DVX300 with fixed / interchangeable lens and new sensor ?
- Thread starter tillhavis
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That's not my preference. I'd rather have something more like the Ursa Mini Pro - lots of readily available and usefully placed switches - and a solid, not heavily plasticized body. I want a camcorder that will last and that can make the most of the (e.g.) GH5s sensor.
I dont think you need to compromise these features by making the camera even bigger bjewett;
The GH5/s and EVA1 already have all the features needed. IMO all is needed is an upgraded sensor and
lens in a smaller and lighter form factor.
Technology is improving and allowing these features to be put in a smaller body so why go bigger when you can
have them in a smaller lighter package without compromising.
The GH5/s is already a small camera and has most of the features any new DVX would have.
Just include the GH5/s, EVA1 features in a smaller lighter body with built in SDI, HDMI, Dual XLR's, Built in ND's
IBIS etc....
I respect you opinion, but I think you can have all these features in a much smaller and lighter body
so why go bigger, especially when the camera will more than likley have a fixed lens. As for being rugged
the current DVX200 is well able to handle most situations I find myself in. Some of the doors and covers
could be a bit more robust and ruberised / with better water resistance but apart from that IMO the current DVX200
is pretty rugged, just too big and heavy for run and gun and all day shooting.
JMO. Regards
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If you look at SONY - the new Z90 and the PXW-Z150 are vey different sizes but (according to a SONY specialist) except for controls you don't have room for on the smaller version, they are effectively the same camera. Even the lens's appear to have identical characteristics.
Having said that, my wish list is a scaled down DVX200 (about 2 lbs lighter) a fixed lens, the same sensor as the GH5s including dual gain with the room and processing power for robust IS and rock solid auto focus when needed. Similar record settings and picture profile. In other words for people who really want an ENG style camcorder a DVX200 with the heart of a GH5s.
Having said that, my wish list is a scaled down DVX200 (about 2 lbs lighter) a fixed lens, the same sensor as the GH5s including dual gain with the room and processing power for robust IS and rock solid auto focus when needed. Similar record settings and picture profile. In other words for people who really want an ENG style camcorder a DVX200 with the heart of a GH5s.
Id go for an update about 2 lbs lighter with the GH5s sensor. But if all they did was more or less keep the same body but ended up with a standard fixed lens camcorder with GH5s low light sensitivity, that could be a bit of a game changer in a camcorder in that class. Then internal 400Mb all I and 10 bit and all of that. wow.
This is a rough mock up of my ideal size for any new DVX.
If Panasonic can keep the camera length under 10" and reduce the weight and height as well as including the
additional specifications (below) I think they could potentially have the best selling fixed lens run and gun/broadcast/documentary camera
on the market.
Similar body design to the EVA1 including side Handle
and updated viewfinder
Internal 4K 10bit 4:2:2 with V-Log
Wider Angle and faster Lens
Improved Low Light Sensitivity
Better AF and Focus Tracking
One push AF like the DVX200
5 Axis IBIS
Same Connections as DVX200 plus TC and Genlock.
SDI, HDMI, USB3, Dual XLR, Inbuild ND's etc...
Remote Wireless tablet/iphone control plus live preview
Improved daylight viewable 4-5" Touchscreen positioned anywhere on the body.
Raw output would be an added bonus for Indi Shooters, and
would also distinguish it from the GH5s and make it a great EVA1
B camera.
If Panasonic can keep the camera length under 10" and reduce the weight and height as well as including the
additional specifications (below) I think they could potentially have the best selling fixed lens run and gun/broadcast/documentary camera
on the market.
Similar body design to the EVA1 including side Handle
and updated viewfinder
Internal 4K 10bit 4:2:2 with V-Log
Wider Angle and faster Lens
Improved Low Light Sensitivity
Better AF and Focus Tracking
One push AF like the DVX200
5 Axis IBIS
Same Connections as DVX200 plus TC and Genlock.
SDI, HDMI, USB3, Dual XLR, Inbuild ND's etc...
Remote Wireless tablet/iphone control plus live preview
Improved daylight viewable 4-5" Touchscreen positioned anywhere on the body.
Raw output would be an added bonus for Indi Shooters, and
would also distinguish it from the GH5s and make it a great EVA1
B camera.
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Bassman2003
Veteran
I will never purchase a video camera without a viewfinder. Period. It is the only screen you can trust out in the field. These types of cameras are made for single person crews. Also, some of the best stabilization comes from having the viewfinder up against your face. I would be very disappoint if the industry saw the omission of viewfinders as a cost savings measure...
Bassman2003
Veteran
Now you are talkin' ! I would be happy with the size of my PX270 but I fear the lens is going to be the issue. Your list and mockup are spot on. That would get me excited or a 1" P2 camera with similar specs.
There are so many ideas about a DVX300 (or wharsoever). IMHO we are at the end of the line for the DVX200. There som points open, many usere have asked for in some of the threads. Just some examples: Remote with Android (and not only Apple), there are much more Android usere round the globe. Kelvin display always on the screen even at WB and auto WB (much easier to match a 2nd Cam). Named screenfiles like the AG-AC160 can do it (easy to know what's behind a number, like Wedding or concert,...) 8 digit like in the old DOS days are enough, ect......
But Panasonic does nothing. The DVX200 will be as it is now. I think there will be no more software upgrade. And for a new model Panasonic will never do a mockup neither a prototype for evaluation. This is not the Japanese way of developing. I was working with Japanese for many many Years. If you go back in history, all the generations of Panasonic gear (excellent products, of course!) are released with given specifications. Some little modifications per software. that' all. Only in very special cases (like the focus modification board change on the AG-AC130/160) hardware modifications are done. But upgrade from 50i to 50p for the AC130 no. Technically possible, both cams use ecaxtly the same chassis. But this was a Panasonic decission.
Some time we will see a new Cam (DVX300 or what name ever) with given spects. Same as it was with the DVX200. No possibility to alter the basic spects like internal 10Bit 4:2:2...
But for me the DVX is a very good Cam and does nearly all what I want...:grin: A little bit more (like the points noted above) are always welcome.....
But Panasonic does nothing. The DVX200 will be as it is now. I think there will be no more software upgrade. And for a new model Panasonic will never do a mockup neither a prototype for evaluation. This is not the Japanese way of developing. I was working with Japanese for many many Years. If you go back in history, all the generations of Panasonic gear (excellent products, of course!) are released with given specifications. Some little modifications per software. that' all. Only in very special cases (like the focus modification board change on the AG-AC130/160) hardware modifications are done. But upgrade from 50i to 50p for the AC130 no. Technically possible, both cams use ecaxtly the same chassis. But this was a Panasonic decission.
Some time we will see a new Cam (DVX300 or what name ever) with given spects. Same as it was with the DVX200. No possibility to alter the basic spects like internal 10Bit 4:2:2...
But for me the DVX is a very good Cam and does nearly all what I want...:grin: A little bit more (like the points noted above) are always welcome.....
4K 10-bit 4:2:2 internal recording would convince me to buy the next version of the DVX200. 10-bit internal with the GH5 made a big difference for the color quality of my work, so having the same format with an ENG camera would be huge for me.
So the original 43rumors post (itself a repost..) said a "source" said Panasonic would update the DVX200 "early" this year.
So there are no promises anywhere in this, but - has anyone heard any more?
In particular, how "early" that might be?
Am pondering 1 or 2 GH5s cameras and/or 1 GH5s, one DVX200 v2 ... but am willing to wait for now on possible dvx specs.
I have seen no further statements / rumors of this since the 43rumors post.
So there are no promises anywhere in this, but - has anyone heard any more?
In particular, how "early" that might be?
Am pondering 1 or 2 GH5s cameras and/or 1 GH5s, one DVX200 v2 ... but am willing to wait for now on possible dvx specs.
I have seen no further statements / rumors of this since the 43rumors post.
Bassman2003
Veteran
Since the GH5s sensor is a great performer I would expect Panasonic to use it pretty soon on a DVX200 upgrade. Why not? They already have it sorted for the GH5s. We will see at NAB.
If anybody thinks Panasonic are not up against it in the broadcast and run and gun market have a look at Blackmagics
latest offering.
http://www.newsshooter.com/2018/02/...oduces-⅔-sensor-4k-ursa-mini-broadcast-camera
Panasonic will still be a big player in the broadcast market but Blackmagic Design has them clearly in their sights. IMO the best way for Panasonic to ease the transition
from traditional broadcast cameras to (eventually) mobile phone devices and smaller cameras would be to produce a small, lightweight, interchangeable broadcast/run and gun camera based on the GH5/s.
It probably won’t meet all the needs of multi cam and studio work like the new Blackmagic camera does, but it would move Panasonic in the direction the market and industry is heading.
MFT has already been adopted en mass and the sensor is the perfect compromise between 2/3, S35, and Full Frame. The only thing MFT is missing is a quality wide power zoom with a good range and reasonably fast aperture.
The future of this market IMO is smaller, lighter and quicker set up cameras like the GH5/s but in a Canon XF405 sized package. The MFT sensor allows this, as well as providing improved low light performances, ISIB and a
range of other improvements over 2/3 sensors.
Would this impact sales of Panasonic’s other broadcast cameras ? Probably. But things are moving in that direction anyway. (think GH5 and mobile phones and you can see how close this is)
But for the immediate future interchangeable broadcast cameras will still be needed. Just a lot smaller, lighter and more portable, with more wireless and network features.
Also by creating a new unique product based on an existing platform Panasonic could see a huge uptake and sales (if the success of the GH5/s is anything to go by they should have no problems selling
a lot of cameras and stealing market share from companies like Sony and Blackmagic)
If Panasonic do produce a small and compact Interchangeable GH5/s camera in a broadcast friendly body and a new quality MFT power zoom it could corner the market.
JMO
latest offering.
http://www.newsshooter.com/2018/02/...oduces-⅔-sensor-4k-ursa-mini-broadcast-camera
Panasonic will still be a big player in the broadcast market but Blackmagic Design has them clearly in their sights. IMO the best way for Panasonic to ease the transition
from traditional broadcast cameras to (eventually) mobile phone devices and smaller cameras would be to produce a small, lightweight, interchangeable broadcast/run and gun camera based on the GH5/s.
It probably won’t meet all the needs of multi cam and studio work like the new Blackmagic camera does, but it would move Panasonic in the direction the market and industry is heading.
MFT has already been adopted en mass and the sensor is the perfect compromise between 2/3, S35, and Full Frame. The only thing MFT is missing is a quality wide power zoom with a good range and reasonably fast aperture.
The future of this market IMO is smaller, lighter and quicker set up cameras like the GH5/s but in a Canon XF405 sized package. The MFT sensor allows this, as well as providing improved low light performances, ISIB and a
range of other improvements over 2/3 sensors.
Would this impact sales of Panasonic’s other broadcast cameras ? Probably. But things are moving in that direction anyway. (think GH5 and mobile phones and you can see how close this is)
But for the immediate future interchangeable broadcast cameras will still be needed. Just a lot smaller, lighter and more portable, with more wireless and network features.
Also by creating a new unique product based on an existing platform Panasonic could see a huge uptake and sales (if the success of the GH5/s is anything to go by they should have no problems selling
a lot of cameras and stealing market share from companies like Sony and Blackmagic)
If Panasonic do produce a small and compact Interchangeable GH5/s camera in a broadcast friendly body and a new quality MFT power zoom it could corner the market.
JMO
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Bassman2003
Veteran
I like the concept but think it would be better with a killer 1" sensor. This would allow for a long reach lens. Lets hope the Dual ISO design becomes standard in all cameras going forward as well.
But if Panasonic wants to make a family of products that all match - 1", m4/3rds & s35 I would be very happy. Just keep the specs from the GH5s with maybe 10bit 4k60p and we are good.
But if Panasonic wants to make a family of products that all match - 1", m4/3rds & s35 I would be very happy. Just keep the specs from the GH5s with maybe 10bit 4k60p and we are good.
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Larry Chapman
Well-known member
Curious to me to see people advocating for a smaller sensor (1"). One of my primary reasons for going with the DVX200 was the m43 sensor allowing shallower DOF than cameras with smaller sensors. Thoughts?
I would not be a fan of a 1" sensor, for the simple reason I think MFT offers the best combination
of image quality, ease of focus and maintaining focus, ability to get a shallow depth of field (if you need it)
potentially better low light ability, a lot of lens options, IBIS, etc.. for me the list goes on..
As I mentioned the only downsize for Broadcast situations is the availability a native
wide power zoom with a good range and reasonably fast aperture.
The FUJINON MK18-55mm and 55-100 T2.9 could potentially be a great option for a broadcast lens if Panasonic were to develop a similar
powered parafocal version or even a 18-150mm (even if it were a bit slower)
JMO
of image quality, ease of focus and maintaining focus, ability to get a shallow depth of field (if you need it)
potentially better low light ability, a lot of lens options, IBIS, etc.. for me the list goes on..
As I mentioned the only downsize for Broadcast situations is the availability a native
wide power zoom with a good range and reasonably fast aperture.
The FUJINON MK18-55mm and 55-100 T2.9 could potentially be a great option for a broadcast lens if Panasonic were to develop a similar
powered parafocal version or even a 18-150mm (even if it were a bit slower)
JMO
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Bassman2003
Veteran
It all comes down to how you are going to use your cameras. If you want to use the camera in a traditional video camera way (like broadcast) a 3x to 8x zoom is not going to cut it. 13x is pretty good but I have used the 22x on my PX270 immensely. A lot of compromises have to be made in order to offer a 13x zoom lens for a m4/3rds sensor. So I see a 1" sensor better for broadcast style shooting. I would say the DVX200 is a great EFP tool. They both would work nicely in a multicam environment if the images were a match.
My overall point is that shallow DOF is not everything. If you really need SDOF then a GH5 is the better approach anyway. We are talking about a fixed lens camera so lens choices do not come into play?
My overall point is that shallow DOF is not everything. If you really need SDOF then a GH5 is the better approach anyway. We are talking about a fixed lens camera so lens choices do not come into play?
Emmet Brown
Active member
I have a really weird idea: Panasonic should use a 1" sensor but a m43 fixed lens like on the dvx200. And INTEGRATE a focal reducer/speedbooster IN the camera! So you could get the look of a bigger chip on the 1" sensor AND it would be easier to get a zoomlens with f2.0 to f2.8 fastest aperture.