HMC150 CineGamma vs Sony's CinemaTone

[Exact]

I think the dual recording capability of the NX5U is a great feature to have. I certainly have worried about cards failing on me with my HMC. Hasn't happened yet thank goodness. And I have multiple cameras too, but what if a card fails on me while getting an important closeup or fails on the camera with the wireless mics, losing my sound? I love my Panny, but the dual recording sounds awesome!

I very much agree with the idea that having a ready made backup card would be nice, though of course we could add a backup device via the HDMI output too

In terms of your wireless mic - you could have a second receiver on a second camera and there is your backup

If the NanoFlash were cheaper I would consider it as a backup device too - but not at those prices

 

[studio1972]

I'm hoping that if you are buying this for weddings you are buying more than one camera!

I can't imaging shooting a wedding with a single camera and coming away with anything half decent unless you can manage to stage everything and do retakes! Even then there is no way to synchronize multiple angles.

[not directed at you specifically - but rather people who think weddings can be done with one camera]
What do you cut to while you are moving your main camera?
What do you cut to while you zoom-in (please don't tell me you leave the zoom in the footage!) What do you have as backup footage when 'this' camera is out of focus (for what ever reason - it happens) ?
What do you have as your backup audio recording?
How do you get the bride arriving while still having footage of the groom?
What do you do when you can't get the shot because the photographer walked in front of your 'money shot' camera? It happens more often than you would think!

I typically shoot ceremonies with 3xHMC and the reception with either 2 or 3 HMCs. Occasionally I find myself wishing for a 4th, so I can't imagine having just one!

One of the first things I did when I started in this business was to go on a training course with a guy called Phil Wilson, he is in the IOV which is the UK equivalent of WEVA.

He shoots weddings with 1 camera and he showed us how he does it. The key was that:

a: he was very experienced and very smooth, a very skilful cameraman, works for the BBC often
b: he filmed lots of cut aways during moments he knew wouldn't make the final edit
c: He used should mounted cameras which enabled him to move around without having to make a cut
d: tight editing
e: balls of steel!

He filmed in more of a TV style and looking back my style has gone down a slightly different route, but the end result was pretty flawless from what he showed us.

 

[Exact]

One of the first things I did when I started in this business was to go on a training course with a guy called Phil Wilson, he is in the IOV which is the UK equivalent of WEVA.

He shoots weddings with 1 camera and he showed us how he does it. The key was that:

a: he was very experienced and very smooth, a very skilful cameraman, works for the BBC often
b: he filmed lots of cut aways during moments he knew wouldn't make the final edit
c: He used should mounted cameras which enabled him to move around without having to make a cut
d: tight editing
e: balls of steel!

He filmed in more of a TV style and looking back my style has gone down a slightly different route, but the end result was pretty flawless from what he showed us.

Thanks Stuart - interesting stuff. Looking back at just the last two weddings I've done in the last month or so, I don't see how I could possibly have covered those with a single camera, tight editing and balls of steel or not! Some times there isn't the room to move at all, let alone move without cutting Civil ceremonies seem to be getting in to tighter and tighter spaces

 

[studio1972]

Thanks Stuart - interesting stuff. Looking back at just the last two weddings I've done in the last month or so, I don't see how I could possibly have covered those with a single camera, tight editing and balls of steel or not! Some times there isn't the room to move at all, let alone move without cutting Civil ceremonies seem to be getting in to tighter and tighter spaces

That's what the cut aways are for.

e.g. whilst waiting for bride to enter, film a couple of guests that are sat down. This clip can be used later to hide the moment when you have to move your camera for some reason.

Personally I use 2 cameras. But the second one is unmanned and is only used for <1% of the final edit generally. Used to be more than that though.

 

[Exact]

That's what the cut aways are for.

I have lots of those too....

 

[Lat32Media]

I know this is about cinnegamma HMC VS nxcam - but here is my question. Does it really matter so much? - is it not in post you can manipulate your look excatly the way you want it. In other words, why not start with a clean image without any camera induced coloration - then add rembrand or whatever.

I am another HMC/NX sideline guy, who recently went on pre-order for the sony, here is why:

Once you figure in a decent battery for the HMC + a shutgun mic (even build in mic on hmc is said to be lacking) the price diff. is "only" $500 ! for that amount you get:

Better sound with linear PCM !
Argueably better glas (still decently wide at 29.5 vs pannys 28)
Better steadyshot
Better LCD
higher res
Dual recording
Lens with rings! as the big guys I used to operate

With the current 500 mail in rebate for the 128Gb solid state drive... I was sold.

Ok that was my first message - thanks guys for all I have learned sneakpeaking over the last year!

 

[Jim H]

Once you figure in a decent battery for the HMC + a shutgun mic (even build in mic on hmc is said to be lacking) the price diff. is "only" $500 ! for that amount you get:

Wait, the NXCAM comes with two batteries or one battery good enough by itself, AND it comes with a decent shotgun mic?

 

[Lat32Media]

The nx comes with one battery, thats actually useable. The HMC comes stock with a meager 2600 ma battery. The HMC does have an onboard mic, whereas the Sony has an onboard mic + comes with a shutgun in addition. Adding in the price pr. GB on SD cards vs. 128 GB sony flash drive for $250, after 500 mail-in - I could not pass it up, I was gung ho on the HMC for month though.

 

[Jim H]

The nx comes with one battery, thats actually useable. The HMC comes stock with a meager 2600 ma battery. The HMC does have an onboard mic, whereas the Sony has an onboard mic + comes with a shutgun in addition. Adding in the price pr. GB on SD cards vs. 128 GB sony flash drive for $250, after 500 mail-in - I could not pass it up, I was gung ho on the HMC for month though.

Don't know how I missed it in the B&H listing, it comes with an ECM-XM1. They should list that more prominently in their advertising, since very often prosumer cams are shown with a mounted shotgun mic in the pictures you see even though they don't come with one. HMC-150 is no exception there.

I couldn't find out too much info on the ECM-XM1, but Sony has a pretty decent track record with mics. I will say that I got an HMC150 when it came free with an extra battery and SD card, bought a $200 shotgun, and spent about $120 on extra SD cards (total space of 56 gigs - plenty for me personally). Meaning the NXCAM would actually end up about $700 more, in my personal case.

It does have some quite nice features, though. I think I might wait for it to be released and hear the early reviews, and in particular look for more videos from it before making a decision.