Everything I know about mics so far.

Thanks for the welcome back.

Matt just likes me because I provide a home for some of his gently used equipment which he sells to me at a discount and delivers to me in it's original box with all the documentation.

Somehow the board's software dumped me several months ago, and as I don't post that often, I just lurked until I got off my butt and re-registered.

Matt's one of those guys that inspires me to do better.

And I envy him his house full of equipment, and love all of his home made solutions he comes up with.

As for posting more, since most of y'all are way smarter and better than I, I subscribe to Lincoln's addage of "Better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool, than to open it and remove all doubt".
 
Matt,

One of our continual reminders to folks about the Oktava mics is wind protection--gotta' have it.

So let's look at the competitors and see how badly they need it, in relation to the windscreens that come with the products.

Audio Technica AT-4053a (hypers) $396 ea. (B&H special pricing)
Comes with Reticulated Open-Cell Foam Windscreen

Ohhh! You can buy a WindTech Windscreen for REAL protection for $3.95 at B&H!

AKG SE300b/CK93 (hypers) $387 ea. (B&H special pricing)
It appears that this microphone does not come with a windscreen, at least at B&H.

So, what are the thoughts on BBG's for these mics, as well?
 
jbr said:
Matt,

One of our continual reminders to folks about the Oktava mics is wind protection--gotta' have it.

AKG SE300b/CK93 (hypers) $387 ea. (B&H special pricing)
It appears that this microphone does not come with a windscreen, at least at B&H.

So, what are the thoughts on BBG's for these mics, as well?
Click to expand...

I was going to ask you this as well. I was on my way to taking Matt's (and others) greatly appreciated advice and get the the Octava for indoor boom and 4073a for outdoor shotgun, but then people started talking about the AKG SE300b/CK 93 and the other cap (98?) so you would have an indoor boom and an outdoor shotgun by just switching caps for about the same price with equal or better (subjective) quality.

But shock mount wind/screen/BBG issues are of concern. Got the solid advice that the KSSM (soft bands) with the BBG (on in doors) and windjammer (if you are booming out doors in wind) is the way to go for the Octava, but what about the the 4073a? Can you use any of these pieces for the 4073a or do you need a different shockmount, BBG and or windjammer. if so, what and how much?

If you go with the AKG SE300b/CK 93 and the other capsule (98?) what set up do you need and can one shockmount, BBG and wind protection fit both capsules. If so then would this be the way to go because you don't have to have two shockmounts BBG/windjammers set ups (if in fact you do need two completely different set ups) for the oktava/4073 two mike system.

Really appreciate all the knowledge being shared here. You guys are a fabulous resourse!
 
ExileOnTheMainStreet said:
http://www.shure.com/accessories/a15hp.asp
if you run octava directly to the camera input
Click to expand...

Don't mean to be a hog here by asking two different sets of question rigt in a row but this issue of going directly into a DVX with a the Oktava has not really been discussed much (at least that I have seen). Oleg made a mention of it a little while ago, but I'd like tp pose the issue again since it was just brought up here.

If one does go directly in to camera in a sit down talking head indoor interview, is a high pass filter the thing to do? Does this hold true for a shotgun outdoor situation with the 4073a or the AGK system which I asked about above as well?
 
The same shockmount will accomodate all the mics discussed. For sitdown interview with fixed boom the low-cut isn't a necessity but couldn't hurt (I never used one when the mic is fixed on a boom stand). You still need different wind-protection for all the mics. The se300b/ck93 and Oktava will use the exact same protection... and the se300b/ck98 and 4073a will use about the same protection... in both cases the mount stays the same but the BBG/Jammer is removed and a Softie (economy answer) is used.

The high-pass filter couldn't hurt, but it's mainly to help with the handling noise. I ran the Oktava directly in for the last couple years and haven't had a problem... but thumps or thuds on the cam or tripod can make it to the mic without the highpass.
 
GjtB?txileOnTheMainStreet]very nice mikes - i didn't work adges with these ( 451+ck1,8,9)
very worm sound for the ck-1
i still have completely new foam for the 9 ( the big piramide)
some memories before the Shoepses and Sennheisers came in[/QUOTE]
:) :beer:
Thanks so much for the feedack
on the akg mic set .
I bought these from a very well known universal studios sound mixer and I know he would not steer me wrong .
I am also glad they are considered usefull in music .
For this akg mic series ,451+ck 1, 8 and 9....,
I imagine we are talking mid 1970? to mid 1980's for this akg series ?
Is that the vintage ..

Thanks Again
Bruce
 
i think they came in the late 70 or early 80 . i bought my used with the nagra 4.2 from guy who immigrated from Russia in early 90 , iam almost sure he "borrowed " them from the studio there like half of the country there who borrowed everything after the perestroika:-)
 
MattinSTL said:
This was the crux of the discussion that Yankee and I had back and forth through posts and PM's on the merits of Oktava/4073a versus SE300b/ck93/ck98... and I'll tell you what I told him. There is some benefit in having two seperate mics... since we've covered that totally I'll focus on the merits of the AKG. You get one of the best hypers (short of a Scheops) available... hypers are for interiors and the ck93 is a VERY good hyper... but you get a gun that's maybe just slightly inferior to the 4073a... and maybe NOT even inferior, but just a slightly different flavor. FROM MY EXPERIENCE ONLY I suggest the Oktava/4073a option... because I have a lot of time in with both of those mics... but I'm also a BIG fan of AKG... and since you'll be getting a really good hyper the question really comes down to what you'd rather have between the ck98 and 4073a. That is the question that I'm really not qualified to answer, but again, I'll tell you what I told Yankee... I bought the AKG ULS system based on just a few clips I heard, a little bit that I read, on-paper specs, and a gut feeling... and I've absolutely loved this mic system. At this point I've bought all the caps and accessories except for the omni cap... but I got everything else! So like I said... I am a BIG fan of AKG mics... BUT I still use my Oktavas all the time... so really I don't think you can go wrong either way. The advantages of one over the other will be matters of personal preferrence... and you probably won't even know the difference until you (or your son) gets a lot of mic'ing experience.

Sorry if that isn't a precise enough answer for you, but the fact is I don't think you can make a bad choice here... either route will get you good results.

Also if you check the places I've said to check the pricing shouldn't be much different between the two choices.
Click to expand...


At the end of the day, I am, from music systems, to microphones, a fan of anything modular. I wanted, trust me, so badly, to love the ME series. I love things that are modular. I didn't love the ME series. I LOVE the AKG series though. Matt is right, the 4073 vs. the 98 just has different flavors. I find the 4073 to be a bit more neutral, where the 98 has a little zest. Sound is hard to describe. As I have said, I rate the 93 above the Oktava simply on the handling noise issue.

Let me say it like this, to completely rephrase: I am far from an experienced mic operator. I buy mics because I like to have the ability to strap someone I know onto a boom pole and get the sound. The CK93 makes this possible. The Oktava will require a more experienced operator.

Let me also counter that with this statement: On any future projects where I want to make an impact, I will hire someone to do my sound. Sound is an art, and I believe it is more than 60% of the overall movie experience. If it is a project to gain experience, I'm going with a friend. If it is a business project or something that I want to represent what I am capable of: hire out.

One thing I have learned from hanging around these audio threads is that we all, myself included, are looking for that mic that can give us that professional sound. In general the options are slim: Schoeps, Sennheiser, AKG, Rhode, Oktava, Audio Technica. That's about it. I could break down every specific model and say: look here are the options, here are the highs, here are the lows, and that could essentially reduce the conversation about audio (not that I consider myself anything more than a hack with audio), but at the end of the day, I think nothing is more important than an experienced operator.

Personally, now that I have this AKG system, I'm not buying any more microphones for a long time. I might invest in a lav system in the next month or so just to have it in the kit, but I have what I need. I believe a kit needs a hyper and a shotgun. A lav is nice. I'm not buying a wireless because when I need wireless, I need an operator, and any operator better be bringing his own kit.

For the price that most of us would pay to build a kit, we could hire an operator who could get us better sound than we could on our own with a kit that costs twice as much.

This is just my opinion. If you agree, great. If you don't, okay. I'm a big boy, I've said things people don't agree with in the past.
 
I just reread my post, and want to make something clear because I think the tone was a little off (it's late).

Since this is the 'Everything I know about Mics So Far' thread, my point was, with everything I know about mics so far, I recommend hiring someone for sound versus worrying about what mic will be best for your project. The investment vs. return is going to be incredible and well worth it.
 
And now, of course, there's a new Schoeps shotgun mic to add to the top shelf. About $1795 USD.

Heard it at AES/NY. Very nice. More later.

Regards,

Ty Ford
 
jbr said:
Matt,

One of our continual reminders to folks about the Oktava mics is wind protection--gotta' have it.

So let's look at the competitors and see how badly they need it, in relation to the windscreens that come with the products.

Audio Technica AT-4053a (hypers) $396 ea. (B&H special pricing)
Comes with Reticulated Open-Cell Foam Windscreen

Ohhh! You can buy a WindTech Windscreen for REAL protection for $3.95 at B&H!

AKG SE300b/CK93 (hypers) $387 ea. (B&H special pricing)
It appears that this microphone does not come with a windscreen, at least at B&H.

So, what are the thoughts on BBG's for these mics, as well?
Click to expand...


Yeah, I'm not letting this thread die... Not for the life of me.

To answer this question that seemed to have gotten lost in the answer, I can only share from my experience.

First of all, my AKG SE300b had some sort of factory defect and quit on me last night. Not really sure what the deal was, but the AKG people are awesome, and everything is going to be taken care of.

Regarding the wind protection, I used foam on my AKG and had no problems with the hyper indoors. For the shotgun, I used it raw and had some problems, but that is my fault. I would recommend a softie for the shotgun cap.

This thread should be stickied, brilliant discussion....
 
There is a kit on Ebay listed by 1080iAV, that I have a question about. It can be found under
AUDIO TECHNICA AT-897 + WIRELESS BOOM POLE 4 AG-DVX100A
WIRELESS BOOM POLE AND LAVALIERE KIT FOR INDIE FILMERS

I was looking at the AT897, and I like this Boom Pole as well - but my question is with the wireless kit. (Audio Technica VHF Wireless Body Pack Receiver and Transmitter)

Is using a boom w/ a wireless kit downgrading the quality of your audio, or introducing more noise than a long XLR cable would? Or is it as good or better?

I've not seen this done - although it sounds like a good idea.
 
You'll find better shotguns than the AT897, but yes you can do that. The problem is that the boom op needs to hear the mic, so you have to have a thingee for him/her to hear it, or just hang the receiver on them and cable to the audio inputs on the camera.

Anytime ou go wireless you are betting that nothing bad will happen. Most wireless systems are not as clear as a hardwired mic.

Regards,
Ty Ford
 
It's a shame that Ty doesn't post here that often because his experience and knowledge are very valuable to the community.

Regarding your question, stay away from that kit. It's a lot of stuff you don't need. Any member on this board could put together a better and cheaper kit for you, but better yet, call Rush at EVS and have him piece something together for you and hook you up with the DVXUser discount.
 
Thanks Yank,

I do what I can.

Today was the day to confirm that my new FireStore FS-4 drive for my new XL2 is NOT working right. CRAP!!

How do I get in touch with Rush?

BTW, Schoeps just put out their first shotgun after 20 years of people asking for it. I heard it at the Audio Engineers show in NY several weeks back. $1750 Not cheap, but it will transform your audio.

Yes you do need some tools for audio. A windbreaker, maybe a furry to cover it if it's more than moderately breezy. A shotugun, a hyper, a couple of lavs, a couple of wireless, a boom, headphones, mic cables, a good snake with a headphone return to go from the mixer to the camera...oh, and of course, the mixer.

I have a list of Ty Ford Certified Gear in the back of my little Audio Bootcamp Field Guide. I also have a list of rental houses in case youcan't afford to buy but want or need the good stuff.

My short list of good, but not the absolute best grade gear would be:
Rode NTG 1 or NTG 2 shotgun: (NTG 2 runs on phantom or its own battery)
Audio Technica 4053a hyper and pop filter.
Ktek boom
Sennheiser Evolution G series wireless
Countryman EMW lavs
Sony MDR7506 headphones
Sound Devices 302 mixer (get your snake from Sound Devices while you're at it.
www.sounddevices.com)

Rycote makes expensive windbreakers, but they work really well. They also make suspension mounts for the boom. The windbreaker has one, but you'll need one for the hypercardioid.


How's that?

Regards,

TyFord
 
Good list man. My kit is nowhere near as developed as that, but I am actually pretty happy with how it has developed.

You can reach Rush @ 800.238.8480 or Rush@evsonline.com.

By the way, Ty, I am really shocked to see that you recommend the NTG 1 or 2 as the shotgun to pick up.
 
Well, my main mics are Schoeps cmc641 and Sennheiser 416, 816.

The Rodes are a good value at their price. They sound sort of like the the Sanken CS-3.
The Sanken is a good choice as well.

Ty
 
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