F3: F3 vs. FS700?

Andrew, many thanks for your reply, it has given me much to think about. Ever since I saw Harry Brown (2009) I wanted a Sony F35. I think from reading your post, it's not for me at this moment in time. What puts me off is the cost of repair, I know and trust Sony, but with my luck I would end up with a defective unit.

I have had my F3 for nearly 3 years now, and I finally finish paying for it at the beginning of 2014. Sony phoned me the other day asking if I was happy with the F3, I said yes, but technology moves too fast. What I should have said is when are we getting V1.5 firmware? I have the ET body armour, Transvideo base plate, S-Log I bought from a guy on here this week, so my F3 is nearly complete and I need a new toy.

I am going for the Odyssey 7Q next year, really to take advantage of the 4.4.4 RAW from the F3, but also it can be used on the FS700 at 4K, and 2K RAW. It is for this reason only that I opt for the FS700R. I can't wait to see what I can do with the 240 frame slow motion feature.

As I don't make any money from my Hobby, I need to figure out a way to make something extra to buy more equipment. I have tried weddings, it didn't work, I don't think people have the money these days for a wedding video in my area, and to be honest I find them uninteresting. Competitions are great, but with so many people doing them it can prove hard to win. I'm contemplating doing adult videos next, people may frown, but who cares if it gives me the extra cash to buy a new lens, or a that Vocas PL mount for the FS700.

That's my rant for today, thanks again, Jason.
 
Sadly my commercial shoot fell through so I will not be purchasing anything as of now. I will wait probably until next year to see what is coming out. Unless another job comes along!
 
Osslund,
Thanks I stand corrected. Not sure why I thought those lenses didn't have IS.
However you are not getting the IS to work on the F3 are you? With what adapter?

Lennyt
 
The MTF does power IS and so does the Optitec I believe. I have the MTF adapter and it works for all my Canon lenses except the 85/1.2 II. I have the 85/1.8 also and that lens works fine.
 
Thanks again for the info Osslund. I just looked these guys up on the web. Both looked pretty pricy once you get their control boxes also.
The MTF seems to need that EFFECT control box on the camera all the time though. It looks like a PITA and the one review on B&H hated that box. What do you think.

The Optitek seemed simpler if you don't use the box. Still $1650 but it looks like you do get IS and you can Control Iris with those buttons on the side.

How do you like it with the 17-55? I already have the lens and its lovely but mine doesn't seem to be parfocal which I find to be a drag, especially when handheld.
 
Let's say I could finance a F5, would you do Sony F3 or F5? I am thinking about that package that includes CD Gemini with the F3. I feel like if I only want to do 1080p, the F3 with Gemini combo would be well suited for me and cover my bases for quite a bit of time. The difference in price from Sony F3 to F5 could be made up in lens purchases.
 
With all the codecs, bit rates, and color space options the F5 offers I'd say F5 all the way. Is the F3 a bad camera? Not in the LEAST, its just what you do with it.

Check this "way back play back" out I found today, shot on the F3 of course:

https://vimeo.com/16898584

 
The Sony F5 comes with 24 month 0% APR from AbelCine. So I could basically just cruise with this package plus the OLED viewfinder. If it doesn't work out after two years, sell the whole kit and recoup some of the costs. Ill probably pay it off pretty quickly once I start promoting I have the camera / getting my foot in the door at a bunch of local production companies needing DP's for commercial work.
 
The BBC really love the F3, but for the money and comparative usefulness, as well as noticeable picture quality, the FS700 has got to be the way to go. As with the F3, with an external recorder the pictures are broadcast acceptable, but in addition you have the fantastic slow motion, the full auto lenses if you need them, the extremely common NP-F batteries that have been in use since the VX1000 (almost 20 years ago!) and the arguable more useful LCD viewfinder arrangement, plus 4K output to the right recorder! There's no question in my book.
You can hire my FS700 to help make up your mind if you like! http://www.sonyfs700rental.co.uk/
 
How is the IQ compared between the F3 and the FS700? And how much DR does the FS700 have now that it has a LOG gamma? If IQ is comparable and if DR is more or less the same I see little reason to go for the F3. Has anybody measured the DR of the FS700 now that it has SLOG?
 
the f35 is a different beast - asa 450 - you need a recorder - it's big and heavy. I love it. but it's not for everyone. also have you thought about the canon c100 - seems that with a ninja and you have quite a camera too. I love the colorimitry you can get out of it. Sorry for this. also the f3 i love. f3 vs fs700 pre-slog - f3 looks much better. i haven't tested the fs700 with s log though - maybe that's a game changer.
 
I compared them using cine gammas a while ago and was surprised to see the F3 come out clearly ahead . Granted I didn't know that much about knee circuits on the FS700 though. No idea about using log.
 
Roughly that sounds right. But bear in mind that I own the F3 and know how to set -it up. I didn't set up the FS700 myself, though I did have reason to think it was well set-up. I was not aware at the time that the cine gammas in FS700 still have knee settings and don't know what they were.

I love my F3 but am PO'd that it seems to have lost so much value and "glitz" since the F5/55 release. The F5 doesn't really make sense to me yet because of user operator issues and its not 4K anyway which would seem the big thing people would want.

As a result I'm carefully looking at the FS700. Particularly because I like the idea of speedbooster to get the super low DOF as well as the extra stop, and hell who doesn't like Slow Mo. Best thing is you can get IS with Canon lenses. I shoot a lot of doc & handheld and IS is a big big deal.

My main questions are:

1- Don't like the 8 bit limitation-
NG for green screen and Slog 2 sounds great but not at 8 bit. If I could get 10 bit out it would be great as I already own a Samurai and it would be cool to offer even at 2K resolution with the Odyssy.

2- Odyssey sounds like a great combo but it ain't out yet and I have heard some reservations about how well any real time downconvert to ProRes will work.
12 bit RAW is a bit much for my clients.

3 - I don't like the limitations of the viewfinder, especially the inability to point down ( who the hell came up with that brainstorm Sony?). Is it is easy to hook up an Alfatron? Didn't see anything simple yet.

4. I dislike not having clearscan.

5. Ultimately how good is the IQ compared to F5/F55 at 4K?

6 - Can you get zebra set below 70 on an FS700? and can you get dual zebras like an F3?

7 - Any chance the FS700R will have 10bit out?

8 - Sure like having dual SDI out on F3

One thing I don't see mentioned much on the RED vs F55 comparison is how much friendlier the RED is by giving you a good useable and adjustable LUT with Red Cine. Why can't Sony offer that?
 
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According to Peter Crithary, Sony are announcing a bunch of large-sensor firmware and hardware features at IBC (more related to the F5/F55), but the FS700 may be in there. We've just sold our FS700 (and F3 is next) to replace with an F5/R5. The FS700 was great and the HFR thing saved us a lot of dough hiring a Weisscam when 200-240fps was all that was necessary. You definitely can't push the on-board codec in post, but the Odyssey will address that. With your Point 4, we had to buy a Cineroid EVF as the telescope tube VF thing with the FS700 just doesn't work.
 
powervideo said:
With your Point 4, we had to buy a Cineroid EVF as the telescope tube VF thing with the FS700 just doesn't work.
Click to expand...

Thanks Peter,

Actually Pt 3 but how did you attach the Cineroid to the FS700.

I'm looking at a bunch of doc footage I shot on my own project right now in a small difficult room with the F3 and just seeing how much I wish I had access to auto functions like IS and good autofocus. That's what you can get with an FS700 these days. My friend who does mostly docs is raving about it. Not available on F5/55.
 
I did a bunch of sponsor Tour de France TVC's a couple of months ago and the OIS and auto-focus were really great when shooting handheld at high speed from a camera car. https://vimeo.com/69743604 I had a FS700 Berkey System cheese plate and Solid Camera EVF mount for the Cineroid.
FS700 Kit2.jpgFS700 Kit1.jpg
 
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