C200: Do you use your C200's EVF?

[Tim Nitsch]

I'm just about ready to pull the trigger on a C200, but I'm not completely sure if I should go with the C200 or C200B.

I have a Ronin MX and use it quite a bit, and not having to deal with the EVF getting in the way would be great.
But at the same time, I sometimes like to go really small and use my C100 like a DSLR (looking through the EVF) which obviously I wouldn't be able to do with the C200B.

Those that have the C200, how do you like the EVF.
And those with the C200B do you miss the EVF?

 

[puredrifting]

The EVF itself is really good, I think it looks excellent. I like to shoot shoulder mounted so the built-in is useless for that, but it is surprisingly useful for tripod based shooting, I like it and use it. But even if you like to shoot stripped down, handheld, you would probably use an add-on EVF to get into the right position or just use the touchscreen with a Hoodman. BTW, I am turning up the luminance on the touchscreen +2 which brightens it up quite a bit and a Hoodman H400 and it makes it semi usable in bright sun. Not perfect, the damn screen is a glossy mirror but very usable in semi sun, semi shade.

Personally I feel the resale on the C200B is going to be terrible, who wants to buy an EVF-less camera unless they ONLY shoot gimbal or crane with it? If I didn't own a tripod, I would buy the C200B but I would end up also buying the grip, handle and touchscreen for it. But some are buying the 200B. Personally I find gimbals useful for certain things but I am getting burnout on roving camera, I think it's a fad and gets way over used. But I'm not a Millenial, who apparently were born thinking that any camera should be moving all of the time and should never stand still. At all. Ever. For gimbal though, the EVF does get in the way on certain gimbals at least, don't know about the Ronin MX? The hot tip would be to get the 200B, the grip, touchscreen and handle and then add the Zacuto Gratical or Gratical Eye. But then you are knocking on $9k or $10k total.

 

[Tim Nitsch]

@Puredrifting

I do want the EVF. Having used the crappy EVF on my C100, it would be nice to have something better. I have tested the C200's EVF very briefly at a trade show and it did seem pretty nice, albeit a little dark, but that could just be settings.

And I guess I can always get the weight set from DJI to accommodate the EVF when balancing it on my Ronin.

I just feel like I would use it maybe 10% of the time and am just wonder if it's worth it.

Thanks for the input!

 

[Eric Coughlin]

The C100 Mark I EVF is way better than the C200B's EVF, so you'd really be stepping down in EVF quality if you get the C200B.

Dan, have you compared brightness of the LCD on the C200 to the C300 Mark II's brightness? The C300 Mark II also has the +2 setting for "LCD Backlight," which I find is quite bright and works incredibly well and makes the screen view-able without a hood in most cases. Sometimes I'll put the hood on, but often find I don't need it and then take it off. It's definitely brighter than a SmallHD 502. So I wonder if the C200 LCD is as bright. I'm also still wondering if Canon will give a firmware update for the C200 LCD to work with the C300 Mark II.

I actually don't use the EVF on my C300 Mark II that often since the LCD is typically bright enough. Also, because the C300 Mark II is heavier, I'm less likely to shoot it in a cradle position, and more likely to put it on my shoulder (where I then use the LCD screen, sometimes with the Zacuto Z-finder). The C100 Mark II I use the viewfinder the most on, as it's light enough to use in a cradle position, such that I don't shoulder mount it often (plus I don't own a third party EVF, so shoulder mounting is more difficult since I can't repo the LCD screen like on the C300).

Dan's probably right about the lack of an EVF hurting resale value. Though, for myself, resale value is generally not much of a concern. The last time I sold a camera was about six years ago.

 

[puredrifting]

Tough call. For me, if I had the 200B, I would have to buy a Zacuto Gratical which is another $2,300.00 So for me, the stock EVF and using my older, just okay Zacuto EVF Pro is working. The only thing that is frustrating me is that for some reason, I don't think the C200 let's you apply a LUT to the HDMI output, only the EVF, touchscreen and SDI. I have had someone at Canon looking and trying to verfy if that's true but so far, I can't figure out how to apply the BT-709 LUT to my HDMI output. If I had a Gratical Eye or Gratical, wouldn't matter since they can exhibit their own LUTs but the EVF Pro was made for DSLRs so it has no internal LUT capacity. So when I am shooting C-Log 3, shoulder mounted with the EVF Pro, I have to look at and try to judge exposure and focus on a washed out C-Log 3 view. The diagram in the menus shows you able to apply a LUT to all of the other outputs, just not HDMI, which doesn't really make sense to me. If they can apply it to SDI, why not HDMI? Anyway, so it appears that I am SOL unless I swap out the EVF Pro for something that either takes SDI or has it's own built in LUT ability. Makes so sense why they can send it out SDI but not HDMI?

 

[Ezella]

The C100 Mark I EVF is way better than the C200B's EVF, so you'd really be stepping down in EVF quality if you get the C200B.

C200B has EVF? Oh wow!

 

[KenFTW]

C200B has EVF? Oh wow!

Well mine doesn't and I feel robbed! Hahaha

 

[chris f]

I'm just about ready to pull the trigger on a C200, but I'm not completely sure if I should go with the C200 or C200B.

I have a Ronin MX and use it quite a bit, and not having to deal with the EVF getting in the way would be great.
But at the same time, I sometimes like to go really small and use my C100 like a DSLR (looking through the EVF) which obviously I wouldn't be able to do with the C200B.

I'm basically in the same boat, but I'm currently toying with the idea of selling both my C100mk2 & C500 kit to help fund buying both a C200 and a C200B to solve that dilemma. Buying both might not be an option for everyone, but the more I think of it, it seems that 90% of my projects over the past few years consist of:

-Sit down interview or on-camera host talking to camera (Tripod mostly, usually in 4K in order to punch in as a "2nd camera")
-Handheld B-Roll (Literally hand held - low profile, doc style)
-Gimbal B-Roll (Ronin-M)

The other 10% of the time it's some sort of multi-cam shoot that always causes some headaches trying to match C500 w/ C100mk1's & C100mk2's.

I figure if I buy both, the C200 will take care of the tripod & handheld stuff & be able to switch between the two in 2 seconds which would be incredible (unlike my C500 which sits in a heavy cage w/ Odyssey, AB batteries, etc. & needs my easyrig for hand held). And I'm hoping that recording to CFast when needed would even be an upgrade to the quality of C500+Odyssey.

And then I can leave my C200B balanced and rigged in the Ronin 90% of the time to where it's ready to go at the drop of a hat and then on those 10% of times I'm doing multicam, I'd have at least my B camera have the exact same look as my A camera. In both of those situations I'd be fine monitoring the C200B off my Small HD 702 Bright and adding a purchased Canon side grip to increase functionality & allow record start/stop & auto-focus selection when in rigged as a Ronin handle & also when in multi-cam mode. I also figure that by only buying the side grip (and not the handle, touch screen monitor+cable, etc.) I'd be saving whatever resale value I'd be losing.

 

[puredrifting]

I'm basically in the same boat, but I'm currently toying with the idea of selling both my C100mk2 & C500 kit to help fund buying both a C200 and a C200B to solve that dilemma. Buying both might not be an option for everyone, but the more I think of it, it seems that 90% of my projects over the past few years consist of:

-Sit down interview or on-camera host talking to camera (Tripod mostly, usually in 4K in order to punch in as a "2nd camera")
-Handheld B-Roll (Literally hand held - low profile, doc style)
-Gimbal B-Roll (Ronin-M)

The other 10% of the time it's some sort of multi-cam shoot that always causes some headaches trying to match C500 w/ C100mk1's & C100mk2's.

I figure if I buy both, the C200 will take care of the tripod & handheld stuff & be able to switch between the two in 2 seconds which would be incredible (unlike my C500 which sits in a heavy cage w/ Odyssey, AB batteries, etc. & needs my easyrig for hand held). And I'm hoping that recording to CFast when needed would even be an upgrade to the quality of C500+Odyssey.

And then I can leave my C200B balanced and rigged in the Ronin 90% of the time to where it's ready to go at the drop of a hat and then on those 10% of times I'm doing multicam, I'd have at least my B camera have the exact same look as my A camera. In both of those situations I'd be fine monitoring the C200B off my Small HD 702 Bright and adding a purchased Canon side grip to increase functionality & allow record start/stop & auto-focus selection when in rigged as a Ronin handle & also when in multi-cam mode. I also figure that by only buying the side grip (and not the handle, touch screen monitor+cable, etc.) I'd be saving whatever resale value I'd be losing.

If you can afford both, that would be a very sweet set up. That's always been my beef with using gimbals and especially using your A camera on a gimbal than back to handheld or tripod, then back to gimbal. It never is quick, fast and easy, the balance point always changes when you re-mount back onto the gimbal. Every show I work on, they have an Alexa Mini on a Steadicam, dedicated with the Steadicam built, ready to go. The Steadicam op, like Eric, usually doubles as one of the camera ops too so he is jumping back and forth from either shoulder mounted to Steadicam or Tripod mounted to Steadicam. Even on shows I have worked on that were almost all Alexa Mini (Prison Break S5), they had dedicated Minis for the Steadicam and for the Drone team.

Even shooting cradled, which I may be doing a lot of on one of the documentaries I am currently shooting, the EVF gets in the way. I have been experimenting with mounting my EVF Pro on top of the handle so it is close to my eye and I can cradle the C200 in close to my body, it works pretty well. Team that with a small prime and you have a really high quality, low light machine with a very small footprint, very unintimadting visually. I much prefer shooting shoulder mounted for handheld but when you are riding in cars with the subject, or squeezed into small tight spaces, cradling seems to be the way to go, it gives a very diferent feel compared to shoulder mounted or handheld using the handle and the touchscreen. It's really nice for intimate moments, which we are exploring a lot of very emotional moments with our subjects, we may be shooting them at work and at school, so the smaller and lower key the setup appears the better. It's also nice to go from eye level with a standing, walking subject to sitting down on a couch or in a car with them. I'm thinking this documentary will see little to no gimbal and a lot of cradling footage because that's what will work best for the story. So Chris, you will dig shooting cradled with the C200B, that EVF does get in the way. But the C200 would be better on tripod, the built in EVF is even HDR capable if you ever shoot HDR or ACES workflow.

I say if you can afford it, like Canon cameras and have an investment in EOS glass, this is the way to go.

 

[indiawilds]

I'm basically in the same boat, but I'm currently toying with the idea of selling both my C100mk2 & C500 kit to help fund buying both a C200 and a C200B to solve that dilemma. Buying both might not be an option for everyone, but the more I think of it, it seems that 90% of my projects over the past few years consist of:

-Sit down interview or on-camera host talking to camera (Tripod mostly, usually in 4K in order to punch in as a "2nd camera")
-Handheld B-Roll (Literally hand held - low profile, doc style)
-Gimbal B-Roll (Ronin-M)

The other 10% of the time it's some sort of multi-cam shoot that always causes some headaches trying to match C500 w/ C100mk1's & C100mk2's.

I figure if I buy both, the C200 will take care of the tripod & handheld stuff & be able to switch between the two in 2 seconds which would be incredible (unlike my C500 which sits in a heavy cage w/ Odyssey, AB batteries, etc. & needs my easyrig for hand held). And I'm hoping that recording to CFast when needed would even be an upgrade to the quality of C500+Odyssey.

And then I can leave my C200B balanced and rigged in the Ronin 90% of the time to where it's ready to go at the drop of a hat and then on those 10% of times I'm doing multicam, I'd have at least my B camera have the exact same look as my A camera. In both of those situations I'd be fine monitoring the C200B off my Small HD 702 Bright and adding a purchased Canon side grip to increase functionality & allow record start/stop & auto-focus selection when in rigged as a Ronin handle & also when in multi-cam mode. I also figure that by only buying the side grip (and not the handle, touch screen monitor+cable, etc.) I'd be saving whatever resale value I'd be losing.

Makes a lot of sense for your type of shooting.

 

[chris f]

I say if you can afford it, like Canon cameras and have an investment in EOS glass, this is the way to go.

As an exercise today I went back through every shoot I've done in the past 12 months or so (both shoots that I've produced/directed & shoots where was hired soley as a cinematographer) and I determined that every single shoot would have gone better (and gotten better footage for most of them) if I had this set up. The only thing I would have done differently (besides the cams) would have been to rent good Canon photo glass and nix hiring a 1st AC on a couple of my studio shoots. Would have been cheaper (and fortunately/unfortunately would have gotten better focus results with autofocus on one of them).

 

[puredrifting]

The object and face tracking are pretty useful.

 

[Fahnon]

First time I used my camera outside the house, it was about noon on a sunny day. I literally immediately used and appreciated having a decent EVF built into the camera.

I think it's funny when folks talk like the only choices are a terrible EVF or no EVF. Having a good EVF on your camera is always a plus.