doubledark
Well-known member
I'm over in Adelaide watching your replies with interest ��
Similar end use
Similar end use
GH5 Game Over, Panasonic
- Thread starter Jim Simon
- Start date
fboonzaier
Well-known member
If you are actually comparing the C4KPC, GH5 and 5s, for shooting narrative of any kind, the cost comparison is the least important part of the equation as the cost differences are minimal in the world of shooting commercials or films for that matter. Usability and reliability however are far more important. As for DR, if you're shooting narrative, you are lighting, so a stop here or there is overcomable....what is not, is a crew staring at you because your camera is not working...time will tell how the pocket does, but as any of these 3 would most likely be used as a B or C or crash cam on a project of any sizable budget, that ratchets up the pressure of the cost of a crew even more....and whatever camera is chosen, had better work when it's needed to!
icarusfilm
Veteran
If I was getting my first general purpose camera on a budget I would go for the GH5 there is simply nothing that ticks as many boxes as that one. It will do for you 95% of everything the GH5s and the pocket 4K will do.
joe12south
Veteran
You're ignoring everyone who is funding their own kit or their own entire production. I start shooting a micro-budget feature November 10th. I could spend the rest of the day listing things that would return more value (i.e. show on screen) for $2,000 than a different camera. Hell, I'd rather spend it on better craft services than a camera with equal or worse PQ.
fboonzaier
Well-known member
Actually I'm not ignoring anyone and to quote you, could spend all day trying to list all the various ways in which someone may use one of these 3 cameras...regardless, for me reliability and usability is at the forefront, once I am satisfied with the image....I care little what anyone thinks as I'm making the project...I understand however, that you will be shooting a micro budget feature on the BMCP4K as your A cam...are you directing or are you the DP? If I was making the same call, I would not be planning to shoot a feature with a camera in 25 days that many have not even received yet. As you have a GH5 I realize you have a back up or B cam....what mystifies, is how you would live with the "inferior" image you keep referring to on the GH5? After all, micro budget or not, unless it's your project, someone's putting up the money.
Bern Caughey
Veteran
Reports of issues caused by the thickness of the P4K’s Sensor Stack are starting to emerge.
http://www.bmcuser.com/showthread.php?22425-Soft-edges-with-wide-angle-lenses-on-the-BMP4K
http://www.bmcuser.com/showthread.php?22425-Soft-edges-with-wide-angle-lenses-on-the-BMP4K
joe12south
Veteran
I'm pretty sure myself and my AD can learn a camera in a month. ;-)
If I find any dealbreakers, I'll fallback to the GH5 and a recorder. Because I can "live" with an image doesn't mean I won't strive for better.
Bern Caughey
Veteran
Based on user’s feedback I’m even more convinced the P4K is not for me, & likely canceling my P4K preorder, but on a positive note I picked up Olympus’ 12-100mm f/4 lens based on Uri’s (aka ‘icarusfilm’), & John Brawley’s, recommendations, so thanks to both of you!
While scouting a gig in NYC recently we realized we needed a 3rd Camera Op, & though we had enough Cameras we were short a couple of Zooms, so decided to grab the 12-100mm at B&H. Worked well on the project, but have yet to put it fully through it’s paces. f/4 is a bit limiting, but sort of expected on a 8:1 zoom.
Love the zoom range, manual focus clutch, sharpness wide-open, & overall build, so expect it will be a keeper.
While scouting a gig in NYC recently we realized we needed a 3rd Camera Op, & though we had enough Cameras we were short a couple of Zooms, so decided to grab the 12-100mm at B&H. Worked well on the project, but have yet to put it fully through it’s paces. f/4 is a bit limiting, but sort of expected on a 8:1 zoom.
Love the zoom range, manual focus clutch, sharpness wide-open, & overall build, so expect it will be a keeper.
Bern Caughey
Veteran
That would be a fantastic option, but it have to have at least a 96mm front, & be heavier than a brick. As John mentioned, I’d love to see Olympus update their 14-35mm f/2. I used that lens (& still own it) up until Panasonic released their 12-35mm f/2.8.
joe12south
Veteran
I too love that much range in one lens, but my concern is with how deep the shallowest possible DOF. f4 DOF on M43 looks like f5.6 full format. That makes it really hard to craft a shallow-ish look. Not to mention needing a lot of light.
Matt Gottshalk
Resident Preditor
Drop a milvus prime on a speedbooster and that problem goes away right quick.
joe12south
Veteran
??? A Milvus prime has exactly zero range - it's not a zoom. You'd need $7K and a Pelican case full of Milvus lenses to equal the range of the Oly.
icarusfilm
Veteran
Thomas Smet
Veteran
Don’t you mean f8 on FF? F4 would be f5.6 on APS-C. With that said a lot of movies have been shot at f5.6 on 35mm motion picture film so that’s not such a bad thing.
Thomas Smet
Veteran
Although not the same thing this is where dual native ISO on the GH5s is really important. ISO 2500 shooting with that f4 lens is like shooting f1.6 with ISO 400. Slow zooms take on a whole new level of usefulness which is why I consider the gh5s a better video production camera than the GH5. Using that 12-100 or even the 14-140 is suddenly useful in less than optimal situations.
Cary Knoop
Veteran
So far,
after 96 whopping pages,
Panasonic is still in the game.
:tongue:
after 96 whopping pages,
Panasonic is still in the game.
:tongue:
filmguy123
Veteran
I've been bouncing this one back and forth for a while, and if you've read previous posts, you know I'm a fan of the image quality of this camera and have seriously looked at adding it to my budget and kitting out properly.
But as the excitement fades, I'm leaning no. Granted, I don't need a camera for $1300 - I weight this and the Panasonic S1 for projected $3500-$4000 as same, I am more looking at this "tool first, price second". I like the image aesthetic on this so much that I'd consider it more as an EVA1 replacement than a GH5 replacement, with only a single stop loss of Dynamic Range... and in that light, by the time you kit this thing out to the moon it still comes under the body only price of the EVA1.
Yet I'm currently thinking I'll likely pass, only because of pragmatics... I'd rather put the $2200 I'd spend setting it up at a basic level as money towards a Leica R prime set which will basically soften down the EVA1/GH5 and probably work great on the Panasonic S1 to boot... and then it's all a super reliable, interconnected ecosystem.
If I had an Ursa Mini this would be a no brainer.
However, maybe I am over estimating the "stickiness" of 1 camera ecosystem with Panasonic and the value of color matching and pragmatism. Maybe if I really invested right, I'd be happier with the BMD ecosystem. But it seems more practical to have an EVA1, GH5, GH5s, and S1 than it does to throw a Pocket 4K with its own totally different quirks into the mix.
Thoughts?
But as the excitement fades, I'm leaning no. Granted, I don't need a camera for $1300 - I weight this and the Panasonic S1 for projected $3500-$4000 as same, I am more looking at this "tool first, price second". I like the image aesthetic on this so much that I'd consider it more as an EVA1 replacement than a GH5 replacement, with only a single stop loss of Dynamic Range... and in that light, by the time you kit this thing out to the moon it still comes under the body only price of the EVA1.
Yet I'm currently thinking I'll likely pass, only because of pragmatics... I'd rather put the $2200 I'd spend setting it up at a basic level as money towards a Leica R prime set which will basically soften down the EVA1/GH5 and probably work great on the Panasonic S1 to boot... and then it's all a super reliable, interconnected ecosystem.
If I had an Ursa Mini this would be a no brainer.
However, maybe I am over estimating the "stickiness" of 1 camera ecosystem with Panasonic and the value of color matching and pragmatism. Maybe if I really invested right, I'd be happier with the BMD ecosystem. But it seems more practical to have an EVA1, GH5, GH5s, and S1 than it does to throw a Pocket 4K with its own totally different quirks into the mix.
Thoughts?
joe12south
Veteran
I'm not sure why you think there is any practical advantage to mixing EVA1 or S1 with the GH series over mixing any other camera. Even matching a GH4 and a GH5 is the same amount of effort as a different camera. There is some muscle memory to the layout and menus...but the EVA1 and probably the S1 will be different enough that that advantage is rendered moot. They use different batteries, different lenses, etc.
I've only had the P4K for less than a day, and can't really make any comments about working with the files yet, but I CAN say that the physical controls and ESPECIALLY the menus are like a breath of fresh air. It is almost like the first time I used an iPhone instead of a feature phone. The GH menu system feels like it was designed in 1979 Soviet Union compared to the BMD menu system.
Still, for me, it's all gonna come down to over/under exposure tests. The GH5 is unforgiving. You can push/pull a stop if you have to, but even that introduces unwanted color shifts. If the P4K image holds up like I expect, then i'll be a very happy camper.
PS. The P4K is definitely *not* a rugged camera like the GH-series. It feels more like the EVA1 and other video cameras in that regard. It won't be going on safari with me.