Deuceofspades
Veteran
Welcome to dvxuser forum Nick! there are some wonderful people here and all are very helpful. i don't know what I would have done without them!!
FEATURE: DEUCE OF SPADES - How I made a period full feature film all by myself on ZERO budget
- Thread starter Deuceofspades
- Start date
Welcome to dvxuser forum Nick! there are some wonderful people here and all are very helpful. i don't know what I would have done without them!!
Deuceofspades
Veteran
That's OK, I think I'm gonna hang on to my rig. if the movie does well, I'll buy whatever is new and hot then... As this seems to change every other month LOL.
In the end, some of it is the gear you use but a lot of it is what your are filming and how good your story is... I'd take a good story / crappy footage quality anyday over great footage quality and crappy story. :happy:
Of course having outstanding both would be pretty cool too hehe...
craigbowman
Veteran
Glad to hear you're down to your last few pickup shots Faith. Get ready to be more famous than you ever imagined! I'm all excited, and I wasn't even there on set.
In the end your poster will be what you want it to me. However, I had a chance to show six different people the poster you've been wrestling with and the image I suggested. All of them chose the image with you under the car without hesitation and four of those six people were women. (But maybe there's more to them than I realized)
Good luck with your world premiere! If this movie doesn't catapult you to success, there's not a hope in h*ll for the rest of us.
In the end your poster will be what you want it to me. However, I had a chance to show six different people the poster you've been wrestling with and the image I suggested. All of them chose the image with you under the car without hesitation and four of those six people were women. (But maybe there's more to them than I realized)
Good luck with your world premiere! If this movie doesn't catapult you to success, there's not a hope in h*ll for the rest of us.
jasonthewho
Veteran
Congrats on filming your last scene, Faith, that's awesome!
I totally understand what you're saying about how the legs photo doesn't tell enough about the film, but I think there's more to people liking it than the legs. The image is very unique, with great colors, filter effect, angle and intrigue. It has a nice sense of movement, and seems less generic than the image of Johnny with the car. It also fits the vertical format of a poster well.
I'm not saying to use the legs photo, but I do think it's worth considering what about it gets people's interest. I think you should aim to make an image of Johnny that is as eyecatching.
I like your idea of using both girls and Johnny, but I'm not sure you need to necessarily have a girl on the poster. After all, it's not like guys didn't go see Gladiator.
I totally understand what you're saying about how the legs photo doesn't tell enough about the film, but I think there's more to people liking it than the legs. The image is very unique, with great colors, filter effect, angle and intrigue. It has a nice sense of movement, and seems less generic than the image of Johnny with the car. It also fits the vertical format of a poster well.
I'm not saying to use the legs photo, but I do think it's worth considering what about it gets people's interest. I think you should aim to make an image of Johnny that is as eyecatching.
I like your idea of using both girls and Johnny, but I'm not sure you need to necessarily have a girl on the poster. After all, it's not like guys didn't go see Gladiator.
Deuceofspades
Veteran
HAHA well said
...Ok, making a poster of Johnny that is as eye catching: How about I put baby doll shoes on him and a really tight short and get him under the car in the same angle & positon etc as I did ....
Hmmmmmm...
On second thoughts, maybe not LOL...
:-Laugh(DBG):
Ted Spencer
Veteran
rogar-Shock(DBG):
ripupthehwy
Well-known member
Hey Faith, I'm looking forward to seeing your film. It appears you shot with an HVX and a Letus dof adaptor. I have the same setup. (Just started usuing the adapter). Did you have many issues with seeing the ground glass of the letus in your shots? Do you have any tips on how to get a less grainy picture due to the ground glass?
Also your overall lighting and image looks quite filmic and really great. Did you shoot with your camera's iris wide open and then use heavy ND filters outdoors? Or did you stop down some as needed? I doubt you lucked out with mostly overcast days in California. I recently used my new Letus on a bright sunny day and even with ND 6 & 8 filters everything was quite bright and flat looking. Would have been better if I was shooting on an overcast day instead.
Any tips ?
You say in your first post you had little or no experience but somebody knew what they were doing the the lighting to get u such great shots thats for sure.
Also your overall lighting and image looks quite filmic and really great. Did you shoot with your camera's iris wide open and then use heavy ND filters outdoors? Or did you stop down some as needed? I doubt you lucked out with mostly overcast days in California. I recently used my new Letus on a bright sunny day and even with ND 6 & 8 filters everything was quite bright and flat looking. Would have been better if I was shooting on an overcast day instead.
Any tips ?
You say in your first post you had little or no experience but somebody knew what they were doing the the lighting to get u such great shots thats for sure.
Deuceofspades
Veteran
Hey Faith, I'm looking forward to seeing your film. It appears you shot with an HVX and a Letus dof adaptor. I have the same setup. (Just started usuing the adapter). Did you have many issues with seeing the ground glass of the letus in your shots? Do you have any tips on how to get a less grainy picture due to the ground glass?
Also your overall lighting and image looks quite filmic and really great. Did you shoot with your camera's iris wide open and then use heavy ND filters outdoors? Or did you stop down some as needed? I doubt you lucked out with mostly overcast days in California. I recently used my new Letus on a bright sunny day and even with ND 6 & 8 filters everything was quite bright and flat looking. Would have been better if I was shooting on an overcast day instead.
Any tips ?
You say in your first post you had little or no experience but somebody knew what they were doing the the lighting to get u such great shots thats for sure.
Hi there and welcome to my thread... the first thing to ask is which Letus adapter you are using? Extreme or Ultimate? I have used both so i can help with advice and tips on either, but my answer will vary vastly depending on which one you are using as they are two different animals.
Is your Letus adapter vibrating GG or rotating GG?
As far as the shots looking cinematic, I think the most vital element causing this is having a good eye (composition, framing and camera moves). Second is the lighting (without which the shots look like crap) . Third is the careful planning of subject matter and backgrounds. Last is the camera / adapter and other gear.
Shooting outdoors is always a challenge for a multitude of reasons. Sun keeps travelling and light can change quickly from shot to shot, especially if you shoot at magic hour.
Careful planning of yoru outdoors shoots will be necessary if you want to capture the rigth exposure. This might entail:
1- Scouting location at different time of the day to see how sun travels, possible shadows cast from buildings, trees etc...
2- Picking the time frame where location's own natural lighting looks best
3- Shooting the scene at that time, which might mean you will need to rehearse ahead of time and plan each shot, pick lenses etc before the day of the shoot. (and they wonder why itis taking me a year and a half to film all 90 scenes of my film)
Overcast days can be a blessing or a curse. I like overcast if it is diffusing sunlight but some is still left, resulting in a soft light with some shadows. I don't care for heavily overcast or full shade as this will produce a flat image. No shadow means no depth to the shots. Full sun can work but with closing the iris or using ND filters, the image starts looking dim and dark. Losing the vibrance I love. I have had some good luck with full sun, like the shoot below for exemple, but the sun was a bit lower on the key shots as you can see from the shadow on his face. I will post some screengrabs of that challenging full sun mid day shoot and some comments /tips in my next post.
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Deuceofspades
Veteran
This scene was shot over an entire two day span. the bulk of shots were done in mid day, with end of scene shot at magicv hour (more romantic and intimate section of scene)
Starting with a 10AM full sun, summer day shot, but exposure not bad: Notice the framing is bottom heavy, camera placed very low to the ground to emphasize the lines converging on the horison. Benefit was also that there is hardly any sky in this shot, alleviating exposure problem (blown sky)
there is the next shot, Johnny and the deuce. Pretty sure I ha ND filter engaged half way on HVX200 (I never do full way unless it is a matter of life or death)... Exposuer not bad considering this is a hot, super bright summer mid day shot.
here you can see the sun bouncing on his leather jacket is causing a blow spot, but it didn't bother me.
This shot was done the day before, also mid day, and I am shooting against the sky. Now sure how I pulled this one off LOL, but it looks fine. We did have a bounce on her face which otehrwise woudl have been dark. the challenge was that this was a MOVING shot, I was dollying backwards from eth truck of a car and Bettie and merc moving forward, so boom/mic and bounce hjad to travel along. It took 6 peole to pull this this one shot but it looks way cool
Shot below: Clearly blown on their faces, but still flies because placement of actors acuses shadow on their faces to be pleasing to the eye. CAREFUL PLACEMENT OF ACTORS IS A MUST at all time.
Likewise in shot below: Notice how the light lights Johnny's face (in teh mirror) perfectly. That is no coincidence. All I had to light that shot was.... the SUN.
Same below: perfect light angle on his face. I planned these shots for later in the day when the sun woudl be lower on the horison.
same below:
Careful positioning of actors depending on sun orientation will produce this: (this may mean CHEATING positions from shot to shot)
Starting with a 10AM full sun, summer day shot, but exposure not bad: Notice the framing is bottom heavy, camera placed very low to the ground to emphasize the lines converging on the horison. Benefit was also that there is hardly any sky in this shot, alleviating exposure problem (blown sky)
there is the next shot, Johnny and the deuce. Pretty sure I ha ND filter engaged half way on HVX200 (I never do full way unless it is a matter of life or death)... Exposuer not bad considering this is a hot, super bright summer mid day shot.
here you can see the sun bouncing on his leather jacket is causing a blow spot, but it didn't bother me.
This shot was done the day before, also mid day, and I am shooting against the sky. Now sure how I pulled this one off LOL, but it looks fine. We did have a bounce on her face which otehrwise woudl have been dark. the challenge was that this was a MOVING shot, I was dollying backwards from eth truck of a car and Bettie and merc moving forward, so boom/mic and bounce hjad to travel along. It took 6 peole to pull this this one shot but it looks way cool
Shot below: Clearly blown on their faces, but still flies because placement of actors acuses shadow on their faces to be pleasing to the eye. CAREFUL PLACEMENT OF ACTORS IS A MUST at all time.
Likewise in shot below: Notice how the light lights Johnny's face (in teh mirror) perfectly. That is no coincidence. All I had to light that shot was.... the SUN.
Same below: perfect light angle on his face. I planned these shots for later in the day when the sun woudl be lower on the horison.
same below:
Careful positioning of actors depending on sun orientation will produce this: (this may mean CHEATING positions from shot to shot)
Deuceofspades
Veteran
One of my fave shots of Johnny (same shoot)
End of scene, softer sun
Earlier that day, struggling with full sun trying to pull off the start of Johnny / Bettie conversation, my only solution was to place the actors in teh shade of the trees, which kept shifting. we had to move actors every take to compensate and eventually lost that bit of shade.
below: Overexposure from the sun bouncing on the darn light colored ground. This shot was fixed in post.
Using a diffuser above the actor's head to cut down ugly glare, but diffuser too small to cover trees as well, resulting in leaves to teh left of Johnny being completely blown (oye)
Bettie's looking pretty good, a bit flat but not too bad, besides, she is so lovely noone cares
As you can see, each shot presented its own set of headaches / problems and I had to come up with a different solution for each.
NOTE: Above shots are raw footage before any color correction / grading.
When shooting outdoors, I always have one or two bounces and a large flag / diffuser combo. for CU you can use the diffuser (I think mine is like 6'X6' so not that large really) on a C stand with sand bags to cut down the amount of light and this will make your actors look better. Harsh light can make anyone look ugly (even handsome looking actors like Johnny LOL). Your job is to make yoru actors look good at all cost.
Shooting run and gun near potentially leathal entities LOL (cops, rangers, security guards LOL) may mean you cannot use bounces or flags / diffusers... And do the best you can as fast as you can do it... They are less likely to ask you to leave if you look harmless. Big smile helps too .
End of scene, softer sun
Earlier that day, struggling with full sun trying to pull off the start of Johnny / Bettie conversation, my only solution was to place the actors in teh shade of the trees, which kept shifting. we had to move actors every take to compensate and eventually lost that bit of shade.
below: Overexposure from the sun bouncing on the darn light colored ground. This shot was fixed in post.
Using a diffuser above the actor's head to cut down ugly glare, but diffuser too small to cover trees as well, resulting in leaves to teh left of Johnny being completely blown (oye)
Bettie's looking pretty good, a bit flat but not too bad, besides, she is so lovely noone cares
As you can see, each shot presented its own set of headaches / problems and I had to come up with a different solution for each.
NOTE: Above shots are raw footage before any color correction / grading.
When shooting outdoors, I always have one or two bounces and a large flag / diffuser combo. for CU you can use the diffuser (I think mine is like 6'X6' so not that large really) on a C stand with sand bags to cut down the amount of light and this will make your actors look better. Harsh light can make anyone look ugly (even handsome looking actors like Johnny LOL). Your job is to make yoru actors look good at all cost.
Shooting run and gun near potentially leathal entities LOL (cops, rangers, security guards LOL) may mean you cannot use bounces or flags / diffusers... And do the best you can as fast as you can do it
... They are less likely to ask you to leave if you look harmless. Big smile helps too .
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ripupthehwy
Well-known member
Hi Faith, thanks SO MUCH for the info and advice. Yeah choosing shots according to the sun and time of day is something I need to work on better. Great shots!!
As far as my Letus, it is the cheap one, the extreme. Vibrating glass. Any advice on that?
Rich
As far as my Letus, it is the cheap one, the extreme. Vibrating glass. Any advice on that?
Rich
Deuceofspades
Veteran
Yeah, I shot most of my film on the extreme. Keep batteries strong to keep vibration fast. Don't close lense iris past 4 nor camera iris and keep speed below 120.
Usually I kept my lense iris wide open or not closed more than 4. My camera iris was never past 4 either. I used ND filter when sun too bright. Shutter speed at 120 starts to show artifact and above that, forget it. Avoid solid light colored backgrounds (such as... you guessed it, THE SKY)
I have section of my film shot on the dry lake where you can clearly see the ground glass... I tried to do the best I could with the means at hand. On other scenes, the Extreme was extremely (hehe) clean. Obviously it is going to do a good job in lower light situations, that call for low shutter speed and open iris.
With the Ultimate all footage is clean clean clean. I can do whatever I want, just about any speed and any iris settings (albeis the occasional strobbing of overexopsed areas at certain shutter speeds) , that freeed me considerably, which is why I decided to cough up another 3 some grands to get that freedom. In retrospect I wish I had bought the Ultimate in the first place that when I first started to film, but the Ultimate didn't exist then... So... There you have it...
Still, all the footage in my trailer was shot with the Extreme, so you can still get some pretty awesome stuff with a little planning.
Deuceofspades
Veteran
back to poster project:
This is another hot rod movie that came out back in the seventies, look at how busy the poster is (heck the man character even has someone else's face covering his cheek!! Yikes!)
Ironically I don't remember seeing a single shot of any ocean in that film (why the heck did they put it in there???)
This is another hot rod movie that came out back in the seventies, look at how busy the poster is (heck the man character even has someone else's face covering his cheek!! Yikes!)
Ironically I don't remember seeing a single shot of any ocean in that film (why the heck did they put it in there???)
Deuceofspades
Veteran
And thsi is the poster for Ameriacvn Graffiti... Fits the film well LOL
http://www.impawards.com/1973/american_graffiti_ver3.html
http://www.impawards.com/1973/american_graffiti_ver3.html
Deuceofspades
Veteran
This one is Two Lane Blacktop, cool poster, fits the film feel well i think.
Thsi one is a mosrerecent release but is not a Hot Rod movie, but we'll throw it in there anyways what the heck
Thsi one is a mosrerecent release but is not a Hot Rod movie, but we'll throw it in there anyways what the heck
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Deuceofspades
Veteran
from there we jump back in time to the fifties... not the way I awnt to go bu to illustrate the many looks that hot Rod films have had over the years here we go:
Deuceofspades
Veteran
Well i think that sums it up for Hot Rod related film posters... The old fifties Hot Rod B flicks posters are all the same, if you seen one you seen them all...
Leaving me in a class of my own having to break new grounds.
A new Milleneum kind of Hot Rod film dictates a new kind of poster too
(Scratching my head)
Leaving me in a class of my own having to break new grounds.
A new Milleneum kind of Hot Rod film dictates a new kind of poster too
(Scratching my head)
Postmaster
Dark Side of the Camera
God knows, I really really love American Graffiti, but this is one of the ugliest film posters in the history of movie making.
I saw the film more than 20 times, but I never saw that poster before.
I don´t know who the guy was, that has drawn those characters, but it reminds me to one of the MAD Magazine artists of the 70s/80s
"Tie him to the car and drag him" yeah!
Frank
I saw the film more than 20 times, but I never saw that poster before.
I don´t know who the guy was, that has drawn those characters, but it reminds me to one of the MAD Magazine artists of the 70s/80s
"Tie him to the car and drag him" yeah!
Frank
Deuceofspades
Veteran
UPDATES!!!!!!!!!!!!
Corner stone moment in the history of my film. Last night I screened my film for the first time !
It was a small private screening, involving some industry people, some hotrodders,a few friends and a few more people who were perfect strangers to me. About 16 people total. I never had a chance to watch my film before, from begining to end so I basically "discovered" it at the same time as they did.
WHAT AN AMAZING FEELING !!!
The screening and party was awesome, I was sooooo happy and relieved to find out after the movie ended just how much everyone LOVED it. People were going on and on about it for hours afterwards, it was great to be able to finally discuss the film with others. We critiqued it to death and nit picked quite a bit and I did a very indepth feedback questionaire that lasted a good hour.
I was delighted to see that the film emotionally engaged everyone there and that there was not a single dry eye in the audience. Even the tough tatooed guys cried.
Another big relief was to see the ladies (who knew nothing about cars/ hotrods) in the audience absolutely in love with the story and Johnny Callaway. Last night confirmed what I felt all along: The film will cross over and get both male and female audiences alike.
1 out of 3 people felt the film was a tad long, while 2 out of 3 said that the film was long but they didn't mind it at all because it kept them engaged the entire time.
I would love to make the fim a tad shorter, if I can figure out how to do it without killing the heart of the film. I'll be working on that over the next couple weeks.
The cinematography got an unanimous 5 stars over 5, with only one person giving it a 4.5 stars.
Misc additional comments were very diverse and not two alike, which made me very happy. No constant nagging problem to worry about.
I was however distrought that 60% of the audience did not figure out what the ominous tree was about, so I have to add an obvious clue to help them connect the dots. I already have that one figure out so it is just a matter of implementing the changes. Also none of my audience was able to read teh fortune cookie which surprised the heck out of me, so I have to make a better insert and hold it longer on the screen.
By far the most critical friend I have is a pro movie producer and I was very worried about what he would have to say about the film. Imagine my relief when he gave me the hugest hug and just said: "the cinematography, composition, framing and concepts were amazing... How do you do it? You've never been to film school and have never done a film before.... ????? You are a genious". In fact he said Genious at least four times and I know he meant it, but honestly I cannot think of myself as a genious. Rather, as a dedicated novice who maybe had a gift she didn't know was there and is now discovering it and has a LOT to learn still. I was very happy he thought I was genious as a filmmaker but also quite a bit embarrassed. I know this was a huge accomplishment and I am proud of it, but I still see myself as just a rookie, just a girl with her little camera, who needs to get better at it.
At any rate, if the large screening in Florida next week goes half as well as this one did, I got it made
SPECIAL THANKS to fellow dvx user Perrone for helping me figure out the whole burning the 2.5 hour film process, I don't know what I would have done without his help, or, for that matter, without all of you guys help over the last 2 years. So I say f* film school, just join dvxuser forum and
"You'll be just fine!"
:thumbup:
Corner stone moment in the history of my film. Last night I screened my film for the first time !It was a small private screening, involving some industry people, some hotrodders,a few friends and a few more people who were perfect strangers to me. About 16 people total. I never had a chance to watch my film before, from begining to end so I basically "discovered" it at the same time as they did.
WHAT AN AMAZING FEELING !!!
The screening and party was awesome, I was sooooo happy and relieved to find out after the movie ended just how much everyone LOVED it. People were going on and on about it for hours afterwards, it was great to be able to finally discuss the film with others. We critiqued it to death and nit picked quite a bit and I did a very indepth feedback questionaire that lasted a good hour.
I was delighted to see that the film emotionally engaged everyone there and that there was not a single dry eye in the audience. Even the tough tatooed guys cried.
Another big relief was to see the ladies (who knew nothing about cars/ hotrods) in the audience absolutely in love with the story and Johnny Callaway. Last night confirmed what I felt all along: The film will cross over and get both male and female audiences alike.
1 out of 3 people felt the film was a tad long, while 2 out of 3 said that the film was long but they didn't mind it at all because it kept them engaged the entire time.
I would love to make the fim a tad shorter, if I can figure out how to do it without killing the heart of the film. I'll be working on that over the next couple weeks.
The cinematography got an unanimous 5 stars over 5, with only one person giving it a 4.5 stars.
Misc additional comments were very diverse and not two alike, which made me very happy. No constant nagging problem to worry about.
I was however distrought that 60% of the audience did not figure out what the ominous tree was about, so I have to add an obvious clue to help them connect the dots. I already have that one figure out so it is just a matter of implementing the changes. Also none of my audience was able to read teh fortune cookie which surprised the heck out of me, so I have to make a better insert and hold it longer on the screen.
By far the most critical friend I have is a pro movie producer and I was very worried about what he would have to say about the film. Imagine my relief when he gave me the hugest hug and just said: "the cinematography, composition, framing and concepts were amazing... How do you do it? You've never been to film school and have never done a film before.... ????? You are a genious". In fact he said Genious at least four times and I know he meant it, but honestly I cannot think of myself as a genious. Rather, as a dedicated novice who maybe had a gift she didn't know was there and is now discovering it and has a LOT to learn still. I was very happy he thought I was genious as a filmmaker but also quite a bit embarrassed. I know this was a huge accomplishment and I am proud of it, but I still see myself as just a rookie, just a girl with her little camera, who needs to get better at it.
At any rate, if the large screening in Florida next week goes half as well as this one did, I got it made
SPECIAL THANKS to fellow dvx user Perrone for helping me figure out the whole burning the 2.5 hour film process, I don't know what I would have done without his help, or, for that matter, without all of you guys help over the last 2 years. So I say f* film school, just join dvxuser forum and
"You'll be just fine!"
:thumbup:
