FS-100 Picture Profiles

LiamR said:
Go into the picture profile on the camera (located on the left hand side interface through the button, appropriately titled "picture profile")
Go into which ever Picture Profile you are using, 1,2,3,4, etc... then find you way to 'Black Level' and bring it back down to the setting 0.
Click to expand...

well, not exactly. this is as good a starting point as any. i think what frank means is that for every scene, you have to look at the black levels and adjust them so as to not crush the shadows. unfortunately, the LCD displays on these prosumer cams really aren't good enough to make an adjustment to your shadow details. If you're in the studio, a quality WFM is the best way to adjust the black levels. If you're in the field, run and gun, setting a value is based on experience. That's why a good videographer gets paid the big $$$$....right?:shocked:
 
Right, that´s why the word "variable" black levels shows up on my presets. Adjust per scene.

And yeah, my camera monitor has an WFM on board - without that you can only guess.
On the other hand, I found that 0 to -3 is where I mostly end up - just to give you an idea.

Frank
 
LiamR said:
Go into the picture profile on the camera (located on the left hand side interface through the button, appropriately titled "picture profile")
Go into which ever Picture Profile you are using, 1,2,3,4, etc... then find you way to 'Black Level' and bring it back down to the setting 0.
Click to expand...

but he wrote

Black Level: variable

so or it's variable or it's zero ... I don't understand
 
Setting Knee

Setting Knee

Setting the black level is a little problemattic without a WFM. Setting Knee and Slope is a little more convenient. If you set the zebra to 100% and the exposure to show zebra on the hi-lites, then one can go to the PP of choice, then adjust the knee and slope to make the zebra in the hi-lites just disappear. Watching the monitor, you can tell, pretty easily when the hi-lites get blown out.
 
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gianx80 said:
but he wrote

Black Level: variable

so or it's variable or it's zero ... I don't understand
Click to expand...

Okay, I try to make it a bit clearer.

With "back to zero" I mend the zero line on the WFM.
That can be - depending on your scene +2 or -6 ore anything else in the Black Level setting

hope that helps,

Frank
 
Im still struggling with highlight rolloff

Here we see an image with a a fairly extreme dynamic range, also the beauty dish is a really nasty test item because of its tonal roll off

Ideally I would be exposing near the card and letting the highlghts blow

I cant get rid of the stepping in the roll to white at the top end, yet if I stop down to protect my highlights I dont think the card is recoverable in post - certainly not by any tech I have Access too

Any comments?

Best effort - out of camera



View attachment 38634

With mids pushed and tops desaturated..

View attachment 38635

And ungraded frame with the highlights retained uncorrectable IMO..

View attachment 38636
 
Can you bring in the files in Linear, not 709?

there's so much more to play with if you don't kneecap it at the start

d
 
Morgan, do you have a WFM?

Correct me if I´m wrong, but from what I can see, after Viemeo did his "magic" - you highlights ar way over any healthy level.

Frank
 
In the system i use for gradeing/finishing i have to chose an input LUT, normaly for 709, it's 709.. but if i chose Linear, or REDlog, or Alexa800, or anyone of a huge pile of LUT's in have in a folder for input then the media does not have 2.2 gamma curve added..

this makes major diffrence in what you can see and work with from any camera.. i don't know FCP or PP, but i understand you can chose linear in PP, and i think you are hosed in both FCP & MC.. not sure about Vegas, i have not played with the licence i got with the camera..

If you can interpret the media in linear then, and really only then can you see what's really in the shadows, noise or detail or some of both...

Useing linear or 709 really depends upon your target deliverables to some extent, but i still am gradeing in Linear today, a combo of Red & Alexa, using Arri LUT's for the Alexa, and PD985 for the RED, output for this is for digitalcinema so i'm working in P3...

many choices beyond 709, even if your target is 709.

d
 
Postmaster said:
Morgan, do you have a WFM?

Correct me if I´m wrong, but from what I can see, after Viemeo did his "magic" - you highlights ar way over any healthy level.

Frank
Click to expand...

Im constructing a test - what happens if your highlights are way over a healthy level?

I see that one is going to have (small quantities) of unhealthy highlights in many images hopefully in a much smaller % of the image in reality

(unless you are shooting with a truck of HMI for every exterior)

Be that sun reflections on shiny objects, a blown window in an INT

If a camera does not roll to white smoothly it makes a massive difference to 'real world' DR if you have to protect every highlight, every reflection, every practical source in frame

In these tests im only interested in the roll off

BTW I have tried some other tests and am likeing your PP as there seem to be a few less flouro colours than mine at the top end

----

Dermot - seems like Im not able to access the same level of post that you are Im on FCP

S
 
This is an example image (shot on my 5d)

It is a realistic situation - a RnG job, we see a practical in the image an also a blown window

There is some but minimal 'Gack' or 'Plastic' around the practical and the window

I had to let them go to blown or the job would have completely changed in nature ie requiring a big lighting rig, ND of the window or something

As it was I used no light, reflection or anything, so was able to be in and out of that location in 2 mins

Im just not getting that roll off with my FS yet..

6.jpg
 
Indeed - IMO for the camera to really perform - utilise fully the great low light (and availability of fast glass) you need to be able to control incedental highlights

or you are just back to evrything taking half a day to shoot any locaton - I could do that with my EX1/Letus in 2008

S
 
Currently In this aspect and this aspect alone, I think the canons are better

although looking at the image above maybe they are not that good either (see the flouro light)

S
 
Postmaster said:
Okay, I try to make it a bit clearer.

With "back to zero" I mend the zero line on the WFM.
That can be - depending on your scene +2 or -6 ore anything else in the Black Level setting

hope that helps,

Frank
Click to expand...

Thanks, I missed some posts. It's all clear now :)
 
morgan_moore said:
Currently In this aspect and this aspect alone, I think the canons are better

although looking at the image above maybe they are not that good either (see the flouro light)

S
Click to expand...

I wholeheartedly agree. In that aspect alone. I find the highlights on the FS100 just aren't as nice. But that's controllable...
 
I absolutely disagree. I've shot extensively with the 5D/7D and in my experience with the picture style options available in camera, you are always stuck balancing highlight handling with contrast, where with -4 contrast you have hard clippy highlights but good latitude and with 0 contrast you have a better highlight rolloff but less latitude and too much contrast for most situations. And both contrast settings still handle highlights worse than the FS100 with a carefully set picture profile. For this reason I had to build my own picture style gamma curve for the 7D in PSE, which is a great option to have, but that has plenty of its own limitations.

I've had the FS100 for 2 months now and have shot with it quite a bit and I've found with the right picture profile settings, I've never seen a prosumer camera with such great looking highlights with the small exception of blown highly saturated primary color highlights (F3 and FS100 both have this issue).

At the moment I use cinematone1 gamma, 75% +1 knee, and cinematone2 matrix. This knee setting also helps limit highlights to 100ire to avoid various post workflows clipping superwhites (had a lot of issues with this on 7D/AF100).
 
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