Erased - feature trailer

obin said:
BTW be VERY carefull with the use of transfer modes, it could end up looking like a cheap post fix that wedding shooters use. BTDT
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That might be why I didn't like my first go at it. I probably wasn't doing it right, and if what Smelni said to do above it right then I definitely wasn't. I was applying opacity adjustments to the two top layers, not just the middle.
 
smelni said:
you need to do the following

duplicate the original layer - - apply a gaussian blur of 1.5 to it - then do a transfer mode of soft light on top of the untouched layer. then make the opacity of the soft light layer 35 percent

so from top down

original layer duplicated (with gaussian blur)
transfer of softlight (with opacity of 35)
original layer

after you may need to apply a birghten over the top of the whole thing
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As I thought, this did not work. The "original layer duplicated (with gaussian blur)" is the only one that is visible with that method.

However, what I did try was:

Duplicate Layer on V2 (gaussian blur 1.5, softlight in composite popup menu, opacity 35)
Original Layer on V1

This gives me an image that is slightly darker with slightly more saturated colors. I don't notice an apparent difference in sharpness. It just looks higher contrast and more saturated.

I would like to post a frame of the original and a frame from this test, but I can't figure out how to export it. I can export the original as Quicktime Movie, but not the composite. I even put the clips in a separate sequence and tried exporting that sequence and it skips the composite with V2. Both exports look identical. Compressor has the same result.

If I set a poster frame and try exporting that it just comes out 4:3, but it does retain the composite. Any idea how to get this export to work right, as a Quicktime Movie and as a still frame, from FCP directly?

Here are the 4:3 frames I was able to export. The top one is the original. I see a much bigger difference in FCP than I do in these stills.
testorig.jpg

testmod.jpg
 
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it should be more dramatic then that - are you showing the top layer ?

If i get a chance I will do it with this frame to show you
 
output0.jpg


This is a super quick mock up i did on a remote machine so I couldnt see the actual colors - did it mechanically
 
I see that everyone on this post has their own opinion on your work. I would take everything into consideration. I like the trailer. I say no matter how good or bad your scenes are, people are always going to have something to say, good or bad. That's just what we do. Keep shooting good stuff dude. You did a lot of work. Keep posting more for me to see. You keep this up and you could only get better.

www.ahvexstudio.com
www.MichaelHurdle.com
 
Michael Hurdle said:
I say no matter how good or bad your scenes are, people are always going to have something to say, good or bad. That's just what we do.
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i agree 100%.

is this your first feature? have you done many shorts?

i wouldn't spend too much time trying to get a film look in post either. if you feel you have a marketable story and you feel you did a good job i doubt someone looking to buy the rights is going to pass on it because it doesnt measure up to a 'film look.'

i'd pay more attention to some of the other comments like the blank white walls, camera angles, etc. and just improve on those on your next project.

wrap it up and start on your next masterpiece man. maybe experiment with the camera settings so the footage doesnt look so crisp/videoish next time if thats bothering you. the HVX can be very flexible. some of those settings that Barry Green suggests on his HVX DVD are a real big help too you may wanna check it out if you havent already. good luck. :beer:
 
The stills I posted don't show the actual difference I see in FCP. I don't know why that is. I think I can achieve this difference with some simple settings in Look Suite. If I can spend just a little more time getting a better look for the movie then I'm willing to do that.

FilmBoy77, yes this is my first feature. It's actually my first time directing period. I've never directed any short films. My previous experience was with producing and editing short films and other projects I don't do anything small, so a feature seemed like the right choice. I feel I learned a lot more making a feature than I would have making a couple shorts. We shot in 2 weeks, which is all the time I could get off work for my vacation.

However, my next 2 projects are short films for SpyFest that I'm getting going right now. One I'm the DP and editor/mixer and the other I'm writing, directing, editing, and mixing.

I shot this before the HVX Bootcamps and before the DVD came out. I now have Barry's book and the Bootcamp DVD so I can get more knowledge and experience with practicing with the camera.
 
I tried removing all the render files and re-rendering the entire project. It took a long time and the results were the same. I cannot export anything with these changes. All I see is the original layer with color correction and not with the softlight composite layer. Any ideas?
 
[SIZE=+0]Congrats Flmmkr, hope Erased goes well for you. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=+0]I thought the day for night looked pretty good.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+0]I second what Justyn said about the flat walls, they'll give you nothing but grain. Maybe next time throw some cookies up there if you don't have time to dress the set. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=+0]On the shot where the main character gets shot at by the door, maybe throw in a couple CG bullet hits. If that doesn't work with the shots around it maybe cut it from the trailer.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+0]The CC seems to be vastly different inside/outside (as if it were two different movies). I know it'd be a pain but CCing those outside shots would definitely make it look more filmic. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=+0]Cut the second slap. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=+0]I like you're company logo btw.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+0]Ian[/SIZE]
 
tmnt said:
Congrats Flmmkr, hope Erased goes well for you.
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tmnt said:

I thought the day for night looked pretty good.

I second what Justyn said about the flat walls, they'll give you nothing but grain. Maybe next time throw some cookies up there if you don't have time to dress the set.

On the shot where the main character gets shot at by the door, maybe throw in a couple CG bullet hits. If that doesn't work with the shots around it maybe cut it from the trailer.

The CC seems to be vastly different inside/outside (as if it were two different movies). I know it'd be a pain but CCing those outside shots would definitely make it look more filmic.

Cut the second slap.

I like you're company logo btw.

Ian
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I looked into bullet hits when I first started post and don't think bullet hits would be realistic. The bullets would go right into the stucco. Plus the camera shot is pretty close to him and there isn't really anything that you can show the bullets hitting.

I'm not sure what you mean about the CC seeming different inside and outside. Everything was made neutral, so you're seeing the colors the way they really were. What you maybe talking about is the brightness. The outdoor shots had a lot more light than the indoor shots, so the indoor scenes are a bit darker. That's how it is in real life, which is how I wanted this movie to be. I wanted it to look more realistic and natural so you would think what was happening onscreen was really happening. I wasn't originally going for any special lighting or look. Not sure if we succeeded, but I'm happy with the way it ended up. I can't satisfy everyone or the way different people think it should look.

I've made changes to the white walls where I could. I used the Colorista mask to bring down the exposure on the walls and changed the color a little so they aren't just white. It's not a significant change, but I think it's enough to make it not stand out so much.

What do you mean be the "second slap"?
 
Okay so I watched the trailer first and have been reading this thread for the past 15 minutes. My first reaction was that this trailer sucks. The lighting sucked, the acting sucked, the cinematography sucked, the pacing...you name it. Not to mention that you crossed the line! Justify it all you want with "establishing shots." It just looked plain wrong. Okay I'll give you one kudos and that is the day for night shot. I'm sorry, but the people at the beginning of this thread were being way to nice. I think when the criticisms came, flmmker was more interested in defending his mistakes (such as the all to common "I meant to do that" defence) rather than humbly taking the criticism for it. The criticism is there, whether polite or not, to help you. To break it down so as to teach you something. Maybe it's there to break YOU down as a filmmaker so you can then build yourself up as a better one. To me I think you need to approach this craft as humbly as possible (especially if you posses little talent), respect the craft and those who practice it in their everyday life. It did not surprise me that you went to film school since most film students I have met have come out with even less of a clue as to how to make a good film as they did coming in. That being said, I agree when you said you should have foregone film school altogether. It sounds like all it has really taught you is how to excuse the shortcomings your work.

I'm being as blunt as possible because I believe it is the best way to convey that your attitude and behavior on this thread sucks, just like your film trailer does. I say film only as a courtesy. One of my favorite quotes, among many, flmmkr says:

"I differentiate "film-look" and "cinematic". To me cinematic is not just in the way it looks as far as color, lighting, etc, but also in the way shots are composed. I want a more cinematic feel."

I say: You can color correct it all you like but the fact is your film is not "cinematic." Your shots are poorly composed and I think that is what everyone on this thread is trying to say in the nicest way possible. So stop turing this into a semantic argument. If you are really trying to learn from constructive criticism then shut up and listen to them. Guys that suggest it looks "flat," "never shoot against white walls," etc. are right in what they are saying. It all comes down to the fact that there are aspects to your trailer that are distracting to the senses. If it was done well in the first place then these little details would not be called to attention. Film geek or layman, people will see it and respond accordingly.

I understand that you put a lot of work into it and you want to defend it like your first born child...but let go a little and then you may truly learn something.
 
mrcbella, I understand how you may think I'm only trying to defend myself and not listening to anyone else or take their advice. But then I would have to assume you haven't read this thread as well as you thought you have. And of course I'm going to defend my work at least a little bit... how could you expect me not to? I would expect anyone to defend their work and their decisions, not wimper in the corner and take a beating.

I've said I know my trailer isn't perfect and I've asked for clarification on some of the comments.

I've said I re-edited the trailer and removed the crossing of the line and some other shots from the trailer.

I tried changes to the titles and sped them up to help with the pacing.

I've added some new shots. The new trailer hasn't been posted yet, btw, because I'm still working on the color correction suggestions that have been made.

After my explanation, even Justyn said he understood my reasoning for the white walls, which still make sense to me. No one else commented, so I hope I can assume correctly that others might understand. Regardliess, I've still removed those shots from the trailer though, and even adjusted by color correction to at least bring down the exposure of the walls and change the color a little bit.

I've said I'm working on the color correction. I even posted frames and got feedback.

There's been suggestions as far as softening the picture. I've tried those suggestions and have asked for additional input... still would like more help with that btw.

I think I've done a decent job of listening to the advice given to make the changes I can to the trailer and to the movie. Obviously I can't fix everything, but I can and want to do everything possible with what I have to work with to make this as good as possible.

But thanks for making your first post on this entire forum a repeat of the same thing everyone else on this thread has already said about my trailer and not offer any truly helpful advice of your own. Nice to know you really want to participate.
 
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Hey smelni, can you tell me what you did to get that look with the still frame? Did you do that in FCP using the exact process you detailed for me? Because I still can't get it to work right and don't know what I'm doing wrong. Thanks for the help.
 
I use combustion - but this is the mechanical steps I did:

- put footage on timeline
- do color channel remap so the blue shows the green channel and then adjust that effect to 35% opacity - this is a common way to bring down the harch blue that occurs in video
- did a little basic color correction to bring down saturation in highlihgts and shadows
- DUPLICATE that layer on top of itself
- on the duplicate layer add a gaussian blur of 1.5
- set the transfer mode on the top layer to soft light
- change the opacity of the top layer to 35%

so in the end there is just 2 layers - then you output all the layers

I dont know if the effects are the same in other tools but should be similar
 
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