First C300 Footage

on the one had, in terms of "1080p" workflow and delivery, the canon kicks the scarlet's a** bigtime since "2k" on scarlet crops the sensor down to 2/3 . . . we had that for some time now. . . (and the 120fps you dont need every day, probably not even on every project no matter how popular slomo is) so in the end, you get 2k for around 15k US from RED where es canon gives you much higher quality images (they are using "actual" 4k to get a super clean 1080p) + its S35 sensor.

scarlet is perfect for epic users or those who have the workflow for "eevrything RED" , though i can get myself a kickass maschine for 2000$ US that'll work easy with red footage on 3k and you dont HAVE to use 4k monitors, btw ;) 2560x1440 monitor and proxys are totally enough

check this out, should give a better understanding on "hat you REALLY get" and "when" ;)

http://nofilmschool.com/2011/11/ready-shoot-prices-canon-eos-c300-red/
 
Last edited:
klas said:
You do realize that, let's say, a 5DMii still is over 5k, right?
Click to expand...
Yeah, i shoot "over 5K Stills" with the 5dmk2 everyday. Now, take that image into photoshop, enlarge it to 100% view, and see just how NOT good your lenses are. The Scarlet will cost you more than the C300 to be up and running. Especially if you add the PL mount to scarlet. Add up all additional costs that you WILL spend on a RED system.

OK, edit using proxies then as Klas mentions. Just another step in the workflow. More storage. More time.

4k!....4Kool-aid more like it. It will come, sure. But until you walk into Costco and see a 47in. 4k Vizio for $1,800, you're stuck at 1080p. AMC (ya know, THe Walking Dead) just added an HD 1080 feed. JUST ADDED it. SuperHD (4k) is further away than you think for broadcast.
 
dustylense said:
OK, edit using proxies then as Klas mentions. Just another step in the workflow. More storage. More time.
Click to expand...

Yeah, and some people already have additional steps. I don't edit AVCHD either, I convert to ProRes. Just because you can't handle the extra step doesn't mean other people aren't willing to take that hit I've downloaded EPIC footage to play with on my edit machine and I honestly didn't think it was horrible to work with.

Sure, I'd like to be able to drop to 1080p in camera as the C300 is doing, but I'd also like more resolution AT 1080p. I can still get that running at 4k when I downsample.

I think many people on here who are able to buy a Scarlet are probably smart enough to also figure out what that means to their workflow, or else, they probably wouldn't be smart enough to be making that much cash in the first place.

The Scarlet has pluses and minuses just like every other camera that is out there.

That said, this thread is about C300 footage, let's try and keep it on that please.

I'd really like to see some unedited footage out of the C300. As others have said, I am pretty impressed with the resolution I've seen so far. Definitely higher than AF100, FS100 and F3 for sure.
 
I would like to see Mobius downloadable in original pre-stream uncompressed format.

There's a major artifact in it and I'd like to see if it's just vimeo or the 8bit on the C300.
 
@dustylens

Boy do you sound bitter. Are you an editor? Have you ever worked with RED footage? While I don't own a RED, I do edit a lot of RED footage and it's not that big of a deal (with and without the Red Rocket). And yes, I view it at 1080p (GASP!!!). You really need to adjust your attitude... it won't get you far in this game...
 
Piolet said:
The funny thing is Canon rates the C300's DR at only 12 stops with Canon log.
Click to expand...

Yes, there's something I'm missing.

There are many signs that this sensor has low noise: (1) Canon's new DSLR has great low light ability, (2) This camera goes up to ISO 20000, and (3) it is only about an 8 MP sensor.

Well, isn't dynamic range related to noise level? By dipping further into the shadows, you get better dynamic range.
It at least should vary with ISO. If it gets 12 stops at ISO 400, couldn't it get 16 stops at ISO 6400?
 
Last edited:
pinger007 said:
@dustylens

Boy do you sound bitter. Are you an editor? Have you ever worked with RED footage? While I don't own a RED, I do edit a lot of RED footage and it's not that big of a deal (with and without the Red Rocket). And yes, I view it at 1080p (GASP!!!). You really need to adjust your attitude... it won't get you far in this game...
Click to expand...

First, let me say that I'm gearing my views to those that would move from a Dslr, af100, fs100, or 1/3" like the XF305 to this RED Scarlet. Ya know, the NOT Peter Jackson's. I'm talking to the corporate shooters, indie guys shooting skate vids, the guys shooting their dog at the beach. The guys shooting commercially for big corporations like Toyota, use whatever gets the job done for you. Have at it! But let's NOT quickly forget that Scarlets history went from 3k for 3k to what they announced yesterday.

So, IF you're already invested in RED, yesterday was great news. If you are committed into investing in RED, yesterday was great news. IF you are going from 5dmk2's and thinking of RED, you better have awesome credit! Some really believe that a $14,000 purchase and you're complete with being a RED shooter? LOL! There's not a coffee strong enough to wake up a smell if you think thats the case.

To answer your question, am I an editor. Well, I shoot so yes, I am an editor. I also shoot and hand off editing. I've shot RED, and handed it off. I've shot F3 and edited it. I shoot AF100 and edited it and handed it off. Now let me ask you a question? You say you edit "a lot" of RED footage. Is that on a system you own, or at a production house where you sit in a seat? Let me ask you another question. Let's say ALL you did was edit RED footage, and you had to own your own editing system and be as productive as the next production house that can handle the job. Now this is going to be your production house, you own it. What is the very minimum you think you will spend of a editing system for just that "single" seat, and to turn the product around in this fast paced world? Think about your client being in studio and wanting to see the results then and there. How much are you going to spend to comfortably ingest and output the product?

As for being in the game. What game? There are many games in moving pictures. Next week I begin 3 shoots. All for corporations. Not one's like Lexus and UPS. But they are multi million dollar corporations. I will take in about $25,000 just for shooting. Mostly talking heads, then some crane shots, dolly shots and possibly a remote heli shot. None of them will care about what camera I'm using. For 2 of them I decided I'm going AF100 (actually 3 of them) and 1 will be the rented F3. I will be the editor in 2 of the projects and 1 I will hand off. But all 3 want a fairly quick turnaround (or as we call it, deadline). In the end, the client will look at the completed project and I guarantee they will not ask me what I shot it with. Once completed I will show them the master version for for final approval on a +50in. 1080p television compressed to h.264. WIll they sit 2 feet away from the monitor and pixel peep? NO. In fact, they will turn to me and say "great job" because 2 of the clients I've already worked with. So I work with what I feel will get the job done. The only time I've ever been required to shoot with a certain system was for Showtime's Dexter promo. Guess what they requested I use? Did you say 5Dmk2? I talked them out of that request.

So you ask me to adjust my attitude? For what? Trying to state that the next great skateboard film will be silly to shoot in Scarlet? 3k for 3K, remember? As I have said, the Scarlet is the B cam for Epic owners. Thats how I see it.
 
Hold on guys, you didn't consider that you'll also need a house to sit in when you edit RED footage! That's another $500k right there! Cannon: $20k! RED (after adjustments): $514k!

Dustylense, this is silly. A working RED camera is $14k, and after that the investments are exactly the same as they would be for any other camera system.
 
I say again, if you are spending $14k for a camera, I think you'll know what you need. I don't think it's going to be kids shooting skateboard videos, or music videos of their friends. If I decide to go the Scarlet-X route, it will be the base $14k setup with one additional SSD. I've already played with Epic footage to get an idea of what my system will do. Not worried at all about that. My requirements I know, so it is easy for me to decide what I can and can't live with.

And Neex, good thing I just built a new studio, or else that would be another expense I didn't think about :)
 
Rick Burnett said:
I say again, if you are spending $14k for a camera, I think you'll know what you need. I don't think it's going to be kids shooting skateboard videos, or music videos of their friends. If I decide to go the Scarlet-X route, it will be the base $14k setup with one additional SSD. I've already played with Epic footage to get an idea of what my system will do. Not worried at all about that. My requirements I know, so it is easy for me to decide what I can and can't live with.

And Neex, good thing I just built a new studio, or else that would be another expense I didn't think about :)
Click to expand...
Rick, at that $14000 price tag, are you eventually gonna mount any PL glass?
 
@dusty

"To answer your question, am I an editor. Well, I shoot so yes, I am an editor."

Makes perfect sense. The logic truly astounds me. I shot home movies with my parent's VHS camcorder back in the late 80s... did that make me an editor?

"Now let me ask you a question? You say you edit "a lot" of RED footage. Is that on a system you own, or at a production house where you sit in a seat?"

My own systems. 70% at my home studio workstations, and 30% on location with one of my laptops. :) If I'm too busy with other projects, then I'll outsource to another studio.

"Let me ask you another question. Let's say ALL you did was edit RED footage, and you had to own your own editing system and be as productive as the next production house that can handle the job. Now this is going to be your production house, you own it. What is the very minimum you think you will spend of a editing system for just that "single" seat, and to turn the product around in this fast paced world? Think about your client being in studio and wanting to see the results then and there. How much are you going to spend to comfortably ingest and output the product?"

Well, since I've already built these workstations, I can answer with confidence that it costs approximately $1400 not counting monitors per workstation. Capable laptops ran me $1200 each. These allow me to turn the product around very quickly. But regardless, this question about only editing RED footage doesn't hold up with your entire argument. You yourself claim that you edit RED, avchd, mxf, h.264, etc. I don't know anyone in Chicago who edits exclusively with RED.

"But all 3 want a fairly quick turnaround (or as we call it, deadline)."

"Deadline", huh? Must be an industry term. Thanks for the heads up on that. Proves you're a pro!

I ask you to adjust your attitude because you are adding nothing of value to the discussion; all you're doing is bashing a product. Is it a product that should be used by skateboarders to film at their local park? No. It's unreasonable to assume something so ridiculous. All you're doing is rambling and ranting, which is an impressive feat considering all the quick turnarounds you have (or as we call it, deadlines) to worry about.
 
Here's some C300 footy. Pretty nice looking....ready to grade.


Here's a graded version btw. (I don't like it much....too much magenta for my taste)

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top