishingly better for focus now", that'd just spoil the article, and I wouldn't want to go spoiling the article...

Anybody want to buy a two-year-old HVX200? I need to raise some cash by September... :thumbsup:

 

[Barry_Green]

Jan, I understand the issue but Sony with the EX1 and all of the Canon HDV cams (h1, a1, g1) are capable of 50/60hz switchable (canon facotry upgrades).

Furthermore, B&H a Panasonic dealer is selling 60hz PAL dvx, hvx and other camcorders right under the nose of Panasonic America for years.

The hpx 170 is a PERFECT companion to the hpx 500 as a smaller B cam, crash cam, underwater cam and it is a mighty shame if those two cant be perfectly coupled up due to 50/60hz switchable option.

Trust me, Jan understands this point very, very well. But she's the US product line manager, not the engineer who builds it at the factory. If the factory chooses to offer it, we'll get it. If the factory chooses not to offer it, we won't. Please go vote in the poll so we can show the factory how much of an impact the addition (or deletion) of this feature means to us.

 

[Barry_Green]

Someone asked about the lowlight difference between 200A and HPX170: well they SHOULD be the same unless the actual LENS itself is much better than the HVX200A's? This is probably the only variable as far as image quality that should effect the difference in image between the 200A and 170. Or am I wrong?

Your assumption seems eminently logical and reasonable. Actual testing will verify whether it is accurate. I can try to do something with the prototype, but until the final version is released there's no way to know for certain if the results will even be meaningful.

 

[Kholi]

Right NOW? No. But earlier today, yeah... :evil:

I'm doing a preview "Second Look" article for DVXUser, and since the 170 is going "public" next week at the show, I'm getting a chance to check it out early to get the article ready. As Jan said, this is not a finished product, it's a prototype (after all, the final version is not due to ship for maybe 4 months,) but this is a mightily updated version from the one they had at NAB (for example, the menus work... how's that for an update?!)

Oh, and ... yes... there are some goodies under the hood, moreso than just the physical differences noted earlier. I probably shouldn't say anything yet, I mean, if I went and said something like "the LCD is astonishingly better for focus now", that'd just spoil the article, and I wouldn't want to go spoiling the article...

Anybody want to buy a two-year-old HVX200? I need to raise some cash by September... :thumbsup:

Awwww. No FAIR. I'd assume your identity to get to play with the HPX170 but I think our physical appearances different just slightly.

I'll wait for the second look article, but I'll be keeping an eye out in regards to the lens itself.

 

[Butcher]

I know the camera is still 4 months from the projected release, but is there a projected date to announce the MSRP? We're seriously looking at going P2 (I'd prefer sooner than later), and having a price would help us plan.

Look forward to your 2nd review Barry.

Michael.

 

[FatDaddy]

Barry, great news on the upcoming article tweak. September sounds like it won't come fast enough.

Jan, I was hoping for a 170/64 gig P2 card combo release. Any chance that will work out?

Hoping Pany will make that a special deal :thumbsup:

 

[Concept89]

If your adapter renders the image upside down, then the camera will record it upside down. The 170 has the ability to flip its LCD, so you could monitor the image right-side-up even though it's being recorded upside down.


I strongly encourage everyone to shoot rightside up. The Letus Extreme shoots rightside-up, so you don't have any hassles. You record the footage the right way, and you monitor the footage the right way. Everything just works the way you'd expect it to. I think at this point that every major adapter manufacturer has a rightside-up adapter.

For those who want to use an upside-down adapter, that's what the LCD Flip feature is for.

Ah! I see! Thanks a lot for clearing that up for me Barry!

 

[SPZ]

Looks like the HPX is the DVXUSER wishlist answer from Panasonic.

Better LCD? YES!

Now, Barry, the only concern I have is... the lens. I'm really curious to see the bigger lens vs the smaller lens (HVX200a vs 170) and what that means in overal quality of the images...