Do you charge overtime and for staying(not working) over nights fees?
- Thread starter loudlael
- Start date
manglerBMX
Veteran
i'm non union and overtime starts after 10 hours. so whatever your day rate is / 10 x 1.5 is your overtime hourly rate.
Do I understand this correctly? Are you asking about travel shoots, and whether you charge overtime for sleeping at the hotel?
Absolutely not. You need to work out with the hiring producer whether/how you get paid for travel days (some pay mileage, some pay half-day or full-day rate for travel days). But once you're there, you are on the clock from AM crew call until you wrap. After you wrap, you are on your own to entertain yourself for the evening, or to sleep, but the producer isn't responsible for paying you overtime to do that.
Overtime generally starts past a 10-hour day, if you are still working.
Absolutely not. You need to work out with the hiring producer whether/how you get paid for travel days (some pay mileage, some pay half-day or full-day rate for travel days). But once you're there, you are on the clock from AM crew call until you wrap. After you wrap, you are on your own to entertain yourself for the evening, or to sleep, but the producer isn't responsible for paying you overtime to do that.
Overtime generally starts past a 10-hour day, if you are still working.
I wasn't considering charging every hour I'm away from my little dogie and my thermos, only if there is a flat extra fee that some people might charge for staying over night. I was asked, so since I was asked, I assume that there is. but you know what assuming does... makes an ass out of u and me
Rippie
Veteran
Just what C2V said.
If you are out of town they should be responsible for your dinner as well as any other expenses, but that really depends on who you're working for.
I find most productions companies will do that, but if you're working for a network it usually isnt the case, BUT you do get a per diem.
I ran into a tricky situation 2 weeks ago. I did a 3 day job out of town at a very high end resort. I was the only freelance person on the crew, others were employees of the production company.
Our middle day was supposed to start at 12 or 1 pm. Great, can hang out in our townhouse or go to the spa..etc.
Well the first day there we find out they are going to have a rehearsal at 6:30am the next day.
It lasted for an hour but pretty much negated sleeping in and doing anything fun.
Of course they asked me was I going to charge them from the 6:30am through evening
or would I cut them slack since I didn't work for 4 hours in between. In one hand I was on site at 6:30 and pretty much never got to go back to "personal time"
but on the other its tough to charge for hanging out.
In the end I didn't charge them even though it ended up being a 13-14 hour day from the 6:30am start.
Point being is you really have to feel it out, but in general its what C2V mentions.
berniebeaudry
Well-known member
On an out of town shoot I charged from the time we left the hotel to the time we returned to the hotel. It was a forty minute drive to the location. If we stopped for dinner on the way back instead of going straight to the hotel then the day ended then. Lunch breaks can be factored off of the daily hourly total if you feel appropriate.
Bernie
Bernie
I have dealt with these issues for many years, not so much in film - video, but providing service to customers while away from the home area. Think day rate + travel + expenses or a realistic per diem. If I pay an employee a days wages to travel, my costs for the employee don't change, and if I don't charge the full rate, I have lost opportunity for other work that pays the full rate. That employee isn't making the normal shop rate doing something else, so if I don't charge full tilt boogey, doing that away from home job would cost me money. Even if you own your own business, you still need to look at yourself as an employee when billing. What is your time worth? If I can't make a profit, I'd rather stay home and pet the cat. I can understand cutting a deal on travel days if you are thumb twidling, but it is just crazy to do that if you have other work.
Rippies split day case was a bit unique. Usually I have had employees who role with the flow for something like that. If it rolls over 8 hours in a day, that is overtime. Some folks might tweak this a little, but it is a good place to start.
Bernie, I'm not so sure I would charge time portal to portal from the hotel unless the distance was excessive. Do your employees get paid to drive from home to your business? If you had to pack a bunch of gear or do other stuff before the gig, that is something different.
After 23+ years in the operation of several service businesses, I have found that many folks don't track the true cost of doing business, and thus, undercharge. My overall business strategy has been to treat every customer fairly and consistantly, charge per the true cost of the job with a fair profit, never take advantage of a customer, and earn customer respect by delivering quality, on time, and on budget rather than cheap.
Grant
Rippies split day case was a bit unique. Usually I have had employees who role with the flow for something like that. If it rolls over 8 hours in a day, that is overtime. Some folks might tweak this a little, but it is a good place to start.
Bernie, I'm not so sure I would charge time portal to portal from the hotel unless the distance was excessive. Do your employees get paid to drive from home to your business? If you had to pack a bunch of gear or do other stuff before the gig, that is something different.
After 23+ years in the operation of several service businesses, I have found that many folks don't track the true cost of doing business, and thus, undercharge. My overall business strategy has been to treat every customer fairly and consistantly, charge per the true cost of the job with a fair profit, never take advantage of a customer, and earn customer respect by delivering quality, on time, and on budget rather than cheap.
Grant
Alan H. Chang
Veteran
Hey Seth,
Charge your regular rate, after 10 hours push to 1.5x. All overnights and food/expenses should be covered, but dependent on prod. co. Anything over a 2-hour drive or 100+ miles away from your origin should be extra. Must talk with producer before you accept, or you'll get burned.
Charge your regular rate, after 10 hours push to 1.5x. All overnights and food/expenses should be covered, but dependent on prod. co. Anything over a 2-hour drive or 100+ miles away from your origin should be extra. Must talk with producer before you accept, or you'll get burned.
berniebeaudry
Well-known member
Thank you CV2.
It makes sense because you still have to haul your gear to the car or van, pack it in and then go to the location. Often there is gear prep that is needed before you leave and that either gets done in the morning or the night before. I don't charge for that so its an even trade in my opinion.
Rippie
Veteran
I've always done 1 hour or 30 miles.
Its interesting to see how different markets work.
We were always, officially on the clock at crew call in the hotel lobby. If crew call was at 7am in the lobby and we weren't at the location until 8:45am, we were still paid from 7am. As Rippie pointed out, dinner was clocked as a meal break.
Alan H. Chang
Veteran
Hey Rippie,
My example was a worst-case-scenario-desparate-for-money type of situation. Sometimes producers love working with the same sound team and would cover as much expenses as needed just for sake of convenience, quality, and business relation. Definitely 1 hour travel is a lot already. Anything more they would need to look for someone else more local to their locations.
Hey, if you can get portal to portal....I'm in.
Locally, I have begun using a setup fee. This charge includes my time to mobilize, setup, then breakdown at the end, and is usually a two hour minimum and often much more depending on how elaborate the shoot is. I do this instead of charging for individual pieces of equipment and seems easier for the customer to swallow (or choke).
Even if the customer doesn't see the line items due to the way a quotation is presented, it still lives in my bookkeeping software, as I break things up by activity. At the end of the year, it gives you the opportunity to see what you are spending your time on since each activity is posted in my chart of accounts.
Grant
Locally, I have begun using a setup fee. This charge includes my time to mobilize, setup, then breakdown at the end, and is usually a two hour minimum and often much more depending on how elaborate the shoot is. I do this instead of charging for individual pieces of equipment and seems easier for the customer to swallow (or choke).
Even if the customer doesn't see the line items due to the way a quotation is presented, it still lives in my bookkeeping software, as I break things up by activity. At the end of the year, it gives you the opportunity to see what you are spending your time on since each activity is posted in my chart of accounts.
Grant