From xf100 to xc15 or C100 mkII? Having headache about making a decision...

M

MEDIA101

Member
The work I do is mostly run 'n gun stuff and I love to use the Canon XF100 for it. The fantastic codec and ergonomics are just great to me :) Every once in a while I'd like to do some more 'challenging' stuff though. I bought a GH4 with a couple of lenses but the DSLR way of live is not for me. The fiddling with screw on ND's, having to change the camera in a sort of add-on contraption to do simple stuff and the small screen really annoy me...

It's time to replace the XF100 and for some futureproofing and added extra's like reframing I'd like to go 4K, but Canon really, really makes it hard to stick with the brand. Because of the Canon colors I would like to stay with Canon because there usually is no time or budget for grading in post. (Unless someone really f*cks up) So... now there are the XC10 and the XC15. Didn't buy the XC10 yet because of the lack of proper audioconnectivity. And the screen is on the back of the cam which is a pain in the b*tt when you're interviewing (I am a one-man-band). Price (in Europe) is €2750 and then I'll have to buy 2 Cfast cards so I end up spending about €3500.

But lately I started getting in love with the C100II, beautifull images, very nice AF, nice formfactor with a screen that can be flipped to the side during interviews and whatever lens you like (I have some Tamron glass for my 6D). Unfortunately the internal codec sucks compared to the XC15 and the XF100(!) and no 4K (Canon, I hate you for that!). The C100 is offered including the 18-135mm iS STM (I know, I know...) AND an Atomos Ninja Blade for €4599...

Am I mad to even consider spending 4500 euros for a 2K camera? I am sort of scared to spend this kind of money on a 2K camera in the exploding market of 4K camera's...
So should I go for the XC15 with 4K and save €900 or...?
 
How much video are you shooting with your XF100? A camera is only part of the equation. What would you do with an C100/300/500 Arriflex that you aren't doing now with the XF100/GH4? Time to take a step back and check your objectives. OK, still want more impressive camera. Personally, I think the XC10/15 is a bit silly, especially as an A cam. For the C100 II I think in your position I'd maybe be looking for good used, but if one doesn't show, Christmas is not so far off, it's a good mitigator of guilt for large purchases and a rationale for procrastination, there also will be a wider range of good cameras available in your price range, like the Panasonic AG-UX180.
 
Canon does a lot of things right, but they've been very slow to adopt 4K and high frame rates. I still have my XF305, and it makes some very nice HD video. I like the colors and the lens is very good. But, they dropped the ball on 4K and HFR so I started looking around and found that Sony has both of those areas well covered. Taking a slight hit on color and lens performance, I now own the FDR-AX100, PXW-FS7, and most recently the FDR-X3000 action cam. All Sony. The thing about Sony is, if they don't have something you like today, just wait a month or two and they'll put out some more models. I'd suggest taking a look at what they have and see if you find something in your price range that fits your needs. Maybe the FS5 or an X70 will get it done. I've seen video from the Sony's that looks great. I haven't been able to get the Canon look yet, but it's me, not the camera. Have to learn to use Resolve and set up the camera properly is all. Sony has also been a bit of a bargain compared to the Canon products, which always seem to be at least 20% over-priced. In my opinion, some Canon L series lenses are no better (optically) than the non-L glass. I like my Canon gear, but they just fell behind lately.

Mark
 
Rainer said:
How much video are you shooting with your XF100? A camera is only part of the equation. What would you do with an C100/300/500 Arriflex that you aren't doing now with the XF100/GH4? Time to take a step back and check your objectives. OK, still want more impressive camera. Personally, I think the XC10/15 is a bit silly, especially as an A cam. For the C100 II I think in your position I'd maybe be looking for good used, but if one doesn't show, Christmas is not so far off, it's a good mitigator of guilt for large purchases and a rationale for procrastination, there also will be a wider range of good cameras available in your price range, like the Panasonic AG-UX180.
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Don't really care about 'impressive', and the XF100 still serves its purpose but it's at the end of it's live. So I'll have to replace it. Have been watching Panasonic AG-UX18 but availability is not before november and I don't like the 'colorscience' of Panasonic (test-driven the DVX2000 and own a GH4). It's fine when lighting is consistent but with a mix of different sources skintones are 'off' fast I think.

Mark Watson said:
I started looking around and found that Sony has both of those areas well covered
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True. The FS5 seems a real player and ticks all the boxes. But it is even more expensive (and has only mediocre AF). I could probably live with the AF, but price is an issue...
Also checked the JVC GY-L300. Nice connectivity, good price and formfactor but not so nice IQ as far as color goes and EVF and viewfinder are useless when going manual.
 
Mark Watson said:
Canon does a lot of things right, but they've been very slow to adopt 4K and high frame rates. I still have my XF305, and it makes some very nice HD video. I like the colors and the lens is very good. But, they dropped the ball on 4K and HFR so I started looking around and found that Sony has both of those areas well covered. Taking a slight hit on color and lens performance, I now own the FDR-AX100, PXW-FS7, and most recently the FDR-X3000 action cam. All Sony. The thing about Sony is, if they don't have something you like today, just wait a month or two and they'll put out some more models. I'd suggest taking a look at what they have and see if you find something in your price range that fits your needs. Maybe the FS5 or an X70 will get it done. I've seen video from the Sony's that looks great. I haven't been able to get the Canon look yet, but it's me, not the camera. Have to learn to use Resolve and set up the camera properly is all. Sony has also been a bit of a bargain compared to the Canon products, which always seem to be at least 20% over-priced. In my opinion, some Canon L series lenses are no better (optically) than the non-L glass. I like my Canon gear, but they just fell behind lately.
Click to expand...

Agree with you 100% Mark. Canon has lost so many customers to Sony as of late, so I really hope they become more competitive and get the specs and features right on the next versions of the Cinema series cameras. There's no way I'd pay full price for a C100 Mark ii today for what it offers (not saying it's a bad camera by any means - it just doesn't give you enough bang for the buck at that price imo). I'll wait and see what they come up with next and make my decision then.
 
I have used the XC10 and C100 (Mk1) extensively, and would not buy the XC10/15 for more than an occasional gimbal cam. Simply put, the C100 upres'd to 4k is sharper and all around better than the XC10 4k at the highest codec.

Of course there are the many other bummers about the XC10/15, including poor low light, and the impossible manual focus wheel - you have to rely on its slow AF.

There are times it's super great to have, like being able to handhold a little camera and shoot at extreme telephoto (over 400mm with the 2x teleconversion), and still have it come out steady. But most of the time, it's more frustrating than it's worth. C100 on the other hand, always a pleasure to use.

Cheers,
Slavik
 
At work we recently purchased 2 xc15. For a quick grab and go camera without too much hassle setting up, it's very good. If you want c log, it's got it. If you want a 24-70mm f4..... It's got it. That's what's mainly on our C100 anyway....

Alot of people are so focused on changing lenses and having a low light blurry background. For something that pushes out good looking footage with good audio... It's hard to beat.

As for deciding which to get... I think if you want something that will last you for a few years, the C100 is the right choice. Xc15 is situational.

This was typed up on my phone outside a shopping mall clothes shop while my gf takes forever... I just had to reply
 
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