GH1 NTSC/PAL Switchable?

B

billy fattey

Active member
Yesterday I broke down and bought the GH1 kit from time2envy on ebay. They called today to verify the shipping address and to see if I had any questions. I ran through all the fears I had.

Is it new in the box and unopened? They said yes.

Is it NTSC and with English menus? They said it is in English and that it is actually switchable between NTSC and PAL. I made them repeat that. They said they "were able to get a group of them".

So can that be true? Should I be scared or overjoyed?
 
You've been scammed.

It is switchable between NTSC/PAL for playback of photos to a TV, but recording is NTSC -or- PAL.

I got my second camera from them today -- the one that they swore up and down would be be NTSC -- and it's PAL.

I think it might be too late for you to do anything, but maybe you can find somebody that wants a PAL one.
 
saaby said:
You've been scammed.

It is switchable between NTSC/PAL for playback of photos to a TV, but recording is NTSC -or- PAL.

I got my second camera from them today -- the one that they swore up and down would be be NTSC -- and it's PAL.

I think it might be too late for you to do anything, but maybe you can find somebody that wants a PAL one.
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Thanks for the help. I paid with paypal so I should have some recourse if they ship me something different than what was listed on ebay. I hope. The funny thing is I could maybe get behind a PAL workflow. Some of the best stuff I've seen has been from PAL cameras.

Correct me if I have this wrong, but to get to 24fps using a FCP workflow I have to...

NTSC (1080 60i 1/50): convert to Prores, remove pulldown with JES deinterlacer
PAL (1080 50i 1/50): convert to Prores which gives me 25fps progressive, then slow down by one frame a second in software (after effects for me) to get 24fps.

So either way, there are two steps. Then with 720p...

NTSC (720p60): Can't truly get to 24fps timeline, but useful for slow motion
PAL (720p50): I believe I get 25fps just dropping this in a 25fps timeline, then slow it down by one frame a second to get 24fps. Or just use 25fps as it is so close.

Is that about right?
 
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billy fattey said:
PAL (1080 50i 1/50): convert to Prores which gives me 25fps progressive, then slow down by one frame a second in software (after effects for me) to get 24fps.
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I just realized that FCP has a "Conform 25 to 24" option which is instantaneous so really that's not even a step. Now, I'm actually hoping time2envy sends the PAL version. I should know Friday. They sent my UPS tracking number this morning.
 
That sounds like an incredibly misleading description Billy.

The GH1 is either / or.

For your sake I hope they don't send you the PAL version as it would be unusable under American electric lights. Unless someone can tell me otherwise...

25p and 50p under a 60hz electricity system is a no no. You will have a flickering picture.

The NTSC model under PAL lighting can at least be worked around. Again, I have yet to see evidence that the same work arounds are true for a PAL model in NTSC land.
 
commanderspike said:
That sounds like an incredibly misleading description Billy.

The GH1 is either / or.

For your sake I hope they don't send you the PAL version as it would be unusable under American electric lights. Unless someone can tell me otherwise...

25p and 50p under a 60hz electricity system is a no no. You will have a flickering picture.

The NTSC model under PAL lighting can at least be worked around. Again, I have yet to see evidence that the same work arounds are true for a PAL model in NTSC land.
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Huh? Is this true? A PAL camera won't function correctly with American standard lights?
 
Wouldn't you be able to set a PAL camera to 1/60th (or 1/120th) shutter and avoid flicker that way? Just like you can set an NTSC camera to 1/50th (though you then can't shoot 60p - or rather you get doubled up frames)
 
yabyum said:
Huh? Is this true? A PAL camera won't function correctly with American standard lights?
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Neither does a 24 fps movie camera. On film sets standard fluorescents are replaced with ballasted ones that run on DC not AC. Incandescents aka light bulbs are not a problem since they are to slow to flicker with the AC frequency and stay stable.
 
Martti Ekstrand said:
Neither does a 24 fps movie camera. On film sets standard fluorescents are replaced with ballasted ones that run on DC not AC. Incandescents aka light bulbs are not a problem since they are to slow to flicker with the AC frequency and stay stable.
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Ah I should've phrased that better. I meant like film lights... like a 2K fresnel or a kino-flo or something like that. Guessing that it's not a problem since like regular light bulbs they are slow to flicker.

Interesting that Fluorescents flicker according the to the 60Hz standard (probably obvious for some of you though lol).
 
Martti Ekstrand said:
Neither does a 24 fps movie camera. On film sets standard fluorescents are replaced with ballasted ones that run on DC not AC. Incandescents aka light bulbs are not a problem since they are to slow to flicker with the AC frequency and stay stable.
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I noticed the thing with incandescents here in the UK as well. Fine with a NTSC camera even at 1/60.

I have a few questions for anyone who has used.. or might be using in the future... a PAL camera in NTSC countries...

I suspect it will have problems under 90% of lights, especially street lights but I need someone to prove me wrong. My NTSC camera operates at 24p, 30p or 60p. At 30p the flicker of street lights is slightly visible. At 60p it is horrendous. But I can set the camera at a 1/50 or 1/100 shutter to avoid this.

In a NTSC country, the lights go at 60hz, which is FASTER than the PAL GH1 can record, in any mode. I suspect a 1/60 shutter in 50p mode would not cut it, it would not sync.

A NTSC camera in PAL land doesn't have the same problem, because at 1/50 shutter, the camera operates slower than full 60p, meaning it is properly synced at 1/50 or 50hz.
 
guiscard said:
I need to buy a PAL GH1 in the U.S. This ebay seller is reliable for PAL GH1s?
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Just send a PM to one of the dvxusers who got caught in this predicament. This ebay seller is the same as this one webstore that is very shady in their business dealings. I don't recommend rolling the dice and sending them money.
 
commanderspike said:
But does the PAL model flicker? :)
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Yes. Under standard fluorescent lighting, horribly. Can't be set to 1/60. If you never ever plan to shoot under that kind of lighting, you'd be ok. I plan to shoot in a variety of settings, and I frequently have little control over lighting, hence this was unacceptable for me.

Fortunately I have a NTSC GH1 in my hand. Unfortunately, I have a PAL GH1 sitting at my house (200 miles from where I am now) .
 
That's really funny. I broke down and bought a GH1 from time2envy last week as well. I thought they were the only ones to have gotten the US GH1. Sadly, when I received it I saw on the box that it was PAL, when I accessed the "film mode" it said AVCHD/25p, it came with an additional European plug, and the instructions had certain words spelled differently like "programme" and "colour". Dead giveaway that its the UK version. IN ADDITION TO THAT - they forgot to include the card reader, they upgraded me to glass filters, but they were too small, the wide angle lens they included was too small, and the additional "longer life" battery that I bought didn't work in the camera. They let me return it for a full refund, but it's obvious that these people have no idea what they are doing -STAY FAR AWAY-
 
Doom Egg said:
That's really funny. I broke down and bought a GH1 from time2envy last week as well. I thought they were the only ones to have gotten the US GH1. Sadly, when I received it I saw on the box that it was PAL, when I accessed the "film mode" it said AVCHD/25p, it came with an additional European plug, and the instructions had certain words spelled differently like "programme" and "colour". Dead giveaway that its the UK version. IN ADDITION TO THAT - they forgot to include the card reader, they upgraded me to glass filters, but they were too small, the wide angle lens they included was too small, and the additional "longer life" battery that I bought didn't work in the camera. They let me return it for a full refund, but it's obvious that these people have no idea what they are doing -STAY FAR AWAY-
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Well, last night I got my GH1 from tiime2envy and pretty much had the same experience as you. I went into this with my eyes open so I just sort of laughed when I saw PAL on the box. It's definitely a returned item that had been repacked less than perfectly. The filters were the wrong size (52mm instead of 62mm). Several items that should have been in the bundle were missing like the tripod, wide angle adapter, and 2x tele. Other than that though, I love the camera.

As soon as I read other people's reports of problems with time2envy I bought an NTSC GH1 on ebay from an individual. That one also came last night so I've been able to compare them. I've really had a hard time deciding which to keep. I love how easy the PAL workflow is compared to NTSC, but the fluorescent flicker is a definite problem.
 
Ripped off!!!

Ripped off!!!

I am extremely pissed. Time2envy tried to charge me $300 in restocking fees because I didn't include a piece of cardboard that held the GH-1 in the box. I told them to screw off, and disputed the charge on my Credit Card. They then had the BALLS to return the package to me, saying it was damaged and that I COULDN'T RETURN IT!!!!!

If anyone deals with these pigs, I hope you have a better experience than me
 
Doom Egg I live in PAL country and pick up an envelope of money tonight finally in order to buy a PAL GH1. Can I ask where you are in the world?

If you are interested in selling a PAL GH1 I'm in 100 percent. The only way I can pay for it however is thru a Western Union transfer, you will receive the cash ten min after i send it at any WU in your loc. Also I'll have to ship it DHL on me to bypass customs.

I live in Beirut, and there is NO way to buy this thing here, even the D90 is by 3 week order, needs special permission from the min of defense, and sells here for 2000 dollars last i asked (two days ago). I would love a GH1 and can finally afford it in this week's frame.

If this is good for you, would you be interested in selling? Name your price. Also have you any adapters or should I find those?

Tarek
 
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