C100: How do you like the C100?

S

swanny

Well-known member
I'm wondering how you C100 owners like the camera after using it? Any dislikes about filming, image, workflow, etc? I'm considering upgrading from our AF100 to this, mostly because of the extended dynamic range and low light sensitivity and wanted to hear some thoughts on it.
Thanks
 
I love mine. Filming with it is so much nicer than the 60D/GH2 I had used beforehand, and the images blow me away. I have locking HDMI cables going out to a Ninja-2 for 4:2:2 ProRes, so I have that option, but the AVCHD is so good that unless you need the larger file sizes and 4:2:2 for a specific reason, the internal will take you pretty far.
 
I've had mine for about a week now. There's so much that I like about the image of the camera that has been said in many of the posts I won't talk about those. One thing that I haven't seen posted that is important to me and the work that I do is sound. The audio components in this camera sound very good. Low noise floor, better than average sounding mic pre's. Even the 1/8 inch input sounds VERY good when using it with my sound devices 442 (mic level output).

I love the camera but ...
I'm very disappointed with how difficult it is to shoot outdoors with this camera. I'm talking about the camera without bringing external monitor and hood. The viewfinder and the LCD are "close" to useless if there's sunlight present. I knew that going in but until I actually went out with the camera to see for myself I under estimated how bad it really is. I'm sure the will be a solution for this since it's an opportunity for a company to make some quick $$.
 
The big thing about this camera is color reproduction. It has a great color science and unique look among cameras in its price range. The skin tones are excellent, and in some cases are better than RED. It has similar color contrast to the black magic cinema camera with hyper-saturation of deep blues and reds. Also when you increase iso there is minimal changes in color reproduction and sharpness which is amazing! The only difference between native 850 and 3200, is some grain. So with this camera your 300w fixture is as powerful as a 1k. It also requires very little secondaries grading which is fantastic. The dynamic range is extensive enough for any controlled environment and the camera is just so damn light and easy to handle in your hands that I can't image a better suited camera for a budding filmmaker. On the other had, this not a DSLR. It requires careful tweaking of picture profiles and a good understanding of exposure to really get the most out of this camera. An external recorder is required for anything that requires quality.
 
RZE said:
An external recorder is required for anything that requires quality.
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Highly disagree. I have overlaid the shots and toggled between them and the difference is incredibly minimal. You'll get more subtle grades with 4:2:2 ProRes (at this moment in time, I highly recommend the Ninja-2 over any other external for the C100) and I wouldn't do C-Log without it, but for crafting the look in-camera and not stressing out the codec with incredibly fast pans or whatnot, I think you'd be hard-pressed to squeeze much more quality over the internal codec. It's simply one of the best implementations of AVCHD I've seen.

I would also like to point out that I consider the C100/300 to be 4k cameras, they just do the heavy-lifting in post on the front end, saving you time. The only thing you lose is re-framing, but I think it's slightly overrated (plus it adds a ton of render time to get out a 1080 or 720 version). I much prefer getting that 4k-to-1080 look that the C100 offers, as opposed to shooting 4k and doing it myself.
 
Gary Huff said:
Highly disagree. I have overlaid the shots and toggled between them and the difference is incredibly minimal. You'll get more subtle grades with 4:2:2 ProRes (at this moment in time, I highly recommend the Ninja-2 over any other external for the C100) and I wouldn't do C-Log without it, but for crafting the look in-camera and not stressing out the codec with incredibly fast pans or whatnot, I think you'd be hard-pressed to squeeze much more quality over the internal codec. It's simply one of the best implementations of AVCHD I've seen.

I would also like to point out that I consider the C100/300 to be 4k cameras, they just do the heavy-lifting in post on the front end, saving you time. The only thing you lose is re-framing, but I think it's slightly overrated (plus it adds a ton of render time to get out a 1080 or 720 version). I much prefer getting that 4k-to-1080 look that the C100 offers, as opposed to shooting 4k and doing it myself.
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As far as I'm concerned anything projects that require quality require clog, thus require an external recorder,

Also the c100 it is not a 4k camera. While the camera is amazing, it certainly lacks the crispness and dimension that 4k acquisition has. For anyone in the market for a camera in the c100's price range, this is a non issue but, if you are comparing it to the scarlet, the 4k subsample coming of the hdsdi which requires no rendering at all is crisper.

The Ninja is good for people who operate only on the c100. But if you shoot on other formats as well, having something with hdsdi input and outputs is much better.
 
the c100 i think will always be overshadowed by the c300, unless they give us a few key firmware additions

too many people just can't comprehend how good the 8bit image looks, and that no, the price isn't absurd.

it isn't a flying brick

it does have a great image all around

it is by far unrivaled in the battery department

it has the most unobtrusive and intelligent ND implementation in a large sensor small form factor camera ever

i feel no regrets in my purchase of one
 
RZE said:
For anyone in the market for a camera in the c100's price range, this is a non issue but, if you are comparing it to the scarlet, the 4k subsample coming of the hdsdi which requires no rendering at all is crisper.
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I'll need to see some comparisons of this, because I'm constantly hearing how the C100 footage looks like downsampled Red.
 
Gary Huff said:
I'll need to see some comparisons of this, because I'm constantly hearing how the C100 footage looks like downsampled Red.
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honestly, canon would do themselves a big favor by just having an in camera 2k record option for any or all of the C cameras, its not a big leap, and the sensor obviously has what's needed. that would give us techs more ammo for chatting with producers. i imagine it would go something like this:

Producer: i want to shoot 4k

Shooter: well, this is a comedy film, we have no SFX, is there any reason you want 4k?

P: It's futureproof, it looks great, i heard it's so much better than hd

S: well yes it looks great, but almost no movie theaters project 4k, how about we shoot 2k, which is what most digital cinemas project at, and unless you watch it side by side with 4k on high end monitors, you wouldn't know the difference, and we can master in HD for bluray/TV and have room for minor reframing/stabilizing/etc... and all the while save you $$$ on workflow and post production costs of 4K

P: i want to shoot 4k

S: ah F**k it.
 
Gary Huff said:
I'll need to see some comparisons of this, because I'm constantly hearing how the C100 footage looks like downsampled Red.
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Recently sold my scarlet so can do anymore comparisons, but from my initial tests you could easily cut between the two, but there is more luma and color information in the darks for red and subjectively more image fidelity. Red gamma 3 makes deloged canon still look flat. I would say the scarlet would look a lot better on the big screen, and marginally better on tv.
 
From an entirely non-4k point of view, I love my C100 because it's everything that the FS100 & 700 isn't:

- I love the highlight handling (no need for Picture Profile alchemy)
- I love the ergononics compared with the FS100/700
- I love the extra detail in the image (not sharpening, actual detail)
- I love the audio - yes, compared it to my PIX220, very close (unlike other cams)
- I love the way my Canon glass just sits on the camera and works
- I love the little pro features: ClearScan Shutter, Dual record, Waveform Monitor, fractional gain, iris and shutter, etc
- I love its non threatening persona when shooting amongst crowds
- I love that its AVCHD is good enough for the jobs that can't/won't afford 4:2:2 but it's there when I do need it (4 hours of conference + voxpops tomorrow - 422 a waste and a hassle - then loads of chromakey Thursday, deffo will use the PIX)
- I love how it's just as good in low light as the FS100, and just as frugal with battery power too.

The C100 is what I wanted when I had a DSLR and an EX1R wishing I could mate the two. Something solid, with detailed image, robust, but small, discrete and filmic, with a great range of glass.

I almost sold my two EX1Rs and FS100 to fund a C300 - I haven't, though. The C100 isn't 'the one' and it has many niggles and a couple of glaring omissions. However, it does what I need it to do, and it does it very very well.

But hey - I'm an Event Videographer who does Corporates, I am *the* target market for the C100.

Sure, I really wanted timelapse and slomo, but I have other cameras for that. I couldn't bare the big hairy mess of making the FS100 into a Run & Gun shoulder cam - yes the EVF is a bit useless on the C100, but have you ever tried the FS100? And once you put a Zacuto EVF on a noga arm, and some rails to put it on your shoulder at eye level, and dealt with the cabling and the power and the on-off... You just want to _hug_ the C100.
 
Was this comparing to ProRes from the HDMI port or AVCHD? Most of the comments I've heard have come from people who are working with the ProRes footage. I could see how this would be the differences between the Scarlet/C100 in AVCHD footage, because this is kind of what I see in the difference between ProRes and AVCHD (not that anyone but us pixel peepers would really notice in practice).
 
A side benefit that hasn't been mentioned yet - and an important one - is that the c100 will hold its resale value very very well.
 
J Davis said:
A side benefit that hasn't been mentioned yet - and an important one - is that the c100 will hold its resale value very very well.
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Canon is kind of like the Apple of the camera world. Yeah, you can get some similar specs for cheaper elsewhere, but it holds its resale value better.
 
Gary Huff said:
Was this comparing to ProRes from the HDMI port or AVCHD? Most of the comments I've heard have come from people who are working with the ProRes footage. I could see how this would be the differences between the Scarlet/C100 in AVCHD footage, because this is kind of what I see in the difference between ProRes and AVCHD (not that anyone but us pixel peepers would really notice in practice).
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I compared prores hq coming off the c100 hdmi and the scarlet hdsdi. If you are shooting in normal gammas there is no reason for an external recorder. Those gammas are finished looks. However the dynamic range is maybe 8 stops. The sales reps from Atomos even say you are not going to get a much better looking image. If you are using this camera for cinema purposes, underexposing the sensor is likely going to happen, in that case a higher bit rate and better subsample will be necessary. For event shooters there is no reason for external recorder, but for narrative, I don't know how you can operate without. I think I spend maybe three times as much time pulling a key on avchd over prores and its still not as good of a key.
 
aalleexx said:
how good is it for chromakeying?
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Depends on what kind of chromakey - I don't use it for motion tracked footage, and have vowed that if I were to do 'proper' chromakey (rather than mere interviews in lousy locations) I'd go BMCC for lower end work and 'proper' camera with a 'proper' shutter for higher end motion tracking.

But for 'lousy location, let's do chromakey' interviews, I've shot on internal AVCHD and ProRes out of the HDMI into PIX220, and whilst I can get a better key using the ProRes 422 stuff, especially in a 'proper' keyer like KeyLight in AE, You can get passable results in FCPX's built-in keyer from the AVCHD. Why? Because not every budget is big enough.

And specifically, I could never get a reasonable key from FS100 footage - from either internal or 422 footage. Not enough detail for the hybrid keyers to work on. C100 feels as good as the EX1/3, almost an F3. And the WFM is lovely for setting up the bgd lighting.
 
swanny said:
8 stops for the C100? I thought it was up around 12.
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C-log is 12 stops. 8 stops would definitely be the EOS picture profile. I don't know what the Wide-DR pp is rated at. It's really good though. Did you get my facebook message Swanny? You asked me earlier about it. Didn't know you were on DVXUser as well.
 
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