How To Get Started and Stay In The Business

grinner said:
Waisting time is waisting money. Don't travel unless getting paid to do it and don't drive out to give bids that could have been shot down over the phone.
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In the case of that lady with the 'sweet sixteen' party, my wife was friendly with her (they both belong to the same social organization) and also the woman was Filipino, so my wife being sort of the go-between, it was a situation better handled in person. The problem arose when, based on an earlier impromptu conversation at a retail location, the woman asked how much I would charge to do a birthday party. I assumed a couple of hours at the time and gave her a ballpark off the top of my head. Now, it turns out, she wanted something MUCH more elaborate. Apparently this "18 roses" festival thing is a very big rite of passage in the Filipino tradition, and the woman is spending quite a bit of money on this event.
Normally, with a corporate type client, I CAN pretty much sum things up on a phonecall, but with this, no. Also with wedding clients, they insist on an in-person meeting, which I use to show them examples of how their DVD might look, as well as contract signing, etc., if they agree to the price and like what I have shown them.
Given that it is often months between finding a prospect, I tend to go all out to make a good impression on them. If I had work every day, that would be a different story, I suppose.
 
The first four months of self-employment

The first four months of self-employment

Hey there, still new to this board, but I love this topic of conversation, which, above any lens, program, or new camera, is by far the most important topic.

After being employed for seven years in the news biz, I quit, and started my own company and it's the best thing I have every done.

Period.

I started out with a bang, and now it's slowed, but everything ebbs and flows, so just keep paddling and you'll be fine right?

I've made the calls, lots of them, and some of them have panned out, but mostly, when I present who I am, I get the, "oh they're not in."
They were just in a minute ago!!!!!

So, there's another challenge to overcome, but like Rob said, if it were easy, everyone would do it, and you wouldn't make any money!

In the meantime, there are plenty more calls to make, books to read, and quality time that I used to waste working for someone else.

Cheers!
 
Now that summer is approaching, I'm devoting more and more of my time to an 'emergency' roof repair project, which will take away from my telemarketing time, make me very tired and generally drain me of creative energy. I will be glad when (if?) this roof repair gets done, but in the meantime, it's a race against the rain storms. I know the REAL meaning of TARP, hey, hey...
It is frustrating to be employed in a job where there's no income!
 
What are the views on doing 'free-bee's' for potentially good clients,when starting out?

is it wise 'spending money to make money' ??
 
It's a requirment. You'll start out doing it for free (or very close to it) or ya won't start out.
My first job at a tv station was for 3.35 per hour. My first salary job was at 18k a year and they worked me 70 hours a week. Neither of those places exploited me. I exploited tham, learning far more than when I was in college paying money to learn. These places went on my resume and the works I created went on my reel. Those led to the the next job, feeding the next. This is how your career becomes a ladder.
Once espablished, you will still be hit up for freebies. It's at that point you can guage if you can afford it or not, based on your intrest and the gains that will come from it. As it is, starting out, one can't afford not to do it.
 
Sales, Video, and you

Sales, Video, and you

After taking Robstar's advice and making a bunch of calls, I realized that for me, it wasn't quite that easy, or productive. Every call I made was doing me more harm than good, because I don't know how to approach the sales call.

So what to do?

I did something that I recommend EVERYONE who reads this board to: take sales classes. If you don't know how to sell your product or yourself, you'll be broke and wondering why everyone else is making money and you are not.

These are points that have been touched on within this post, but they bear repeating.

You need to show potential clients the value of you and your product to them. They don't care that you have the greatest gear, the most training, the most awards, or are the best dressed video guy ever. If you can show how your product can help them, you're in. Find out what their needs are, and tell them how your services can fill those needs.

Are they wasting money and resources because someone from their staff has to do new employee training? Training video.

Do they have great products, and want to demonstrate how great they are to everyone? Suggest a video for their website.

You know that you do a kick ass job, but until you can relate your skills to your clients world and cure a pain they have, you won't be getting as much work as you could.

Everything Rob has said is dead straight on perfect. Do yourself a favor and take some sales classes, it will be one of the best things you can do for your business. If it involves taking a week or so off, do it. If it costs a few dollars do it. Remember, it's not an expense, it's an investment.

Remember, we are all running a business here, even if that business is just you and your camera.
 
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Sometimes what not to do is the best way to round off a discussion on how to stay in business.
Thanks for showing that, V-P.
 
Hey Pulpwoody, great post and a very good point! You're smart to be proactive and learning some basic sales and marketing techniques to promote your business.

We've never branched off into it in this post but I've read dozens of books on marketing and sales techniques, attended many lectures on the topic and have also listened to hundreds of audio tapes / books on the topic. Education extends beyond cinematic technique and process.

Zig Ziglar's books, while fairly old-school are still industry standards. See You At The Top is a great start. I used to plug this audio book in on my way to every big presentation just to get pumped up.

Another old school book "How to Win Friends and Influence People" contains a wealth of priceless information for sales and life that is as good today as it was 20 years ago.

There are thousands of great titles!

If you want to sell yourself, you have to know what the buyer wants and why they want it. Learning to listen and dig to find out you prospect's PRIMARY BUYING motive is the key whether it's diapers, commercials or funding for films.

Robert Starling, SOC
 
Fine. So how DO we convince a client (who can go out and buy his own camcorder cheaply enough) that paying us the big $$$ to make his video will REALLY make him more money in the long run?
 
basspig said:
Fine. So how DO we convince a client (who can go out and buy his own camcorder cheaply enough) that paying us the big $$$ to make his video will REALLY make him more money in the long run?
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You don't, you can't and you never will. Find prospects and clients that value production already. Don't waste time on people / companies who are too stupid for their own good! You're fishing way too far down the food chain.

Robert
 
The best way is to let em shoot one. Self embarrassment is always the best step towards wisdom. As Robert said, you'll do better marketing to companies smart enough to know they need ya than spending time and effort educating.
 
When you advertize, you get what you get in terms of responses. Now from those respondents, if 100% of them are looking for a 'low-budget' provider, then it might be concluded that one's advertizing failed to reach the right market, yes?

Client self-embarassment? Never happens! I've had prospects that didn't turn into clients find 'cheap' ways to get done what they'd planned and expressed a high degree of satisfaction.

So the real challenge, is not how to weed out the bottom feeders, but how to say the right things that bring response from the corporate sector to whom quality matters over cost.

This might also entail advertizing in field-specific magazines and journals, albeit at considerable cost. Knowing where to advertize and what to say strikes me as the two key factors in a successful marketing campaign.

I've just started publishing a newsletter and mail it out to all clients, past and current. I'm planning this on a monthly basis.

I've also just started a Google AdWords campaign. We're averaging about 300 impressions per day and about 1-2 clicks per day from the ad impressions so far.

I was thinking of hiring a marketing specialist who has a good manner with people and puts forth a professional image that makes corporate types feel they're dealing with a substantial entity that's going to be there for them.

Does anyone have suggestions on the phrases that work in marketing our services?
 
Hi M & M,

<<from those respondents, if 100% of them are looking for a 'low-budget' provider, then it might be concluded that one's advertizing failed to reach the right market, yes???

Absolutely, you've basically wasted your money and your time; one in the same. You are a hundred times better off finding a company who already is advertising or marketing with high quality work and positioning yourself as a more creative, more flexible... whatever it is that makes you special, alternative.

Reading your suspect and listening to the subtle tale-tell signs of "cheap-skates" is learned only through practice. After a while, it will be intuitive with each word they speak and the tone / manner in which they speak it will tell you they are a time waster. You have to give it a listen though because even with my experience I'll occasionally get an odd call, sort of write it off as nothing and it turn out to be a special project of one of the Executive Producers from Pixar as an example. Practice makes perfect... or as close as you can get.

Advertising can be effective but only IF you do it as an overall campaign. Running "ads" does not work, creating targeted campaigns in magazine, direct mail and tradeshows, combined with your calling / marketing program can be very effective.

Try Google, change it up a bit and see if it is effective. If not, don't spend a lot of time or money there. We tried it and it didn't work for us even though we had someone to manage and monitor it daily. It can work as part of a CAMPAIGN though... the key word being "part".

A Marketing Coordinator is a good investment if you can afford one and if you can monitor and direct them to create ongoing efforts. Don't confuse a Marketing Coordinator with a salesperson... two totally different jobs. We had both and have had the good and bad of both. For either, you need a plan to measure their success such as 100 new suspects called or contacted in a week for a marketing coordinator to specific sales goals for a sales associate. Be aware that the best sales job that person may ever do is to sell YOU on THEM. They over-promise and under-deliver. Give them 30-60-90 day goals and boot their ass out if they don't make it but be realistic with them, not an easy mark.

Get some of the books I mentioned and you'll find all the phrases you want; like paint on a canvass though, it's how you apply those phrases that will make a difference.

There are no shortcuts aside from buying an existing successful company.

Robert
 
Do you mean find a company that's already using a high-end video production house? If so, isn't it nearly impossible to tear such a company away from their 'safe' relationship with a provider they trust, to risk a relationship with a new, unknown provider?

Running ads on Google now. I'm seeing we get a click through every other day, not every day. Keyword that makes the threshold is "wedding videos". I was hoping that "corporate video" would have garnered some response, but it looks like mostly brides looking for cheap video of their upcoming weddings.

I don't have any budget to pay salary, but the wild idea of putting a Craigslist ad seeking a marketing specialist on commission basis, was something I was considering last month. I figure if they understand what they're selling, and they're really good at their craft, they could bring in enough business to support their commission fees. But alas, the quality of people perusing CL can be questionable.

I think it will have to be someone else who makes the public impression. I just have this horrible personality that rubs people the wrong way. I've been working on it for decades, even tried to sell Amway in the 70s and life insurance in the 2000s, but sales is firmly across the grain for me and after forty years trying it on and off, I still don't feel comfortable with it. That may be partly because I don't know what to say when cold-calling or doing a drop in visit at corporate offices in the area. Part of the problem is that many of these companies I visit are a mystery--I don't know what they do beyond those walls, or what their PR challenges might be. It's difficult to formulate a plan of marketing to an opaque company, if you know what I'm trying to say here.
 
basspig said:
Do you mean find a company that's already using a high-end video production house? If so, isn't it nearly impossible to tear such a company away from their 'safe' relationship with a provider they trust, to risk a relationship with a new, unknown provider?
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Yes that is exactly what I mean. Relationships change for vendors and clients, people move on to bigger or better things. If you don't have something better to offer in the way of creativity, service or personality... aside from lowballing (not that you're doing that) then what do you have to offer?

Have you read this entire thread from the beginning or are you just jumping in midway?

Robert
 
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I've been followin this thread for months, actually, but I have a short memory for details, so I cannot remember every post dating back more than a week or two.

As for what *I* offer vs. the other vendors, it's quality of the product. Superior sound. Superior picture. Clean editing, attention to detail, quality through and through.

The problem is that it's hard to get the right kind of clients to even find out about my existence. And I, personally, am NOT the person you'd want as your salesman. I'm comfortable with machines and electronics, but have never, despite years in Amway and Primerica in the past, been able to get comfortable with sales. That has been an extra challenge for me, in this already tough sell business.

You could be offering the best quality product in the world, but until the right circumstances exist, no one's gonna' believe your claims, or trust you enough to give you a job. Lots of folks met their clients in college or film school--for instance, one guy's studying to become a director, another is a cinematographer major, another is a writer. They're all buddies in college, and when they graduate, one of them forms a production company and hires the others because he knows them. The rest of us have to go to extraordinary measures to find work.
 
Dear M&M, unless you're downright rude and/or have no manners you're probably better at business development than you give yourself credit for. Think more along the lines of marketing, researching to find the right clients and then reaching out to them via the different ways we've discussed in this thread. Sometimes hanging the moniker of SALES onto the task is not the best description.

Established relationships are definitely a challenge to crack, but not impossible. When I was producing I found myself using the same writer and other crew for years and years; they were a proven team. I'd always think about trying others to add a fresh look but it is easier to work with "the devil you know -vs- the devil you don't know". It's a little bit like my wife and I eating at the same restaurants all the time and even though we like a lot a variety, we pretty much go to a few dozen places and eat the same handful of menu items at each one.

From what you post here I can tell you get it that it is a tough business, but what business is easy? Or at least what business worth having is easy? I know you're here talking amongst friends and peers, that is what this is all about but I'm detecting a slight undertone of negativity from you or maybe it's just frustration. I know how you feel either way because I've been there myself. What I've found though is that I have to have faith that my marketing and business acumen will carry me through if I stick to it... and it does. My job in South Beach last weekend was a direct result of relationships I started building 12-14 YEARS ago.... not weeks, not months... YEARS. Some seeds you sow sprout fast, slow and never.

If you find it a struggle working with strangers or communicating with them try a few of the books or books on tape I suggested earlier. You've invested time and effort developing your technical skills, you have to do that and then some to become well-rounded as a business person. Have patience and keep doing the tough stuff too unless you can afford a sales rep.

Robert Starling
 
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I don't know about rude, but I do get the feeling I lack some sort of 'sense' about the flow of conversation. Had this problem all my life. When I attempt to initiate a conversation, the nature of it is tense, with the other person giving me 'the third degree' and not opening up and being cordial. Having a conversation with me is like having a conversation with a cop having a bad day, if you can picture that. I can't help it, I just come across that way. I even had therapy for interpersonal relationships forty some-odd years ago. Didn't affect or improve my social skills one iota.

The video business is a tough one, because it's like selling ice to Eskimos. Everyone has a $179 Flip camera, so why would they hire me? Pro videographers have become marginalized, like the super high-end audio gear that goes for six figures and only sells a dozen hand-made units. The general public isn't interested in hi-fi sound OR pictures, when MP3 and YouTube is "good enough" for them.

Even formerly successful videographers are losing business left and right. I ran into this problem in 1992.. after I ended a career in technical writing, I opened shop as a typeographer/typesetter. A used imagesetter cost $40,000, RC photo paper and chemicals were a high recurring expense, and within a few years, I was out-cheaped by hords of Mac users and laser printers. By 1996, I went back into an ancient career--broadcast engineering--this time as a freelancer. I did that for 12 more years, until that industry went to hell with the appliance-like nature of the new transmitting equipment that managers believe can run without a full time engineer. So I return to an ambition I had in the 60s, which was to be a cinematographer. I remembered longingly the days of my Bolex H-8 and the short films I used to make. But now with digital video, I thought "this is great, my cake and eat it too--sound and picture together, and reusable media!" But the same thing that happened to my typesetting business is happening to my video business--I'm being out-cheaped by the growing numbers of personal camcorders and the perception that this is "good enough".

I need to sell "ice to the Eskimos." But my social skills aren't even good enough to land a "door greeter" position at Wal-Mart. Yes, frustration is what you sense. I've got tons of it. Decades of working in employment positions that crushed my soul and destroyed my inner creativity with devastatingly-boring menial tasks, slowly working my way up the ranks to burdensom responsibilities that again involved interpersonal one on ones with other employees. Finally retirement and realizing I don't have enough money to remain in my home for any substantial length of time due to rising taxes. So I pursue the one thing that I could not do in regular jobs: something I'm interested in and have abilities with--multimedia. I just love creating pictures and sound. It's become an obsession with me to achieve perfection beyond any level that normal people are aware of. And that's another problem of mine--I get caught up in analyzing my work, endlessly trying to improve this or that, pixel poking, losing sleep over a little lens distortion, or a codec artifact I noticed in one specific scene.

Realistically, I and most everyone else, don't know how much time I/we have left on this earth. I just keep going as long as health holds out. I've had two strokes already, one in 1984, the other in 1992, lost part of my vision for a while and wonder when the 'big one' will take me out. Knock on wood, I'm still going strong. And I wouldn't be so worried if I didn't have the pressure of paying taxes that have no relation to my income. Towns have no mercy in this regard. If I could just grow my vegetable garden, get power from windmills and solar cells, with no government people banging on my door with process servers, I'd be pretty happy at the level my business is at. But it seems one has to bring in close to six figures if one expects to enjoy the liberties supposedly garanteed by the Constitution. Otherwise, as Malcom-X put it, "they'll steal your house with trumped-up clause."

The long and the short of it is, I've had decades to practice, but I guess as in musical talents, some people have it, and some don't.
 
For Basspig - OK, I've waded thru this and feel your pain. The general feeling I'm getting here is your obsession with playing to your weaknesses.

Your social skills suck. Unless you fall off the roof on your head or get hit by lightning, a personality change sufficient to overcome this is highly unlikely. Therefore, direct selling of a service is just not in the cards for you.

You repeatedly refer to your creativity and passion for excellence. So - what can you CREATE that people will want to purchase AFTER THE FACT. You need to create something that will essentially SELL ITSELF (with a little help from your website, infomercial, kiosk, local brownie troop, whatever).

This is the only way one ever got RICH btw - not wealthy, RICH. When you work by the hour, there's a finite limit on what you can charge and how many hours you get to sell (nobody gets out alive).

What can you CREATE, mass produce on CD for under a buck and have me tickled to pay $4.95 plus s&h for ????

Without ever knowing that you're green, have leprosy, and abuse farm animals.

Detractor to all this is your costs are all up front. (Hint - It's not going to be a feature film). and don't do an initial run of 30,000 without a little test marketing (an early mistake of mine). And don't pursue just one. Think multiple streams of income.

It doesn't HAVE to be unique. Every Wal-Mart has a CD of raindrops in the forest. So maybe you offer a rendition of frogs on a lillypad, or fat raindrops on a tin roof, or you do it as a ringtone - download from your website for a buck.

Attempting to sell a service (intangible) requires skills you freely admit you lack. Use your creativity to create a something which can then hopefully sell itself. For you, 1000 $5 sales may be far easier than one $5,000 sale. And those 1000 sales just might go viral.

Peace & Best wishes.
 
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