Don't laugh but new Nero Vision Xtra is surprisingly good

Ozpeter

Well-known member
It's clear that not everyone reading and posting here is a fully fledged filmmaker, and as this forum is perhaps the best source of info and guidance on the GH1, we get a few strays from the home-movie making end of the business - myself perhaps being one of them.

So this is for you, and also for anyone wanting quick and easy editing of GH1 footage even though you may have more heavyweight tools for doing the more cinematic stuff.

I've bought more low-end NLE programs than I care to think about, and they've all been disappointing to various degrees. What brings about disappointment in particular is when they fall short of their advertised capabilities in practice, and when they simply don't seem able to cope with GH1 footage.

Despite the lessons of the past, today I bought an upgrade licence for Nero version 10, having been impressed with the adverts online for Nero Vision 10 which is part of the package (though you can buy it standalone). It was clear that it's a significant upgrade from previous Nero Vision versions, which worked reasonably well for the most basic GH1 editing but which were about as basic as an NLE can be. In fact it's a total rewrite, done by someone who clearly has a full understanding of the basic requirements of an NLE and I suspect Nero have bought in a resources for its development rather than it being an in-house thing. It may be the first NLE written from scratch since the AVCHD age began.

The interface is intended not to terrify novice users. But that makes it simple and uncluttered. Fancy graphics of the kind which tend to be embarrasing other than to schoolkids are avoided. But there's plenty of stuff to be found by right clicking on icons and objects, and several times when I thought it was missing a key function, I found it by a little persistence or by checking the help file.

The first thing that impressed me was that it actually plays a mixed timeline of GH1 footage without freezing, unlike most others I've tried.

When placing clips on the timeline you can change how existing clips are affected through use of modifier keys allowing you to over-write or insert etc etc very much in the style of Premiere Pro - in fact there's quite a few PP-like features, including the way the keyframing works. You can select all-to-left or all-to-right or all-on-track. Keyboard shortcuts are comprehensive but can't be changed, though choices are what you'd expect.

Effects and transitions are fairly basic but perfectly adequate for productions where you don't want E & T to distract from the content. There's a simple but very effective trim window, the main monitor automatically splits to show the effect of edits you're about to make, and the handling of AVCHD clips is very smooth and efficient. Cuda is implemented if you have appropriate hardware.

I've not seen a limit given to the number of tracks you can add (video, audio, or combined). There's a master effect track and effects can be stacked onto individual clips. Colour control is limited to RGB and HSL.

Sadly there's no audio-only crossfade but you can achieve that by overlapping on different tracks. Video or audio can be locked.

No particular provision for dual monitors but the playback window can be made full screen at the click of a button. All UI elements can be resized as desired but not moved around. There are no menus at the top, though right-click menus are comprehensive.

Nero Vision 10 retains the ability of previous version to smart render unchanged frames, so if you simply want to butt-join a set of clips and render to a single file, it takes no longer to render than it would to simply copy them.

I've only played with this new NLE for a couple of hours, but so far, bearing in mind the very low cost ($59 standalone) and the fact that it's a new design with all new code, I'm very impressed - for once, expectations are exceeded.
 
Hey, man what every works for you. Now there are a lot more functions, and bells and whistles and capabilities with the higher end NLEs, of course, but if you can edit the way you want with what you have, power to you. My first editor was a hand cranked Bajia Super8 viewer/editor I picked up at Kmart when I was a kid, and I have edited on a powered 4 gang Super 8mm bench, a 16mm 4 gang bench, an upright 16mm Moviola, and a 16mm 8 plate flat bed Steenbeck in film. In video, I started cutting on high end, cuts only VHS decks, with a Radio Shack fader, worked on 3/4" Umatic, and then Beta SP in a high end studio. Since digital hit, I first got a bare bones Casablanca "Classic" stand alone editor, with a whooping 9 gigs of storage (out the door for "Only” about $8000.00ish), whooo hooo. I was in high cotton when I got a 64 gig SCSI drive, for "Only" $3700.00!! That editor was less functional than iMovie or Windows Movie Maker is now. I have been using FCP for about 9 years and just got FCS 3 running on an 8 core Mac Pro. Of course my FCP set up is pretty advanced and fast, but, really the basics of good editing have not changed since I had the hand wound Super 8 viewer/editor.

I always remind myself that "The Battleship Potemkin", "Man with a Movie Camera", "Sunrise" and "Metropolis" were all edited on primitive editing benches and "Citizen Kane", "The Searchers", and every great movie from the 30's to the 70's, were al cut on upright Moviolas. Don't worry about what your editor can do. Worry about what you can do with your editor.
 
i like that. very JFK :Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)

I actually used a variation of that to get a big job for a University fund raising video I did a while back. I was up against a bigger outfit with a bigger camera and it came up that they had better equipment. I dropped the, "You aren't hiring me for what my camera can do, but for what I can do with my camera". With that, I got the job..... Of course, I did spend the week before, on their website. Pulling pix and putting together a 3 minute motion graphics/music promo to show them... That helped too.

Not only did that video pay off, very big.... It won an award (some obscure academic public relations annual contest, but I'll take it).
 
I got sucked into Nero years ago because of DVD compatibility issues with my clients. I threw all kinds of money at the problem...over a long period of time. I thought Nero was one of the reasons I solved it...but it all boiled down to not using TY discs...what an expensive lesson.

But I kept using it because Nero Burning ROM has one simple feature that Sony DVD Architect doesn't: "How many copies?" And I always figured Nero knew how to burn more than anyone.

I also like Nero ReCode for stupid-simple encoding for the web...and for encoding anything else you can imagine.

Plus Nero has lots of other tools.

And as soon as Nero 10 came out...I blew my lunch money on it for the month.

I've already scraped it off my hard drives.

1. GH1 1080p is useless to me until you remove pulldown. Nero Vision, as far as I know, doesn't do that. Besides, AVCHD sucks for editing. So, I have to use Cineform NeoScene to transcode first...which led to...

2. Nero Vision won't recognize Cineform AVI. It will see the audio...not the video.

3. After installation, and the system takeover that Nero does with it's now even MORE bloated infestation, I got some malware installed that ground my system to an almost halt.

4. My Blu-Ray burner then began creating coasters with any kind of optical media I put in it. It would burn one groove and spit out the disc...I toasted 3 expensive blu-rays, 2 DVD's, and 3 CD's before the "duh" moment and stopped.

5. I spent 30 minutes trying to get Nero off my PC. Then I re-flashed the firmware on my LG Blu-Ray burner which was still getting hung up on simply burning data discs using Windows XP.

6. The Nero media manager makes it a major ordeal to browse media folders for pictures, videos, etc. It throws out the logical directory structure, and puts a wine-soaked hobo in charge of your files.



The Nero package is so huge, that it's hard to resist and fun to play with. I've done a lot with it purely for the hell of it in the past with DV and HDV, but do all my paying work Sony Vegas Pro and DVDA.

But I think I can still say that if someone just needs budget software with pro resuluts, to try out Sony Vegas Movie Studio (the consumer version of Vegas), and similarly Photoshop Elements...which works equally well for the advanced amateur like Movie Studio does.

Like the GH1, Nero is a piece of consumer gear that you can get results with if you learn it and make the best of it. But Nero 10 finally killed it for me....no more Nero for me...I'm done with them. I just wish I could transfer my license to someone who could get better use out of it...since I just bought the upgrade. :(
 
1. GH1 1080p is useless to me until you remove pulldown. Nero Vision, as far as I know, doesn't do that. Besides, AVCHD sucks for editing. So, I have to use Cineform NeoScene to transcode first...which led to..
Ooops - I did mean to specify that I'm in PAL land where life is less of a pulldown than elsewhere... personally, using this new Nero version (which touch wood doesn't seem to have screwed anything else on my system) AVCHD is for once not sucking for editing. Other low cost NLE's on my system (Pinnacle Studio 14, Cyberlink PowerDirector 8, Premiere Elements 8 spring to mind) have made sufficiently hard work of AVCHD (from the GH1 at least) that I've transcoded everything to high bitrate MPEG2 first. With this new Nero I'm not feeling the need to do so at all. I think I tried Vegas and it too seemed not up to the job, here.

But it seems to me that one man's meat is very much another man's poison when it comes to video editing software. On almost every NLE software forum you'll see posts from people completely rubbishing brand X and saying they're switching to brand Y. Read the brand Y forum and you'll see exactly the opposite. I have no idea why my PC will not run some NLE software well, while others with similar systems have no such problems. So really the letters "YMMV" need to be posted at the end of any user review of NLE software.

Anyway - yup, the "Don't worry about what your editor can do. Worry about what you can do with your editor. " thing is very apt. And as far as I can see, the vast majority of actual edits you see on a TV drama or the like simply use butt joins with no transitions, though usually with an audio crossfade to avoid any audio glitches. Or am I wrong? Of course no doubt all sorts of clever stuff is being done with colour effects and you don't get high end tools for that in cheap software, but simply for putting your footage into the required order with the unrequired bits cut away, only a very simple tool is required, though its design should be such that it doesn't get in the way of the creative process (nor waste time).
 
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