GH2 or TM700?

I just shot a two hour concert with the TM700 in 24p and a hacked GH1 with a 20mm and also the zoom 14-140. I was in the back of the balcony. I had never used the TM700, so we just hit the button, basically, after wasting some time finding the 24p setting (we googled it on the iPhone, after a few annoying minutes with the menus and then the manual). I was shooting a stage that had a lot of detail--finely carved wood, instruments with strings, brass fixtures with detail and curves and so on. Looking at the unprocessed footage on a 40" 1080p monitor, I preferred the TM700 to the 14-140 on the GH13 by a slight but comfortable margin when two feet from the screen. Going back to four feet, a lot of the tiny differences just disappear. With the 20mm, you can get that depth of field, but I have to say the TM700 always held its own and is very easy to use, it has a great lens and the image is like a rock, and the image is amazingly sharp. For me the fan noise was not an issue, but I recorded the audio separately.
 
DrDave, thanks for your input! How do you feel the TM700 compares to the HV20 in terms of sharpness and lowlight? I have an HV30 which is basically the same.
 
DrDave said:
I just shot a two hour concert with the TM700 in 24p and a hacked GH1 with a 20mm and also the zoom 14-140. I was in the back of the balcony. I had never used the TM700, so we just hit the button, basically, after wasting some time finding the 24p setting (we googled it on the iPhone, after a few annoying minutes with the menus and then the manual). I was shooting a stage that had a lot of detail--finely carved wood, instruments with strings, brass fixtures with detail and curves and so on. Looking at the unprocessed footage on a 40" 1080p monitor, I preferred the TM700 to the 14-140 on the GH13 by a slight but comfortable margin when two feet from the screen. Going back to four feet, a lot of the tiny differences just disappear. With the 20mm, you can get that depth of field, but I have to say the TM700 always held its own and is very easy to use, it has a great lens and the image is like a rock, and the image is amazingly sharp. For me the fan noise was not an issue, but I recorded the audio separately.
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So there is some fan noise... i cant use an external audio recorder, so will i hear that noise in the video ?
 
From what I've read, there is indeed some fan noise (similar to the amount of noise you get from the tape mechanism in any mini dv or hdv camera). It is not absolutely noise free as other SD cameras. They say that if you use an external mic (rodevideomic, or any of those) you get rid of the noise.
 
dmoreno said:
I also need to have reliable autofocus for some events and a camera that will hold focus while zooming. This because I've done some gigs where really long continuous shots had to be made (conferences, weddings) and zooming in and out becomes necessary to keep the footage interesting.
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The TM700 is basically a consumer camcorder, albeit an expensive one. Until recently we were using all consumer grade Pannys to shoot band in bars for promo video for them. Every model we used, and over the years there were 4, held focus well while zooming and autofocus was very reliable. I did a seminar just recently and had to use the 45-200 on one GH1. As was said earlier, that was horrible as any movement by the presenter, took him out of focus briefly, and annoyingly so.

I looked at the spec sheets for both the GH1 and GH2 and tried to do it as side by side as possible. I saw enough different and better in the GH2.... FOR ME, to go ahead and order two. I also am considering the TM700 to add to the arsenal as well. That seminar I did, the TM700 would have done fine, as lighting was sufficient and there was no need for glitz, just god solid footage.
 
We use 2 GH1s and a TM700 for weddings, and I find the GH1s far superior. Being able to set the color temperature manually is huge for us. We shoot with the 1.7 pancake lens, a 50mm Nikkor 1.4, the kit lens, and a 180mm Nikkor 2.8. With that combination of lenses, the GH1s can get decent footage from almost any distance. I find the TM700 noisier, and the colours have to be changed in post to match the GH1s. It makes a decent third camera, but now I think I'd prefer another GH1. Of course, I haven't played around with the TM700 very much, so I may not have tapped into it's full potential.
 
Do not underestimate the TM700. When you work with the menus and adjust settings properly it can take some wonderful footage. I almost never use it in "auto" mode unless I'm in rapidly changing conditions doing family stuff. As a stealth camera for corporate work it's saved my butt a couple of times when my "higher end" gear failed me.
 
I totally agree. I keep reading posts of TM700 users who say that when they used it, the settings were confusing, yet admit that they "had not really taken the time to figure out the settings". This camera is extremely easy to set up in the full manual mode. especially with the touch screen controls. Guys, get to know your camera before you take it to the shoot! Expensive camera? I bought 2 of these last August for $750 each.
 
Here is a slo mo clip on Vimeo of a recent night shoot with my TM700 on my rig. 1080p 60fps slowed down to 50% in Premiere Pro CS5. I normally do not include all 4 complete laps, just the closeups on turn 1 and 2. I will post a comparison of the TM and GH1 later.

http://www.vimeo.com/15537580
 
That footage looks great and it has a similar "feel" to what I record with my GH13. Would love to see te comparison! Thanks
 
Re: Low light. I have the HV20 and the HF10 and HF100's as well. I actually very slightly prefer the latter two to the HV20. The HV20 is a tad better on the stair stepping, however. But the HF100 and HF10 have a real pronounced sharpness. Also the anamorphic deal on the HV20 gets old fast, I prefer square pixels. Maybe when shooting in Ultra, ultra low light the Canons have a tad more sensitivity. But the TM700 seemed to produce a more solid image from a distance on the tripod, and there was a bit more color in the colors, if that makes any sense. Also, what noise there was from the TM700 was fine grained, not blotchy, which contributed to the overall image. So if you are thinking of upgrading the HV20 I think you will enjoy the TM700, but for low, low light the GH13 with the Panny 20mm or the 5D Mk II maybe better.

Re: fan noise: I didn't hear the fan. But I didn't hold it up to my ear, either. But since I'm always 15 feet from the talent in a live concert, it would not matter. Definitely quieter than my HV20 which whines from the tape.
Overall: The reason to get the TM700 is because it is a cool cam, but if you have legacy glass or want interchangeable lenses, well it is micro 4/3 all the way. The 700 has a great lens, no question, so it's like you buy the lens and it comes with the camera free.
 
DrDave said:
Re: Low light. I have the HV20 and the HF10 and HF100's as well. I actually very slightly prefer the latter two to the HV20. The HV20 is a tad better on the stair stepping, however. But the HF100 and HF10 have a real pronounced sharpness. Also the anamorphic deal on the HV20 gets old fast, I prefer square pixels. Maybe when shooting in Ultra, ultra low light the Canons have a tad more sensitivity. But the TM700 seemed to produce a more solid image from a distance on the tripod, and there was a bit more color in the colors, if that makes any sense. Also, what noise there was from the TM700 was fine grained, not blotchy, which contributed to the overall image. So if you are thinking of upgrading the HV20 I think you will enjoy the TM700, but for low, low light the GH13 with the Panny 20mm or the 5D Mk II maybe better.
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Thanks for your input DrDave! If I understand correctly, in low light Canon HV20 might seem to be more sensitive (might look brighter) but TM700 has better colors (more saturated) and less noise. Is this correct?
I guess you can always make it brighter on post, having more color to work with and less noise would be good!
 
I too am trying to decide between these two cameras for my applications, which with all my run-and-gun work, tends to be leaning towards the TM700.

One question: Does anyone know if the Blackmagic Intensity Pro will accept the Live HDMI from the TM700?
 
It isn't just the colors, it is the character of the grain. If you look at the specs and see 5 IRE threshold, you think, well, better low light. But when you get down to REALLY low light, like one candle, then you want a camera with interchangeable lenses, like the 5D MkII or the GH1. Once you get above "seriously dim" to just "dim" the extra color and all of the other features make the camera shine. I do some "seriously dim" concerts, and then I put the 20mm 1.7 on the GH13, and all is well, light wise. And the 1.4 on the 5D MKII rocks. Question is, do you want a cam that you have to fuss with, of just a nice compact unit that is designed to do video.
 
I had the sister-model SD-700(same as TM700 but without flash memory) and now the GH1.

The camcorder was better at lowlight and the resolution at 1080p was a tad better(and motion smoother due to higher framerate).
However there were some issues with the camcorder:
- fan noise and useless 5.1 mic picking up every background noise
- annoying message that an external mic(when attached) can get into the wideangle which had to be clicked away on the touchscreen before you are able to record
- bad build quality, feels like a plastic toy
- screen and especially the viewfinder aren´t good because of their very low resolution

AF was better and more reliable.
 
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