DVX100a For Commercials?

K

kdrums

Member
I am a fairly new DVX user, ( only a few months) and I want to produce a commercial for a local station. A few people I have talked to at a local station seem to think that the DVX100 is not (broadcast quality) and don't feel that it would be good enough to air. I highly disagree but I fear that I don't have the technical vocabulary to convince them otherwise. I also don't know what "requirements" must be met for commercial footage to be on air. I realize that I will need to have the footage transferred over to beta for most stations? I would like to shoot the commercial in 24p but I have read a few posts that state this must be done carefully so that it looks right. I apologize if this has already been answered somewhere on this site, but I could not find it.

Thank you for any and all comments.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

well, they are "right" cos miniDV is not Betcam and they can easily measure that out and use it as an excuse not to use your stuff.
BUT content is king and nowadays 8thanks to MTV i believe) miniDV and DVCam is very much used in broadcasts.
we produce a lot of TV shows and mix BetaSP with miniDV (Sony mostly, i hate the Canon image) all the time. colourcorrection and imageenhancements are a must. but when you deliver it on Betatape they have problems seeing the difference often.

so if your AD is good then i am sure they take it (if it meets their contentqualityguidelines)

about 24p. best is you shoot something and show them how it looks. then they can decide.....i would not see a reason why it should be worse than interlaced for a broadcaster. on the contrary: an ad will look better in 24p.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

Yeah, because on paper, it's not as high quality as BetaSP because it's not "Broadcast standard" and it's just a "home format", the DVX in my opinion looks every bit as good (and with 24P, better than) any BetaSP camera they'll have.

You'd probably fool them with a dub to BetaSP tape. And if they let you shoot progressive, especially in 24P, they might be surprised...
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

Thank you for your timely reply! It is good to hear that response. It just seems like that folks are not always willing to go with new technology unless they choose to themselves. Hopefully the proof is in the content and that with the dvx and my developing skills, I can produce some things that look different and captivating. I want to be able to produce some quality stuff with the dvx and prove to them that the "standards" that they are used to are not the only way to go. I think if it is good enough, it may change the way "mini dv" format is looked at. At least for me locally.

Thanks again.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

Once its transferred to BetaSp whoes going to care? Most local commericals are crap anyway (majority of them). Throw in the beauty of 24 p and all will be good.

Are you in a position to make the commerical and then submit it? Look at Wildboys on mtv. All shot on the DVX and........ taa da! Broadcast on a NATIONAL SCALE.

The DVX is broadcast quality.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

"Broadcast standard" is all relative these days. Remind them that CNN and a few others are shooting with Sony mini-dv cameras. It is 'standard' enough for them to broadcast. I'm shooting a weekly television show in the number 11 market in the country on the DVX100a and the station has no problem at all with it. In fact, they love the images we're getting. I still shoot Beta-SP on occasion, but only when I "have" to. I just spoke to another network shooter yesterday at the tape supply store. He's off on a 6 week around the world shoot with mini-dv for some network clients. Usually those strongly professing the vitrues of Beta-SP over something like the DVX either haven't used it, haven't seen what it can do, or are just young and stupid enough to want to tote around a 35 pound rig on their shoulder because it's bigger and looks cool. Do your own thing and blow them away with content and quality images. Good luck-
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

Exactly. The FOX show Arrested Development uses the DVX100 for 'flashback and dream sequences' from what I have heard. Another example of being Broadcast Quailty.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

I've done commercials that air locally and regionally on the DVX. The very first spot I did on the DVX has been nominated for an Emmy award. So don't worry about the camera, it's plenty good enough. If your concept, execution, and shooting skills are up to the challenge then you will have no problems at all... the camera will definitely hold up its end of the bargain.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

Our camera has 3 chips so it IS BROADCAST QUALITY! I work for a TV station and I have shot stuff with my camera and had it air on the News. Also, last summer, I hooked up my DVX100 to our Live Truck and then called the engineers back at the station to look at my picture and they said it looked good...They had no idea I had the DVX100 hooked up to the truck and NOT the $40,000 BetaSX camera! They couldn't tell the difference. I was in 60i mode of course.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

Thank you very much for the examples and reassurance. I am very thankfull for this user group. The "real life" examples are very, very helpfull. Knowledge is power.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

one more thing: i basically understand the network guys:
someone who has a xxthousanddollar cam like a BetaSP or DigiBeta or SX will hopefully know how to make proper pics including a correct slate etc.
but i guess they often get burned with footage from people with consumercams that is awful because it is shaky or it lacks some basic establisher shots or whatever.
so they use the excuse of the cam instead of saying: "we are not sure if you can make what we need".

so treat the cam as if it is worth millions and every shot as if you got paid a lot. then you won´t mess it up ;-)

good luck with that ad.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

On the other hand...

There are Beta snobs out there who equate bigger camera CCDs and lens to a better image.

I know because I've recently fought a battle with a local ad agency to let me use the DVX for some TV commercials. Their president finally decided to give the DVX a shot.

I'd never seen anyone be so critical of a video image as he was when I was using the DVX. He didn't like the progressive scan look at all - 24p or 30p. He thought it made the image look 'soft' and that it didn't pop enough (like 60i).

Switching to 60i mode made him think... "Its the same camera I didn't like just a second ago in progressive mode and I don't like it now, either.".

When we shoot on Beta his comfort level is greater and he isn't as critical of the image in the monitor.

Just because we recognize the benefits of the DVX and its progressive scan CCDs, doesn't mean others will.

Yeah, I know... if he doesn't like it he can go __________.

However, video production is what I do for a living and I can't afford to say, "Well, if you don't like my precious DVX you can go ___________.".
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

Alpi69 makes an excellent point. It's the same in screenwriting -- why the harping about "proper" screenplay format? Because Hollywood's been making movies for a hundred years, and they kind of know what they're doing, right? And what are the odds that if someone's written a story AND THEY DIDN'T EVEN BOTHER TO LEARN HOW TO FORMAT IT, what are the odds that they know the rules of storytelling and structure?

It's an easy way to weed people out. And when there are hundreds (or thousands) clamoring for each job, you've got to weed them out somehow.

So yes: bars, tone, slate, waveform monitor, etc -- that all still applies even if you're using a DVX. And if you don't know what that all is (and how to use it) then you're probably not ready to be making commercials. Like I said before: if all the rest of your package is in shape, the camera itself will hold up its end of the bargain. But everything else has to be there too.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

I understand exactly what Terry is saying. I've experienced the same thing. Your client already has a built-in bias toward any new camera that he is not familiar with. However, I'd bet money that if you had the chance to shoot the footage without his knowing what camera was used....he'd love the footage. It's a constant education process with new equipment. Once someone gets accustomed to a picture they like, then nothing that comes along, especially a little camera like the DVX100a, could possibly produce images that might be as good, or God forbid, maybe even better in terms of looks. It's a slow process with some people, but educating the client is something we must continue to do.
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

Honestly, I think the DVX in 24P looks far better than a BetaSP cam. In 60i, I'd give it to BetaSP, but with the progressive modes (and TWENTY FOUR FPS) the DVX wins in my eyes.

Yeah this post was kind of useless, its just my opinon. But it's just so true!
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

I'm a commercial director/cameraman. I've shot 100's of national ads. I own 35mm equipment, 16mm, 8mm some Canon DV's and now 2 DVX100's. IN 1985, my first commercial, for Nike, called "Revolution" was cut to the Beatles soundtrack, and was shot with my super 8 film camera with the (black and white) film transferred to video (for editing) off my living room wall. It won every award imaginable, Clios. Etc., and ended up even having some historical significance. Since then, I've made a good living telling technicians to go back to their waveform monitors and relax with a cup of Joe while I shoot with the camera of my choice. My music videos and commercials have won numerous awards including MTV Awards, Bronze Lions at Cannes, all while the technicians told  me I was doing it wrong. If we listened to them all the time we'd be stuck in a very uninteresting place. It's all about skill, balls, and knowing when and how to break rules.
In 2000 I did the first live campaign of TV commercials since the Colgate Palmolive hour in the late 50's.This was the launch of the (then new) Ford Focus A huge, multi-million$ gig with tremendous responsibility and expectations attached to it. Because it was live, it could not be film, had to be video. I embraced it, and began the campaign with Ikegamis which I disliked, too bulky, inhibited spontaneity. Against the better judgment of my colleagues in the satellite trucks, I told them to return the Ikies to the rental house and pulled out my Canon Elura. You can imagine, there was much consternation and fretting...
I went live straight into national networks about 90 times over the course of the following six months, with the Canon Elura, chasing actors down the street, in and out of cars, etc. It was considered the most successful new car launch in the history of Ford Motor Co.
I adore my DVX100's and consider them to represent the new revolution in filmmaking. You're on the right track. Anyone who tells you a camera isn't broadcast quality is either worried about their investment in outdated technolology, or lacks vision. It's up to us creative geeks (and our ideas) to define what "quality" is in a broadcast.
The technicians will follow….
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

Well put Sluggo.

It's nice to hear this from a source that warrants attention. I remember this NIKE "Revolution" commercial! NIKE has always been at the forefront of creativity in advertising.

I'm one of those guys that NEVER gets too caught up in the Technical side of things as it just bores me to tears.

Just Shoot it!
 
Re: DVX100a For Commercials?

I remember the "Revolution" commercial very well. Though I've never worn a pair of Nikes in my life, good show!
 
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