EPIC-S (old Scarlet S35) update...Announcement

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Dafilman21 said:
Not you specifically, it's just the overall feel of the boards has changed.
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From what I have seen in my brief stay here, DVXusers is worlds above the Redusers forum. A few off color comments sure but they seem to get nipped in the bud pretty quick. Like I said though, I am new. You have seen more comments than I have.
 
metalalien said:
I've haven't played with one so hell if I know. I just feel if they had focused on 1080p, building everything from the ground up to do that. It could have just blown everything away. It might still do that but being able to shoot in 3k on a small chip like that, what would it be for? The big screen? Doubt it.

Just thinking out loud really.
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while we all like big sensors, you shouldn't dismiss 2/3 sensors so easily. I think 2/3 is the cutoff point for where you can still achieve shallow DOF reasonably (not really plausible with 1/2" sensors because of the distances required). a lot of films have used 2/3 cameras, including slumdog millionaire, the curious case of benjamin button, zodiac, star wars episode II attack of the clones, sky captain and the world of tomorrow, once upon a time in mexico, cloverfield (along with the ol' hvx200), and parts of avatar. basically anything shot with the sony f23, f900, thomson viper, or si-2k etc. while they would most likely be filmed on a genesis, red, or alexa etc. instead nowadays (with their 35mm sensors), the fact that those were major releases shot on 2/3 and didn't look noticeably worse says something. if you include super 16mm films (the sensor is a little bigger than 2/3 but they are close), you can include films like the wrestler, the hurt locker, lock stock and two smoking barrels, thirteen, the station agent, junebug, parts of city of god, and currently black swan (which also used the 7d on some subway scenes). the 7d wasn't used for its larger sensor though but for its compact size; they actually wanted deep dof as opposed to shallow because of the ability to follow focus easily.

as far as 3k vs. 4k, I don't think there are too many 4k projectors in theaters yet. most are 2k, although 4k is slowly rolling out in theaters. as far as making it 1080p, 2k and 1080p are similar, but it is nice to have the resolution headroom with 3k to make a nice 2k final image. the sony f3 could have done with better resolution at that price range, and I think the sony f950 has become slightly outdated because it only shoots 1080p. as far as the option of being able to shoot more fps at 1080p, I agree that would be nice (although from the initial specs for some reason fps was slower on 1080p). I don't know if 1080p has been phased out. I wonder if HDRx will be able to be turned off, so that you can achieve more fps at 3k (currently 120fps and 150fps in burst mode) since the sensor has been upgraded for it (a faster sensor is required for more fps). the dynamic range with HDRx is definitely a big selling point though, and may at least make up in part what will likely be lower low light sensitivity in a 2/3 compared to s35 (just speculation all around there though). the scarlet doesn't seem to be a major priority with red now though, unfortunately (it will be released last). when it is finally released though, I am sure it will be a more than capable indie filmmaking tool.
 
Most of the theaters I go to went directly to using Sony 4k projectors when they switched to digital. I was really skeptical at first but the very first time I saw the words "THE FOLLOWING PREVIEW..."
I was like "Damn...that's crisp." I'm sold on 4k. Stuff shot on film looks just as nice. Stuff shot on digital, now looks the way it was supposed to.
 
Red bashing seems to fall into a several categories:
1. People frustrated with the time it is taking to get these cameras to market.
2. Changes to the original Scarlet handi-cam concept and the associated price increases.
3. Criticism and misunderstandings about a new motion acquisition and work flow model.
4. Jannard's provocative rhetoric.

There is also a bit of Whack-a-Mole syndrome at work. Stick your head too far above the crowd in any field of endeavor and you become a target.:kali:
 
Red fanaticism seems to fall into several categories:

1. People who fawn over the camera but can't afford it and defend it to the death.
2. People who fawn over the camera but can't afford it and spout every post by Jannard as gospel when it's "subject to change"
3. People who can afford the product and/or own it and who treat it as the only viable option and treating everything else as inferior.
4. People who sound like marketing brochures.
5. People who have nothing better to do than philosophize about the revolution of digital filmmaking but have not the talent to actually make films.
6. Jannard's provocative rhetoric.

Sorry, haven't had my coffee yet. The boards have definitely changed. There's a lot of this silliness and it gets tiresome. We are losing a lot of filmmakers on this board and we are definitely dealing with a large influx of techocrats. This board has always been geared towards the technical, what has changed is that in the past the technical discussion was geared towards actual filmmaking and not technique for technique's sake.

People need to stop using this place as a soapbox to attack or defend Red products. Start blogs, that's where it belongs. Or take this discussion to Reduser, that's a forum dedicated to the camera. This is just tiresome and it's the dead horse of 2010.
 
but at reduser the negative tone will be deleted.. so here's the only place for it to be heard ;)
 
roei z said:
but at reduser the negative tone will be deleted.. so here's the only place for it to be heard ;)
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Why do you want or need to be negative at all? Just ignore the whole company until they make something you can buy.

If you don't have something nice to say about them, why the need to say anything at all?

Scarlet doesn't exist. Epic-S doesn't exist. We don't know what they will be when/if they ever do arrive.

Any talk about Red products (other than the Red One) is WASTED BREATH.

Why bring more negativity and ugliness into the world? Why complain about something that doesn't even exist?

Just ignore it, until it shows up in red.com/store.
 
Barry_Green said:
Why do you want or need to be negative at all? Just ignore the whole company until they make something you can buy.

If you don't have something nice to say about them, why the need to say anything at all?

Scarlet doesn't exist. Epic-S doesn't exist. We don't know what they will be when/if they ever do arrive.

Any talk about Red products (other than the Red One) is WASTED BREATH.

Why bring more negativity and ugliness into the world? Why complain about something that doesn't even exist?

Just ignore it, until it shows up in red.com/store.
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it's not me who's negative...
it just sometimes fun to read a little bashing and then raz16mm defending :)
even just a tiny bit
 
Not everyone who uses a Red, or reads Reduser is a fanatic.

Once you've used the system, if you know how to use it, you will be able to achieve the results you want from something.

I love my MX, I'm fully confident in Epic as a system, but right now I also have my Little GH-2 that I brought on my honeymoon, and I love the little thing. It's a great little system that I can carry with me whenever I want. Ultimately all this depends on the capabilities you want and need to do whatever you are trying to do:

If you are trying to have final creative say on the look of your digital film without wanting to punch yourself in the face because Canon and Sony have "almost" given you the creative freedom you want then Red is your answer.

I used to use Canon products - I got sick of their half-hearted products and corporate Laziness. Not to mention representatives that are Truly A**Holes (do the initials TS mean anything to you?) I sold all of my canon Crap and got a Red MX. Never regretted it for a second. What a difference. Red aren't without their flaws - but they are an American Company, actually attempting to innovate instead of duplicate. Personally I hope they ***** slap the hell out of Sony and Canon. Panasonic just needs to reintegrate their digital imaging divisions and then completely restructure their marketing and distribution system so that they have like four really really good imaging products they sell and can get to market instead of 32 half-finished products that sit on the shelf because nine out of ten people in the USA have used a Canon point and shoot and like it, and like zero pro photographers use Panasonic Still cameras. (I'm sure there will be exceptions now with the GH-2 wink)
 
Isaac_Brody said:
Red fanaticism seems to fall into several categories:

1. People who fawn over the camera but can't afford it and defend it to the death.
2. People who fawn over the camera but can't afford it and spout every post by Jannard as gospel when it's "subject to change"
3. People who can afford the product and/or own it and who treat it as the only viable option and treating everything else as inferior.
4. People who sound like marketing brochures.
5. People who have nothing better to do than philosophize about the revolution of digital filmmaking but have not the talent to actually make films.
6. Jannard's provocative rhetoric.

Sorry, haven't had my coffee yet. The boards have definitely changed. There's a lot of this silliness and it gets tiresome. We are losing a lot of filmmakers on this board and we are definitely dealing with a large influx of techocrats. This board has always been geared towards the technical, what has changed is that in the past the technical discussion was geared towards actual filmmaking and not technique for technique's sake.

People need to stop using this place as a soapbox to attack or defend Red products. Start blogs, that's where it belongs. Or take this discussion to Reduser, that's a forum dedicated to the camera. This is just tiresome and it's the dead horse of 2010.
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tell me where I fall?

I have said it before why don't you guys just get rid of the red section here? doesn't seem to help much just link it back to Reduser like they do with the other cameras section.

Just an Idea have a good one.
 
Isaac_Brody said:
Red fanaticism seems to fall into several categories:

1. People who fawn over the camera but can't afford it and defend it to the death.
2. People who fawn over the camera but can't afford it and spout every post by Jannard as gospel when it's "subject to change"
3. People who can afford the product and/or own it and who treat it as the only viable option and treating everything else as inferior.
4. People who sound like marketing brochures.
5. People who have nothing better to do than philosophize about the revolution of digital filmmaking but have not the talent to actually make films.
6. Jannard's provocative rhetoric.

Sorry, haven't had my coffee yet. The boards have definitely changed. There's a lot of this silliness and it gets tiresome. We are losing a lot of filmmakers on this board and we are definitely dealing with a large influx of techocrats. This board has always been geared towards the technical, what has changed is that in the past the technical discussion was geared towards actual filmmaking and not technique for technique's sake.

People need to stop using this place as a soapbox to attack or defend Red products. Start blogs, that's where it belongs. Or take this discussion to Reduser, that's a forum dedicated to the camera. This is just tiresome and it's the dead horse of 2010.
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I actually have no plans on getting a scarlet or af100 anymore, but I still appreciate companies pushing technology forward and can't help but get excited by them. you can throw the sony f3 in there. I'm happy with my t2i for now, I doubt I'll outgrow it anytime soon. if it's good enough for darren aronofsky it's good enough for me. and by the time I do hopefully there's the "perfect" or ("killer" ha) cam out (Full frame, 4:4:4, 4k, 20 stops dynamic range, 300 fps, etc. for under $5000 ha).
 
I am a Red fan. I admit it.
I have had enough personal exposure to a Red One and learned the work flows well enough to know that Redcode Raw is a significant step forward in digital acquisition compared to any form of encoded video.
Scarlet may not be on the market yet, but it is a long way from that first machined aluminum mock up. RED has so far met or exceeded every performance benchmark they originally set for the MX series cameras. There is no reason to think Scarlet will be otherwise.
My pro shooting days were the late 70's and 80's. 16mm film, 3/4 U-matic, 1" and 2" Quad, and Betacam. Mostly industrial and commercial work and occasional dramatic shorts done with friends. These days I am on the other end of the industry. I engineer media systems for everything from high end home theaters to command and control environments for nuclear plants.
So Scarlet for me will be a hobby camera, a personal creative tool, a replacement for my old Bolex. Indeed I will be using some of the same lenses on it. I can afford it and I can afford to wait for it. For an under $10k general purpose motion camera I haven't seen anything yet that is compelling enough to change my mind. I want the full creative palette that Scarlet will offer: high resolution, high progressive frame rates, superior dynamic range, and the creative flexibility of raw imaging.
 
1. We have moved from the less robust Scarlet S35 chassis to the EPIC S35 chassis (like going from the economy car frame to the truck frame). Pro, not prosumer.
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Funny since RED said they never made any prosumer equipment.

If we consider the old Scarlet S35 frame as prosumer... Scarlet is amateur!

Jim is really heavy on the contradictions lately... PR to the rescue!
 
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