F65 Getting Cheaper

Well, this is the tendency now and everyday cameras are depreciating quicker. Look at how fast new cameras are coming to the market and from totally unexpected manufacturers.

For 26.5K I think I would rather go with a F65 than a F55. F55 is around this price range right? Even though the F65 is a huge beast it looks much better.

Anyway, the F35 forum is pretty quite. I wonder if there is anything to do with the new announcements by blackmagic and AJA.

If any F35 owners out there are feeling like jumping ship or feeling buyer's remorse and want to get rid of their F35s let me know. I'm looking for a good deal on one. ;)

I'm thinking with these announcements the F3 and F35 prices will drop even more on Ebay, so I'm waiting till May or possibly June to see if the AJA and BMD really ship and if they influence the prices even more. At this point the F35 is the only 1080p camera worth getting into.
 
Well, the aja and BM cameras are 0.0% interesting for me. Sure, the specs on paper are nice, until you look at the footage. No thanks. All these new brands are getting better at building cameras, at very competitive prices, but they seem to forget the most important thing: how the images look.

Lets say this again: the F35 was built in an era where the king was 35mm film and this camera was developed to mimic film as close as possible. These days it's more about clean high ISOS, saturated colors etc. It's not good or bad, it's just different.

On the other hand, the A7s looks like a great camera :D
 
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macgregor said:
Well, the aja and BM cameras are 0.0% interesting for me. Sure, the specs on paper are nice, until you look at the footage. No thanks. All these new brands are getting better at building cameras, at very competitive prices, but they seem to forget the most important thing: how the images look.

Lets say this again: the F35 was built in an era where the king was 35mm film and this camera was developed to mimic film as close as possible. These days it's more about clean high ISOS, saturated colors etc. It's not good or bad, it's just different.

On the other hand, the A7s looks like a great camera :D
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Where did you see footage from the Ursa and Cion? Can you post the link? I looked and couldn't find any so I thought there wasn't any footage available.

But you knocked the cameras, specially the AJA which is a very well thought out design and then praise a compressed 8 bit consumer photo camera? Don't understand. You must really like Sony.:)
 
SJX said:
Where did you see footage from the Ursa and Cion? Can you post the link? I looked and couldn't find any so I thought there wasn't any footage available.

But you knocked the cameras, specially the AJA which is a very well thought out design and then praise a compressed 8 bit consumer photo camera? Don't understand. You must really like Sony.:)
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I have my reasons. And those reasons are don't get obsessed by specs. Numbers are a great game, but if we were all following numbers we should all have Red ones at home.
The BM is just the same camera they have now with a different body.
The Aja uses the same sensor and if that's not enough, watch the footage on their site.
The sony A7s, despite being only 8bits and a DSLR, produces fantastic images. And shoots in Slog. And it's FF. And super tiny. And cheap.
You may think 8bits is ****. Sure 10bits is so much better, but as an example just try grading F35 8bit Slog files in a 32bpc program and you'll be amazed at the results. Want me to post results?
 
No onboard recorder with the F65, so if you want the max quality from the F65 which streams 16-bit double bayer RAW output at around 5Gbps you will need to look at something like the SR-R4 for an additional $16k.

Well of course you can just add a 10-bit 422 recorder but...
 
starcentral said:
No onboard recorder with the F65, so if you want the max quality from the F65 which streams 16-bit double bayer RAW output at around 5Gbps you will need to look at something like the SR-R4 for an additional $16k.

Well of course you can just add a 10-bit 422 recorder but...
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That F65 comes with the SRR4
 
macgregor said:
I have my reasons. And those reasons are don't get obsessed by specs. Numbers are a great game, but if we were all following numbers we should all have Red ones at home.
The BM is just the same camera they have now with a different body.
The Aja uses the same sensor and if that's not enough, watch the footage on their site.
The sony A7s, despite being only 8bits and a DSLR, produces fantastic images. And shoots in Slog. And it's FF. And super tiny. And cheap.
You may think 8bits is s*%t. Sure 10bits is so much better, but as an example just try grading F35 8bit Slog files in a 32bpc program and you'll be amazed at the results. Want me to post results?
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Sure. Would love to see them.

About the AJA, just because it's the same sensor doesn't mean same image. F3 and FS100 are same sensor and quite different images.

Even the Ursa may be improved since processing power is much higher now. But I agree it will most likely be very similar if not the same. But AJA could look different.
 
SJX said:
Sure. Would love to see them.

About the AJA, just because it's the same sensor doesn't mean same image. F3 and FS100 are same sensor and quite different images.

Even the Ursa may be improved since processing power is much higher now. But I agree it will most likely be very similar if not the same. But AJA could look different.
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Go to AJA website and watch the footage. Done. Moving on...
 
macgregor said:
Go to AJA website and watch the footage. Done. Moving on...
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When I looked at their site there was only a presentation video with a couple of close ups of flowers and watches in the end. No real footage. If they have posted more footage I will check it out.

Edit> Just checked. Still the same video. Those close ups are too conservative to judge anything. Looking forward to real footage.

But what about the offer to post some frames:

macgregor said:
You may think 8bits is s*%t. Sure 10bits is so much better, but as an example just try grading F35 8bit Slog files in a 32bpc program and you'll be amazed at the results. Want me to post results?
Click to expand...

Genuinely interested in seeing as I'm seriously about to jump in the F35 train.
 
SJX said:
You can always dirt up the clean images and turn it around to the right direction.

But you like the A7s? It's very clean and clinical even at 12000 ISO.
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Exactly, but being Slog and that much DR and acceptable colors, I think applying a film print and some grain could make it look really nice.

Want to try gradnig an 8bit Slog file? Here you go: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13362047/pastor.mov Just convert it to 8bits and then grade it at 32bits.

But again, if your budget is limited, the A7s is great news for you. I think it's going to be a fantastic camera and a really strong bridge between consumer and pro market that makes you wonder how that thing can cost $1699 and a F5 almost 20K.
 
Is the price fixed at $1699?

If they had offered clean 10 bit out would be another story. But we know why they didn't.

Who knows, maybe sony will think the camera is too good and dumb it down before release. Have they said when it's shipping?

But I want to see real footage in the hands of people who are not trying to cover it's mistakes like you do when shooting an official promo demo. See how bad is rolling shutter, skin highlights etc. Then I judge.

Low light is amazing though.

How many stops do you guess?

Thanks for the files. So they are 10 bit?

Can't download now. Need to get back to my station first.
 
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macgregor said:
Want to try gradnig an 8bit Slog file? Here you go: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13362047/pastor.mov Just convert it to 8bits and then grade it at 32bits.
Click to expand...

People must be crazy if they think 8-bit can be graded: (sarcasm)

Download graded image straight from server (no seriously download it and then view it.)

macgregor_pastor_zps40a26b72.jpg
 
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I have one question about the cion having the same sensor as the Blackmagic Camera. AJA's website says that their sensor is 22.5 x 11.9mm. Blackmagic's is 21.12 x 11.88. How can the same sensor have a different size?
 
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