F35: Holy smokes, I bought a F35 too

SLEEK?! Well, that's one way to put it! I can remember doing a long handheld take around 2008 with the F35/SRW combo and feeling my spine talk to me in a language I'd never heard before (nor wanted to). Have fun...!
 
Grug said:
I know it's a lot of camera for the money, but it's also a lot of camera to deal with.
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Yes indeed.

And with cameras like the Ursa 12K and Komodo, cameras like the F65 will drop even more. I think it will soon cost as much as a F35. Who knows, maybe even less. As it is it's not too far from complete F35 kits. Because the F35 at least has a cult following, is exotic and offers things no new camera does.

The F65 never caught on and the problem with the F65 is that at this point, many other cameras offer the same or very similar but are much easier to handle and work with. And affordable.

Sony just limited the F65 too much, for whatever short sighted reason. It doesn't output 4K, you are locked to the one recorder whatever you like it or not, if I'm not wrong 4K is only RAW, the mechanical shutter makes it huge and heavy, while the F55 has a global shutter without the contraption. Just using a simple onboard battery is a workaround. The camera is happier with a floor battery brick.

No wonder they are starting to give them away. Not a whole lot of reason to buy them at this point. Unless you are a die hard Sony fan or if you think yesterday's top tech impresses clients. A totally different thing from a F35 or Alexa Classic where people buy because of the image. Because you can't find either image anywhere else. I know that I would rather have a F35, if I was to choose between it or a F65.
 
I opened it up from the top, right under where the remote docks...i see three cards inside , they covered by shield plate, so i can't see what they are. But i imagine these cards are the the options cards right?
 
Sttratos said:
the mechanical shutter makes it huge and heavy, while the F55 has a global shutter without the contraption.
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Just a thought, the mechanical shutter, is at least technically a rolling shutter. It has a different motion capture characteristic than true global shutter. It has an analogue soft motion blur to motion per frame, as well. Not sure it plays out that way or what not, as I have never shot with an F65. But from an outsider sort of guessing, it seems like there are some good reasons for mechanical shutter. Also helps with dynamic range, which also might help with balancing out colour channels... again. just all things I am guessing at.
 
James0b57 said:
Just a thought, the mechanical shutter, is at least technically a rolling shutter. It has a different motion capture characteristic than true global shutter. It has an analogue soft motion blur to motion per frame, as well. Not sure it plays out that way or what not, as I have never shot with an F65. But from an outsider sort of guessing, it seems like there are some good reasons for mechanical shutter. Also helps with dynamic range, which also might help with balancing out colour channels... again. just all things I am guessing at.
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The mechanical shutter didn't really add much weight but it did make it a bit fatter. At first Sony was going to make it a (paid) option but I and others said to just include it. I forget about how much bigger and heavier but it was pretty minor.

When the camera was announced we held some events at AbelCine to show off its capabilities. I demonstrated what the mechanical shutter did for you, because you can run it or choose to park it and only use the electronic rolling shutter. The difference was remarkable and quite apparent on the special Shutter-O-Matic test bed system I built for the occasion ( a 20" box fan on a dimmer). While there are still some differences with skew on a rolling shutter with mechanical focal plane shutter v. a true global shutter, I can tell you that they were nearly invisible differences. The system really did effectively function as a global shutter. When the mechanical shutter was closed the sensor read off all of the photosites and then started reading again in a rolling shutter cascade. But of course they saw darkness then because the mechanical shutter was still in the way. Then the mechanical shutter spun around to expose the sensor to light exactly as a film camera would, with the exposure time completely under the effect of the physical shutter's arc of rotation. So there were no rolling shutter artifacts because it didn't matter that the electronic read/write happened in a rolling cascade because all of the exposure timing was determined by the mechanical shutter, which occurred in a window smaller than that of the electronic shutter.

The F65 shutter system functioned just like a film camera's. This is different from a true electronic global shutter because with that every photosite exposes at the exact same time whereas a mechanical shutter moves in an arc across the sensor so there is a tiny time shift between the first photosites on one side of the frame and the last one on the far end. But we were just fine with the mechanical shutter look of film cameras for 100 years, and we could have gone to pellicules decades earlier if we actually cared, which we don't.
 
Sttratos said:
Yes indeed.

And with cameras like the Ursa 12K and Komodo, cameras like the F65 will drop even more. I think it will soon cost as much as a F35. Who knows, maybe even less. As it is it's not too far from complete F35 kits. Because the F35 at least has a cult following, is exotic and offers things no new camera does.

The F65 never caught on and the problem with the F65 is that at this point, many other cameras offer the same or very similar but are much easier to handle and work with. And affordable.

Sony just limited the F65 too much, for whatever short sighted reason. It doesn't output 4K, you are locked to the one recorder whatever you like it or not, if I'm not wrong 4K is only RAW, the mechanical shutter makes it huge and heavy, while the F55 has a global shutter without the contraption. Just using a simple onboard battery is a workaround. The camera is happier with a floor battery brick.

No wonder they are starting to give them away. Not a whole lot of reason to buy them at this point. Unless you are a die hard Sony fan or if you think yesterday's top tech impresses clients. A totally different thing from a F35 or Alexa Classic where people buy because of the image. Because you can't find either image anywhere else. I know that I would rather have a F35, if I was to choose between it or a F65.
Click to expand...

I own an F35, love it and it is my first choice for a shoot. But, I needed a 4K camera and I couldn't think of anything for $6500 plus media that would give me a better image. Open to suggestions. It is lighter than the F35 or an Alexa Classic. But, for some reason everyone is loathing its size. Well, I'll have to live with it for a while and see if I want to keep it or sell to Keisersoze. By the way, it is already almost the same price as an F35 plus 7Q.
 
RayZan said:
It is lighter than the F35 or an Alexa Classic. But, for some reason everyone is loathing its size.
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I'm not sure where this notion came from, but the F65 is certainly not lighter than the Alexa. The body is 5kg, the recorder 1.9kg (or thereabouts) - they're the same weight, the F65 is taller and wider than the Alexa though, so its mass is noticeably more unwieldy than the german's.

I tested one very briefly for a feature that was going to have a lot of handheld work. We did a lightweight rig of the camera with a Superspeed, mattebox and wireless FIZ motors - we hoisted it up on my shoulder and I waved it around for a minute, then put it down and went with the Alexa instead. Neither the shape nor weight were very user-friendly.

Thankfully Sony seem to have learnt their lesson with the Venice, which whilst chonky, at least has a much friendlier weight distribution (if only the X-OCN recording had been integrated into the body :/ ).
 
RayZan said:
I own an F35, love it and it is my first choice for a shoot. But, I needed a 4K camera and I couldn't think of anything for $6500 plus media that would give me a better image. Open to suggestions. It is lighter than the F35 or an Alexa Classic. But, for some reason everyone is loathing its size. Well, I'll have to live with it for a while and see if I want to keep it or sell to Keisersoze. By the way, it is already almost the same price as an F35 plus 7Q.
Click to expand...

Sure. But this is really the only reason. 4K. Because IMO it's not even a 4K image which looks very good. Technically better than the F55 but the F55 is so close and so much more practical that unless you are shooting a hollywood movie, I would go with the F55 if it was my one man band camera. Or if I would be shooting small time stuff as we all do.

And 4K for 4K there are so many cameras now which give RAW or uncompressed for affordable prices. I think the F65 price is misleading too. It's a whale and it needs to be supported as the whale it is. This support will cost a lot more. If you are coming from something like a full Alexa or Ursa Major, then you probably have all the supporting gear already. But I have an Alexa and the support gear and I don't think I would go for the F65. For example see the thread with the F35 on a Ronin. Would never be possible with the F65. Alexa has the Mini for when you need this. F35 can be stripped down. Same with F55. With the F65 you are stuck with the whale. So you can fly the F35 for peanuts. How much will it cost you to fly a F65? This is what made the F65 hugely unpopular and why they are being sold for peanuts now. Anybody who really wants a F65, wait a year and you can get them for paper weight prices.

About the shutter I was not questioning the mechanical shutter usefulness. I was just saying the F55 achieved basically the same effect with a smaller set up. The F55 didn't only outsold the F65 because it was cheaper. It was also a much better thought out camera. Probably why the Venice which is the F65 replacement is basically a silver F55.
 
Possibly a random place to ask this but, where in the manual does it show you how to pu the camera in cine EI mode? can anyone quickly tell me how to access it in the menus? thanks in advance.
 
At shipment, Cine-EI mode is selected.
To change the mode, call up the <SHOOT MODE>
subpage from the <BASE SETTING> page of the
MAINTENANCE menu.

It's on Page 33, Manual revision 2011

Go to Maintenance-Base Settings-Shotmode-Bang!
 
Anyone can point me to A manual that show how to install option cards on SRW-1.

I using my PRO Sony login on this page to download this pdf, but it will not take my credentials. Anyone have access to this page?

It talks about the error on my Srw-1. Please post me this pdf if you can download it.

https://docs.sony.com/release/TB/202011017.pdf

Thank you.
 
I installed 2 option cards back in my day on the SRW to allow 444 ramping and 60p. I remember it being a very simple process once you found the board they went on (i think it was the middle one?), I just cant remember the name of the board. I would suggest emailing Sony from the pro service website and ask for the directions. They will email you this PDF that seems to be password protected.
 
Hey Mike, for some reason i felt you would be the one that would come to my Aid. I was analyzing the circuit boards and i did see the middle board has two slots for comnecting daughter boards but i couldnt confirm it until now when i read your answer. Thanks a lot.
My progress so far: i found out that the NVRam error is originating from the SRPC and not the SRW1. When docked to my F35 I get no errors other than a blinking X103, which is just telling me that the board is not installed. The NVRAM error comes after a syntax VA which refers to the SRPC when the error is from the SRW1 the syntax is VTR. So I have a Bad SRPC.

I already emailed sony asking for access to pdfs related to the SRW1, so hopefully I'll have it soon.
Google gives me a small preview of the pdf that mentions NVRAM error being caused by a backup battery, i think they mean one of those watch batteries on circuit boards like the one that keeps you computer bios chip from loosing its saved data. I already opened both SRPC and SRW1 looking for any component that resembles a battery but nothing. Any idea where this battery may be located?

I ordered a HKSR-102 board but I did not find the 103 yet.

Thanks for your help
 
Well damn! Sony Replied and they gave me a copy of the Bulletin.

All those SRW-1 labeled as "For parts only" on ebay may actually all be good units. It so happens that it does have a lithium battery inside both units that will run out of juice and then you will get a bunch of Error messages, the most common is the dreadful SY NVRAM 0103. Most units on ebay going cheap have this error. The pdf mentions a small IC looking battery that can be found at Digikey for $7.00. But the complicated, not so much though, is the procedure you have to follow to backup the nvram data before pulling it off the unit. Then you have run some commands to dump the data back to the nvram after you replace the battery. Im astounded that nobody will mention this simple procedure to bring back to life all these SRW-1s. Here is small text section from the pdf. (Comes with Japanese accent enjoy)


Technical Bulletin 20-2011-017R
SUBJECT: REPLACING BACKUP BATTERY

DESCRIPTION
The procedure for replacing the backup battery is changed
because of the added protective function for NVRAM data with
V2.30 software.
When replacing the backup battery, upgrade unit software to
V2.30, and replace the battery as described in this technical
bulletin.

If the following error is displayed, the backup battery has
probably expired and should be replaced:
SRW-1 Code 0003 SY NVRAM ERROR
SRPC-1 Code 0103 SY NVRAM ERROR
• Before replacing the battery, make sure the unit is upgraded
to V2.30 or higher. If the battery is replaced without
upgrading to V2.30, original data are not retained, and the
NVRAM ERROR may not be issued correctly.
• The recommended replacement cycle for the battery is every
five years.
• For instructions on removing and installing the battery, refer
to the following maintenance manual:
• SRW-1 Maintenance Manual, Volume 1
Section 1-16. Battery-Backed Memory
Section 1-17. Replacing Batteries for Data Backup
• SRPC-1 Maintenance Manual, Volume 1
Section 1-11. Battery-Backed Memory
Section 1-12. Replacing Batteries for Data Backup
PARTS REQUIRED
Part No. Description Qty.
1-767-156-11
M4T28-BR12SH1 (Lithium Ion Battery)
For SRW-1: APR-65 Board, IC315
For SRPC-1: MB-1002 board, IC2

REPLACEMENT PROCEDURE
Fixtures Required
• PC with HyperTerminal software
• RS-232C cable (J-6531-200-A)
• IF-2 assembly (A-1102-647-A)
NOTE: The IF-2 assembly and RS-232C cable are used
together.
Procedure
1. Set HyperTerminal software as follows:
Bit/second 57600
Data bit 8
Parity None
Stop bit 1
Flow control None
NOTE: Operation is confirmed with Windows XP.
2. Open the covers of the connectors indicated in Figure 1, and
connect the RS-232C cable between the unit and PC.

3. From HyperTerminal, input the commands as follows:
CAUTION: Take care to perform the procedure from the
terminal correctly; if the procedure fails, the recorder may
not function correctly.
NOTE: The procedure uses SRW-1 as the example. In
SRPC-1, APR65 is displayed as SY309.
a. APR65>nvram backup exe
After a few seconds, the following message appears:
NVRAM BACKUP TO SECTOR xx
(xx represents an arbitrary number of 00 - 0F.)
b. APR65>nvram backup check
The following message appears:
CCECK xx OK
c. Confirm the message above appears.
(xx represents a number of 00 - 0F).
4. Turn power OFF.
5. Replace the backup battery as described in the maintenance
manual.
6. Turn power ON.
7. From HyperTerminal, input the following command:
APR65>battery change
RECOVER of NVRAM is executed automatically. If the former
battery is NG (03 SY NVRAM ERROR is displayed), the
following message appears:
Battery change accepted
Please re-power the system
If the ERROR is not displayed, the following message
appears:
Battery is OK
8. From the control panel in DIAGNOSIS > OTHERS > SET
DATA, reset the date and time.
CONFIRMATION
1. Turn power OFF and ON.
2. Wait one to two minutes, confirming that:
• The SY NVRAM ERROR does not appear, and
• REAL TIME of the control panel is normal.
3. Confirm that the format remains the same as the format
before the battery was replaced.
 
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Looking for a long Power Cable for the F35, Lemo 8-pin 3B plug. Any one has one for sale? I got the Anton Bauer Vclx Battey, but it came with no cable. Cheers.
 
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