FS7: Fellow Americans: Has Anyone Recently Entered England Without a Carnet?

What about heading to the USA? I've got various shoots in the USA coming up and, although we'll be pretty low profile and could probably get away with a broken up FS7 that looks relatively "prosumer", it would be more comfortable to take kit in and out legitimately. Last time I took a Beta SP cam through (Atlanta Olympics 1996 - yikes, yes I'm that old...), we had the full carnet with serial numbers etc.

I'm intrigued by the "U.S. customs certificate of registration" mentioned above.

Anyone know if there's an equivalent U.S. customs certificate of registration for us Johnny Foreigners to take kit in and out of the USA?

Ben.
 
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nedcam said:
When I re-entered the US they were so busy and overworked they just waived me through, even though I had a large ENG camera on a shoulder strap, I looked like a network news guy.
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Ned,

Everytime I’ve traveled with a Carnet we made sure to get it stamped upon re-entering the USA. Not sure if that’s necessary but suggest contacting your broker to find out.
 
Bern Caughey said:
Ned,

Everytime I’ve traveled with a Carnet we made sure to get it stamped upon re-entering the USA. Not sure if that’s necessary but suggest contacting your broker to find out.
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Say that again. Ned .did you go through the RED goods to declare section.. like I said you have to tell them you have a carnet that needs to be stamped.. its not up for debate or if you can get away with it.. you well might have trouble getting your deposit back if your carnet is not all stamped up properly .. that would definitely include your re entry stamp !! carnet is a passport for your gear..its a serious document .. leaving and coming back.. TBH Ned you should have looked into this a bit more sounds like you didnt really have a handle on the process at all..
 
bengiles said:
What about heading to the USA? I've got various shoots in the USA coming up and, although we'll be pretty low profile and could probably get away with a broken up FS7 that looks relatively "prosumer", it would be more comfortable to take kit in and out legitimately. Last time I took a Beta SP cam through (Atlanta Olympics 1996 - yikes, yes I'm that old...), we had the full carnet with serial numbers etc.

I'm intrigued by the "U.S. customs certificate of registration" mentioned above.

Anyone know if there's an equivalent U.S. customs certificate of registration for us Johnny Foreigners to take kit in and out of the USA?

Ben.
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Ben, the 'customs' form is for the country you leave from. This is the one I use when traveling to non-carnet countries.

https://assets.publishing.service.g...ploads/attachment_data/file/374161/ce1246.pdf

What it allows you to do is export and then re-import your kit back through UK customs without hassle, it has nothing to do with the country you are traveling to. In the case of the US, if you are entering with a kit, you need a carnet or be prepared to face trouble.

I frequently travel to the States, sometimes with a carnet and sometimes sneaking through. I would never advise anyone to sneak through, that has to be up to the individual production and how much ball ache they are prepared to go through should it go wrong. However, even with a carnet you may still face issues; some US airports are designed with no regard for how borders work and have staff who don't know the rules or how to apply them. If traveling through La Guardia, for example, according to manager there who I had a lengthy chat with, you have to go to the freight terminal two days before you fly to get your carnet stamped.

PM me if you need any specific advice.
 
Eeeesh! I must say that I was so sleep deprived and the process of getting through customs had the longest lines, I didn't think of getting the carnet stamped. I do not believe they are holding a deposit for me, it is my understanding that the $424 for the carnet is a fixed cost. I will call tomorrow when the carnet issuing company opens. As I think about all my foreign travel, I was never the one to get the carnet. The clients merely asked me for a list of my gear, their serial numbers and value.

At London I went to the red door for commercial entry. Sensing he was a grump of an agent I got him congratulating me for traveling on my 65th birthday. He did not ask to look at any of the gear.

Besides the carnet issue, some countries, most notably Canada, do not want we US cameramen working in their land. They require paperwork that takes about 3 months to complete, from their department of labor, which explains why a Canadian cameraman can not do that work. I assume they do this so large Hollywood crews don't steamroll them and destroy their industry, regardless of NAFTA. I had once completed that paperwork and waltzed in long ago. Then the next time I did not have the time to do it and I was stopped and TURNED AROUND at the Toronto airport. Sent back to Chicago on the next flight. In sum, the repercussions, including financial, of not being there the morning of the shoot are very dire and embarrassing. Recently, and I had posted here and then removed it, I was asked to shoot in Vancouver and Toronto. I knew from experience I would be stopped at their airports so I decided that I would go in with just my Osmo and hire local DPs, who I found through Production Hub, who would then become my soundman and I use his camera. This is how I have done Canada the last 20 years. However...my budget became so high the client asked me if I could just "refer them to a cameraman." This is also the problem with Carnets: the budget gets so high they decide to hire a local rather than travel us.

I must say that the US does the same to Canadian shooters. It is so well known that they are stopped at O'Hare customs that I had made a good living servicing Toronto clients who were afraid to travel in with their DP. I have made a specialty in matching the work of others by communicating with out-of-town DPs, renting their model, using their scene files, discussing their lighting gear, reviewing clips. That's all the clients care about: Matching. Also, Chicago is so expensive to put up your DP, feed him, rent a car, etc...

I do not know the answer to how easy a foreign DP can enter. It seems that the equipment has gotten so small, if you are a DSLR size shooter, and everything fits in consumer suitcases, I think you can waltz through. I did not see randomly anyone yanked out of line to be checked. But if you have Pelicans and pro looking cases, that may raise an eyebrow.

Also, I now see why I am retired. That shoot, in that heat, at that speed, was a brutal call buster, even for a 25 year old shooter. I just want to do 2 or 3 days a month, tops, of corporate talking heads!

Best,

Ned
 
I shoot in the USA often and have no problems at the border. Why? Because I am shooting for a Canadian company, and bringing my footage back to Canada to edit and because I am being paid as a Canadian by a Canadian company. All of my gear is registered with the Canadian Border Services and I have stamped documentation from them. Better than a carnet in my opinion just a pain in the ass to get it. I also carry a letter for each production from the senior management of the company I am working for that states where I am going, what I am shooting and who is paying me and when I am returning. It gives their contact info as well.
My understanding is the same policy applies to Americans working in Canada. However, if there is a form of co-production, or there is Canadian government funding being applied to the project being shot, such as a feature or doc or the like the game changes and then you should expect issues. Many many American producers come to Canada to do work here because there is a tax incentive that often flows through a Canadian company. All too complicated for me, but does go to support the thought that the only people who really make money are the lawyers and the accountants in this biz.
BTW, last week on my way home landing in Montreal with my carryon pelican and backpack I ran into a NYC crew shooting a "series" with 20+ pelicans and several tripod cases. They were a great group and looking forward to checking out my home town. When asked they replied "no problems with border control" and "where is the best part of town to party?" I replied, anywhere you are in Montreal.
So the what this thread mentions often is : It depends who you get at the border crossing. Most of the time honest people making and honest living will be recognized as such. We can all expect a hassle now and then somewhere, like the Atlanta TSA officer who insisted on taking each lens out of its case and putting them all together in a plastic tub to roll around as then went through X-ray. Nothing I could do but watch and hope.
 
Because you still have the camera I believe you should be able to sort the Carnet out. A few years ago a Production I was on had a hassle with a Leica M lens that South Africa thought we didn’t RE-export. Not sure how it got singled out of the 20+ cases we were traveling with, but even though the lens was in our possession back in the USA, it still took six months to sort out.

On another occasion we didn’t get a Carnet stamped on the way out of Senegal simply because it was early, & the office was closed. Not sure why that didn’t come back to bite us, but suspect our Fixer may have made a donation, or two.

Puzzles me why so many countries are eager to jump on the Carnet bandwagon. So may times there’s Customs agents who have never seen a Carnet before, & often the ones that have still get the paperwork wrong. Even agents in LA are often clueless. Probably the best Carnet experience I’ve had was departing San Fransisco where the Customs agents really knew their stuff. Chalked that up to all the prototypes coming to & from Silicon Valley.
 
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Going into Canada from the US as a professional working cameraman with gear has always sucked. I went there on a trip as a teenager and it was great. I went back roughly a decade or so later on a shoot and I really didn't think they were going to let me in.
 
Hi Ned.. I hope you dont have problems but part of the carnet process,well in my experience anyway.. is you have to leave a deposit that is a certain percentage of the total value of all the gear on the list.. thats why you tend to put the values down a bit within reason.. you return the carnet to them.. they check it and reimburse your deposit .well send it to your bank..I once had a customs officer rip out the wrong page of a carnet luckily my home airport.. I didnt catch it at the time ..but when I took it back to the issuing office.. they wouldn't give me back my money as the carnet was "incorrect".. and it had to be sent back to the airpot, the guy had signed it.. but the wrong page.. so he was easily traced.. another new page ,which I was charged for !!, had to be added.. and he had to re sign it.. and take out the page he was meant to.. was a real hassle..
 
Thanks Liam. Will take a look and possibly give you a shout when we’re heading back to the USA. My instinct is to split the camera up between 3 of us in our hand luggage. That’s what we’ve been doing in Nepal for the past 3 years. The whole carnet thing seems woefully anachronistic.

Ben.
 
bengiles said:
The whole carnet thing seems woefully anachronistic.

Ben.
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I was going to add that same thought to this discussion!

It all seems rather silly in this day and age where nearly every traveler is "importing" an electronic device. A video camera ( albeit small ) if not also a laptop. I suspect that the carnet thing hangs on because of the fees / taxes it generates. Possibly as well as a result of a hostility towards media / press on the part of governments. Governments like having a means of knowing who is coming into the nation to record content and why. And an easy excuse to harass or prohibit if they so choose.
 
bengiles said:
Thanks Liam. Will take a look and possibly give you a shout when we’re heading back to the USA. My instinct is to split the camera up between 3 of us in our hand luggage. That’s what we’ve been doing in Nepal for the past 3 years. The whole carnet thing seems woefully anachronistic.

Ben.
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The trick with going in without a carnet is to sound as dull as can be. Don't say you're going in to make an award winning documentary, or anything remotely pro media, say you are there for a meeting with Kraft Cheese and the camera is just to record the meeting for an exec who was scared of flying.
 
JPNola said:
I was going to add that same thought to this discussion!

It all seems rather silly in this day and age where nearly every traveler is "importing" an electronic device. A video camera ( albeit small ) if not also a laptop. I suspect that the carnet thing hangs on because of the fees / taxes it generates. Possibly as well as a result of a hostility towards media / press on the part of governments. Governments like having a means of knowing who is coming into the nation to record content and why. And an easy excuse to harass or prohibit if they so choose.
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It's not just media who need a carnet, it's every commercial business. I hate them, but have to deal with them - PITA and will only be worse after Brexit.
 
Actually carnets were introduced to make life easier.. try doing it without one.import and export .. !!.. of course just not having one is easiest.. till your gear gets impounded or you get fined or both.. its just down to your own risk levels .. your own shoot.. well too bad and a good dinner party story.. a shoot your being paid to do for a production company.. a very big problem.. potentially a large loss of income.. and the story gets around your market.. oh the guy who didnt get a carnet and ruined that 6 week shoot.. personally I would never want to take that risk.. but each to their own..
 
UPDATE FROM OP (Ned):

One of the posters said I was suppose to have had the carnet certified upon my re-rentry, which I was too tired to remember to do. So I called my carnet issuing company and they said: YES, ONE IS SUPPOSE TO GET THEIR CARNET STAMPED UPON RETURN TO THE US. This took 3 hours out of my life yesterday, I had to shlep all the gear to the customs office at O'hare. So remember that! Get it signed when re-entering the states. Now back to retirement...
 
nedcam said:
UPDATE FROM OP (Ned):

One of the posters said I was suppose to have had the carnet certified upon my re-rentry, which I was too tired to remember to do. So I called my carnet issuing company and they said: YES, ONE IS SUPPOSE TO GET THEIR CARNET STAMPED UPON RETURN TO THE US. This took 3 hours out of my life yesterday, I had to shlep all the gear to the customs office at O'hare. So remember that! Get it signed when re-entering the states. Now back to retirement...
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hate to say I told you so.. :).. I wish I could retire .. good luck ..
 
You rolling the dice flying without one, and yes its luck as you arrive at your destination airport but if it goes wrong, it goes very wrong.

Back in the day 1991, i had a colleague fly out to the channel Isles which I understood to be a part of the UK with a £23,000 Spectrum analyser (used for alignment of TV transmitter gear), it was clearly stamped property of BBC etc. On his return without a carnet, it was seized at the airport and took weeks ot get back. HMRC (UK gov) knew it was BBC gear but played hard ball.

I recently spoke to the German gov department (IHK) on Carnets and media visas, they were very helpful but told me of the horror stories of individuals caught without either.

My understanding of a carnet is to prove that you are not exporting/importing the gear (smuggling) hence the bond which is the value of taxation or import duty. Recently I had to leave a deposit of 40% with a German bank to obtain a bond to get a carnet for a job in Japan.

The last horror story I heard of was a German guy working in the USA for a week without a carnet or visa.
His gear, a Canon 5D plus accessories was seized, the radio mics gave it away. He was fined quite heavily, banned from the US for yrs and deported, he had to seek the services of a US lawyer to help. It was very messy and costly for him, the German government dept pulled lots of strings to help.
 
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