FS700 - 120FPS 4K Raw

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DanKov

Well-known member
I hadn't seen anyone post this yet so it may be a helpful resource in talking about this cameras new features.

Looks like we will have to go through Sony's set-up to get the most out of 4k.

http://www.sony.co.uk/pro/product/35mmdigitalmotionpicturecamerascamcorders/nex-fs700ek/overview


Advanced firmware provides 4K RAW and 2K RAW output on AXS memory with HXR-IFR5 adaptor plus HFR

An optional advanced firmware upgrade permits the NEX-FS700EKto capture stunning 4K RAW movie footage or 2K RAW with the AXS-R5RAW recorder over 3G HD-SDI using HXR-IFR5 interface unit. The NEX-FS700EK can also capture 4K RAW at High Frame Rate (HFR) of 100 frames per second (fps) or 120 fps for approximately 4 seconds, and 2K RAW at 100 fps, 120 fps, 200 fps or 240 fps continuous recording.
 
"The FS700 will required a paid service upgrade"

So the firmware is not free then, not sure what was promised when the 700 came out.

So the Sony solution uses the HXR to decode the FS700 custom compressed RAW to the standard sony RAW to record via the recorder. Yields 16bit ilnear RAW files, now whether the 700 sensor is capable of actually generating 16 bit files in terms of dynamic range is another question.

I wonder if there is any sample footage or timelines yet?

The Sony PR also claims a cost effective entry level 4K for the 700 solution but by the time you add the camera, interface, recorder and whatever firmware cost isn't that going to push it beyond an F5?

Interesting, can't wait to find out more - who's at NAB who can hassle sony for the full details?

cheers
Paul
 
Hopefully it's only a paid option for 4k raw and their own recorder. Idk how they expect to be competitive in the market if they charge a pretty penny just to unlock the damn thing before you even buy a recorder.
 
I don't believe Sony said anything about paying for a firmware upgrade or not. We knew hardware was required. It depends how much really, you know what happened with slog and the F3.

The Sony solution looks pretty costly, the recorder is £4500, a battery is £400, a 512GB media card is £1400 plus the cost of the interface unit, whatever that may be. So at least £6k/$9k, perhaps more *and* a paid firmware on top of that. I would guess the firmware is required for the Odyssey as well, that way Sony can still make some money.

Of course the Sony solution can be used on F5 and F55 as you upgrade so it could be a longer term investment although i would guess the same applies to the Odyssey.

But when faced with a choice - who would actually go for the Sony solution? And sony have to make a dedicated interface box for it. What i don't understand is the business case for Sony producing this interface unit, because i can't see very many people going the sony route unless of course they own the rest of the kit anyway.

Thoughts?

cheers
Paul
 
odyssey dont offer what sony does! sony solution gives u 4k up to 60p real time, plus up to 120fps slow motion for 4 seconds recording, but odyssey gives 4k up to 30p real time.
 
stefanhuberfilms said:
The odyssey also doesn't offer 4k raw, compressed 4k only...
Click to expand...

Really? We await proper confirmation but we might be mixing up the fact that the only output is compressed RAW from the HDSDI port. Sonys own interface box decompresses that to 16 bit linear so their recorder can record it as if it was an F5 or 55.

The 700 output is supposed to be lossless so can be decompressed back to full RAW.

The Odyssey AFAIK takes this compressed RAW signal and decompresses it to 'something' RAW. There are questions about what that 'something' format is. I think it would be actually *more* difficult to reencode that RAW from the camera into another 4K codec format. Maybe it does that as well, but i would imagine the simplest thing for them to do is just blast the decompressed RAW onto SSD.

cheers
Paul
 
After watching a product video from Sony (on vimeo) it seems that the Odessey will record 2K Cinema DNG files up to 240 fps or 4K DPX files up to 30 fps. Whereas the Sony R5 will do 4K 60 fps in 16 bit linear RAW.

There's no indication what the bit depth of the DPX or Cinema DNG files are.

Of course confirmation from CD themselves will verify this

cheers
paul
 
Wait and see what the price difference will be between the odyssey 7q including the right codec cost and the sony option. Just saw the sony interview on the sony 35mm facebook page, i think its really cool that the recorder must not be snapped directly to the camera and the normal batteries can be used, so the recorder and the interface could act as a counterweight when shooting on a shoulder rig...
 
stefanhuberfilms said:
Wait and see what the price difference will be between the odyssey 7q including the right codec cost and the sony option. Just saw the sony interview on the sony 35mm facebook page, i think its really cool that the recorder must not be snapped directly to the camera and the normal batteries can be used, so the recorder and the interface could act as a counterweight when shooting on a shoulder rig...
Click to expand...

have u seen an image of that counterweight? its crazy bulky - i doubt anyone will use it this way! - i think the only option is to get a very long sdi cable ....... and just put that "counterweight" on a flour.
 
Really excited to see some news about this! It just seems like the Sony unit is so huge! Very interested in that Odyssey 7Q, even though i bought a new monitor just last year. :undecided
 
anatusa said:
yes they told from the beginning that there will be a payed firmware update !
Click to expand...

NO !! They never told it.. and on USA Sony site was always remark about "any firmware update is free of charge" ...
But what's coming to my mind now.. even my English is not so good .. maybe I'm wrong, but look: NEX-FS700 will need a service upgrade (paid option) .. I don't see even single word about FIRMWARE ... Maybe they need to DO some actual HARDWARE change in FS-700, ( removing Low-Pass filter, for example :) ) so we have to send camera to Sony Service Center.. so this PAY maybe some little pay for just cover cost for actual work in Sony Service Centers ?? We need to know exact price and all details for this matter!
 
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anatusa said:
have u seen an image of that counterweight? its crazy bulky - i doubt anyone will use it this way! - i think the only option is to get a very long sdi cable ....... and just put that "counterweight" on a flour.
Click to expand...

yes i saw it, its bulky, and ugly as hell, but as long it delivers what my clients will need in future its ok for me, wish they had not built that handle on the interface unit though...
 
DanKov said:
Fingers crossed for at least 12 bit. I wonder if the 4k compressed will still be 444?
Click to expand...

If it's truly a series of DPX files then yes, probably, it's RGB 444 and 16 bit - however is the camera putting out 16 bit range, i'm not so sure on that.

As an experiment i actually used the stills mode of the 700, which is basically 4K res. It's not RAW but jpeg, even so i'm well impressed with the output, so that's got me quite positive about how 4K could look from this sensor. We certainly don't need an new OLPF because the one that's there is for 4K. Try the stills mode for yourself. I bet hardly anyone has ever taken a still with their 700 (me neither)

Stefan,
I still think the price difference will be quite high. I really don't understand why the interface box is as bulky as that, especially if it's only designed for the 700! If you want to rig it then you're going to have an issue with the SDI cable being to close unless you have an uber long rig.

I think Sony have been quite clever with CD, because the odessey could be a half way solution to the full RAW, we'll just have to wait for more details and samples.

Also the odessey is quite large for an operating monitor so if you have that forward of the camera when handheld the weight might be an issue.

cheers
paul
 
has there been any pricing info on the interface unit?
i saw that the recorder will need the big battery block on the back, is that a v-mount battery? does anyone know if the aux port (BNC) on the AXS-R5 Recorder is usable for monitoring?

EDIT:
HD output for monitoring
HDMI/Component/Composite video outputs on NEX-FS700 and the AUX OUT of the AXS-R5 can be used for monitoring purposes.
 
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