GH2 Flat picture styles on GH2

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david-

Member
I've researched a lot in this forum and some threads has touched the subject but I haven't found a straight answer.

My question is:
Is there a flat picture style like Marvel or CineStyle for GH2?

I know all the tips of making the scene as flat as possible by using Smooth and set everything to -2 but still it isn't as flat as Cinestyle-scenes. I know the picture is way cleaner with the GH2 but when color grading a scene it's way better to work with a flat footage with very high dynamic range.

So if someone know if there's a similar profile for GH2 I'd be grateful!

Thanks!
 
david- said:
I've researched a lot in this forum and some threads has touched the subject but I haven't found a straight answer.

My question is:
Is there a flat picture style like Marvel or CineStyle for GH2?
Click to expand...

There isn't.

I know all the tips of making the scene as flat as possible by using Smooth and set everything to -2 but still it isn't as flat as Cinestyle-scenes. I know the picture is way cleaner with the GH2 but when color grading a scene it's way better to work with a flat footage with very high dynamic range.
Click to expand...

Well if you were shooting a better format, that might be true. 8-Bit 4:2:0 is 8-bit 4:2:0, flat doesn't get you anything but a gross image in the end if that's what you're shooting in camera. It's not even 4:2:2 or 10-bit =P Shooting flat is just working against yourself.

Shoot closer to what you want and you'll always get a cleaner/better image.
 
@kholi I'm unsure about whether shooting "flat" on even 8-bit 4:2:0 is working against yourself as opposed to getting it close in camera (although this might be preferable for other reasons). I only say this because I read a contradictory thing from Stu Mashwitz (of Prolost and DV Rebel's guide) where he encourages flat shooting even on 8-bit 4:2:0 (like the dvx or the 5d).... I just don't know.... especially with the increased bitrate of the hack giving a bit more flexibility for post manipulation.
 
If you find that post I'd be willing to read and see why he would encourage that.

Here's a twitter post of his I googled up: http://twitter.com/#!/5tu/status/64379824277438464

Shoot flat, but not TOO Flat.

Cinestyle = TOO flat for 8 4:2:0

The Right flat coming out of the GH2 is definitely Standard or Smooth, both of which net a ton of detail that you may not think's there. If you convert with 5DtoRGB using 709 and Full Range you'll have plenty of flat to work with.

By plenty I mean a ton, and by a ton I mean all that you'd ever need from this camera.
 
That sounds right Kholi! And the vid... yeah, maybe too flat. I know a lot of people don't like cinema, preferring smooth and standard. Too my eye, Cinema has the most pleasing color rendition. It also gives more of the image over to the midtones than the other modes, which I sort of like. Highlights can clip in an ugly way if you don't manually white balance (to a gray card or equivalent)--some people mistakenly think it's inherent to the mode itself.
 
Same feeling as you, my friend. That's why I stuck two grey cards in the kit, and never walk out to anything important without them.

I'm going to try more cinema to 5DtoRGB soon, one thing for sure is that the Cinema curve would help with shooting daylight, as it underexposes the top thirdish of the curve out of the gate. Less ND to worry about.

In a perfect world, I almost think that when we DO get film modes I'll want one specifically for daylight shooting. A curve that shoves a mostly linear curve down so that you don't have to use much ND or close down. Far more important to feed the sensor light.
 
Kholi,

I've been meaning to ask you - as I've found your studies of the GH2 picture profiles the best information so far - have you tried Nature out? According to the 2nd post on this page over at PV http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/comment/41817 the waveform and vectorscopes of Standard and Nature look quite similar, but Nature looks a touch flatter and just a touch less saturated (although I must admit, I'm new to reading waveforms and vectorscopes.) I've read other people say that Nature gives better skin tones as well.

One more questions for you, I believe I read somewhere that using a manual white balance is not a good thing to do on the GH2 as it can give the image more grain. Have you noticed that at all?
 
Joshua Cadmium said:
Kholi,

I've been meaning to ask you - as I've found your studies of the GH2 picture profiles the best information so far - have you tried Nature out? According to the 2nd post on this page over at PV http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/comment/41817 the waveform and vectorscopes of Standard and Nature look quite similar, but Nature looks a touch flatter and just a touch less saturated (although I must admit, I'm new to reading waveforms and vectorscopes.) I've read other people say that Nature gives better skin tones as well.
Click to expand...

I'll experiment with nature tomorrow, see what I get. I'm always game for more accurate skin. It kind of makes sense that Nature WOULD give you the best, if it's a profile balanced for the many occurring hues and shades in nature. Depending on nationality, skin's got a lot of various pigment in it, it's hard to find a digital sensor and processing that caters to this reality, but now that I think about it... I wonder which camera--Canon or Nikon, fairs better for nature shooting.

Seems like that camera would also be the one to replicate skin the most accurately.

ANyway, Yeah I'll mess with it tomorrow and run it through 5DtoRGB as well.

One more questions for you, I believe I read somewhere that using a manual white balance is not a good thing to do on the GH2 as it can give the image more grain. Have you noticed that at all?
Click to expand...

Manually dialing the Kelvin? Yeah, for whatever reason it looks bad.

Manually balancing to a grey card? Nope. Between that and using the presets it always seems to fair the best. I'm more inclined to use a grey card, but admittedly it's probably because it "seems" like the best way to go about things. In the end, I actually don't know much more beyond the fact that it always gives me the most accurate color to start with, and fixing the white balance later is a step that I don't want to have to deal with in post.
 
Kholi said:
I'll experiment with nature tomorrow, see what I get. I'm always game for more accurate skin. It kind of makes sense that Nature WOULD give you the best, if it's a profile balanced for the many occurring hues and shades in nature. Depending on nationality, skin's got a lot of various pigment in it, it's hard to find a digital sensor and processing that caters to this reality, but now that I think about it... I wonder which camera--Canon or Nikon, fairs better for nature shooting.

Seems like that camera would also be the one to replicate skin the most accurately.

ANyway, Yeah I'll mess with it tomorrow and run it through 5DtoRGB as well.
Click to expand...

Awesome! I'm really very interested to see what you think of it.

I just looked back at the DPReview review of the GH2 and, looking closely at the Kodak Q-60 chart - specifically L 13-19, I noticed that Standard looks like it might be a little inaccurate, especially in cyan, magenta, and blue, while Nature looks the closest to Cinema colors, except for maybe Smooth, which looks closer to Cinema in cyan. Also, based solely on these images it looks to me like Smooth might be the least sharpest, followed by Cinema.

Cinema: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/panasonicDMCGH2/SAMPLES/rawpage/Picstyle-Cinema.jpg
Nature: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/panasonicDMCGH2/SAMPLES/rawpage/Picstyle-Nature.jpg
Standard: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/panasonicDMCGH2/SAMPLES/rawpage/Picstyle-Standard.jpg
Smooth: http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/panasonicDMCGH2/SAMPLES/rawpage/Picstyle-Smooth.jpg

Kholi said:
Manually dialing the Kelvin? Yeah, for whatever reason it looks bad.

Manually balancing to a grey card? Nope. Between that and using the presets it always seems to fair the best. I'm more inclined to use a grey card, but admittedly it's probably because it "seems" like the best way to go about things. In the end, I actually don't know much more beyond the fact that it always gives me the most accurate color to start with, and fixing the white balance later is a step that I don't want to have to deal with in post.
Click to expand...

That's great to hear. I'd much rather manually balance, but what I read scared me off. Is there any ideal way of white balancing to the GH2 that you use? What grey card are you using?
 
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