D800

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Geronimo said:
I am prohibited from passing along the contents of their reply, but I am now nervous about picking up both cameras on my own dime to perform side-by-side tests.

If the tests conclude as I suspect they will, I don't really want to be stuck trying to sell a $6600 camera on craigslist or ebay.
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Looks like you already "spilled the beans"
D800 it is then !
And I'll be happy to take it off you if the D4 is your preferred choice. :thumbsup:
 
Zephyrnoid said:
I'm not sure who said it but "between the idea and the execution there falls a shadow"
It's impossible to control all the variables between capture and posting to youtube. Only once we have an empirical and controlled test can we be sure what's what. That's why Phil Askey is on my FAV list. he does it correctly.
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Agreed, a lot can happen from capture to vimeo/youtube compression. The difference here is one is taken from COF ( camera original files ) and the brick one I have no idea, other than it was well over 1gig file to DL. However if there was massive aliasing in the original, it really couldn't have been masked without making this video look worse. It's perplexing at the moment.

Pappas
http://pappasarts.wordpress.com/
http://twitter.com/pappasarts
 
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Geronimo said:
Call your local stores. I live in Seattle, and have been calling our Tall's Camera Store every day for the past couple weeks. They have 1 D4, and a handful of D800's, coming in today. I've got my name on the D4 and one of the D800's.


That said, I received an email reply from Nikon this afternoon from a question I posed to them last week about the best video quality between the D4 and D800 for a filmmaker. I am prohibited from passing along the contents of their reply, but I am now nervous about picking up both cameras on my own dime to perform side-by-side tests.

If the tests conclude as I suspect they will, I don't really want to be stuck trying to sell a $6600 camera on craigslist or ebay.
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Well, here in LA it´s impossible to get any. Sell me the one you don´t want. I pre-ordered both like 2 minutes after the cameras were announced (months ago) and still haven´t got any...
 
PappasArts said:
Agreed, a lot can happen from capture to vimeo/youtube compression. The difference here is one is taken from COF ( camera original files ) and the brick one I have no idea, other than it was well over 1gig file to DL. However if there was massive aliasing in the original, it really couldn't have been masked without making this video look worse. It's perplexing at the moment.

Pappas
http://pappasarts.wordpress.com/
http://twitter.com/pappasarts
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Completely agree. It's like there are two different cameras out there right now, with very different video quality.
 
Geronimo, thanks so much. The D800 appears to have more resolution. It does have more aliasing, as seen on the computer bag in Test #2 (but the D4 aliases as well). What I do find a little distressing/odd the mosquito noise exhibited by the D800 in Tests #3, 4 and 5. Does the camera have an issue w/ scenes w/ a perponderance of green?

But thanks again so very much. I look forward to more test!
 
D800 test: FX vs DX vs D7k
https://vimeo.com/39334369

My own conclusions:
1. DX mode is similar in quality to D7k.
2. In FX mode D800 crops the frame in video mode.
3. FX mode is much sharper, with little aliasing and well-controlled (although still present) moire.
4. Setting NR to OFF produces more pleasing noise pattern.
5. DR doesn't seem to be much improved.
All-in-all D800 seems to be one heck of a camera!
 
latyshev said:
D800 test: FX vs DX vs D7k
https://vimeo.com/39334369

My own conclusions:
1. DX mode is similar in quality to D7k.
2. In FX mode D800 crops the frame in video mode.
3. FX mode is much sharper, with little aliasing and well-controlled (although still present) moire.
4. Setting NR to OFF produces more pleasing noise pattern.
5. DR doesn't seem to be much improved.
All-in-all D800 seems to be one heck of a camera!
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I've been wondering whether certain shooting modes (720p, DX-mode) might be causing some of the more wild moire we've been seeing.

Seems like that might be the case here.
 
Geronimo said:
Ok, I wound up getting both the D4 & D800, and threw together 5 really quick tests.

http://vimeo.com/album/1884940

It's late and I'm tired, so take them with a grain of salt. I'll run better tests this weekend.
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thank you so much , for taking the time , testing and posting the footage :) , finally something to really compare those two cameras
IMO , like you said the color reproduction of the d4 is slightly better , its very strange that the 1x0 crop mode is a little different between the two
i dont see the noise too much , its hard to see in that shallow depth in f2.8 you posted , and you didnt post the original Mov from the camera so its hard to judge
but mainly i think the bubble\rumor that the d800 is much sharper has exploded , i dont see it extremely sharper than the d4
but maybe we need further testing and side by side comparison
 
another test ive found in vimeo with fabrics leafs and grass , it doesnt say what iso did he use , and what lens, but there seems like hell of allot of noise for a bright exterior daylight shot , and its flickers like he didnt lock the AE-Lock button or something
https://vimeo.com/39274584
 
FYI: My on-going email correspondence with David Cubanski of Mosaic Engineering, makers of the VAF-5D2 AA-filter for the 5D Mark II:

[Summary: Creating a similar AA-filter for the new D800 is a "high priority" for Mosaic. And, on another note, he's intrigued by the idea of a sensor-mounted wide-screen hard matte (e.g.: 1.85:1 or 2.39:1) for the new 5DM3.]

=======================
"... we're seeing a rapidly increasing influx of interest in a filter for the D800/800e, as well as better and more complete information on the camera itself, and so are making this a priority now.

The optical mask that you refer to below - well, this would be a very interesting idea... We get better compression performance in the 5DMarkII with our filter, on account of the removal of erroneous extra high-resolution information (in the form of aliasing), and the mask you refer to would be another way of working towards this same goal. ...

At 09:43 PM 3/20/2012, Peter J. DeCrescenzo wrote:

... The D800 interests me because it features clean HDMI output, uncluttered by text & icons. I might use it with an external recorder such as the Atomos Ninja. But the D800's high-MP sensor will probably need a filter similar to your VAF-5D2 to tame its inevitable aliasing & moire artifacts.

... here's a product suggestion: A version of your VAF-5D2, but for the new 5DM3 -- and without the optical filter -- just the black frame, with a smaller "aperture" that snugs up against the sensor so it crops the exposed area of the sensor down to a "wide" aspect ratio such as 1.85:1 or 2.39:1.

The result would be black bars (top & bottom) being encoded into the video recorded by the camera. The camera's VBR codec should result in higher-quality, or a smaller file for the same quality, for the motion-image area of the video because the solid black bars require few bits to encode.

In post the black bars can be easily trimmed (cropped) to result in a final video aspect ratio of 1.85:1 or 2.39:1. ...

On Mar 19, 2012, at 7:30 PM, David Cubanski wrote:

... Yes; we're thinking very much of making a filter for the D800/D880e. Indeed, we're getting many inquiries on these cameras - which is telling. I will tell you, though, that we haven't actually seen one of the cameras yet... or any raw video from one, for that matter, where we could closely analyze what's going on with its video. ...

David Cubanski
Mosaic Engineering, Inc.
210 W. Hamilton Ave. #290
State College, PA, 16801, USA
(+01) 814-359-6290
cubanski@mosaicengineering.com
http://www.mosaicengineering.com

At 12:03 PM 3/19/2012, Peter J. DeCrescenzo wrote:

... I'm wondering if you plan to make available a filter similar to the VAF-5D2 optical anti-aliasing filter, but for Nikon's new D800 DSLR? ...

========================================
 
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Please warn the folks at Mosaic that Nikon (and presumably Canon, as well) use sensor elements on the edges of the image sensor for calibration and level adjustment. Shading these elements is probably unwise. I do not know enough to provide specifics, but I know enough to recommend extreme caution.

-- Bob Elkind
 
eteam said:
Please warn the folks at Mosaic that Nikon (and presumably Canon, as well) use sensor elements on the edges of the image sensor for calibration and level adjustment. Shading these elements is probably unwise. I do not know enough to provide specifics, but I know enough to recommend extreme caution. -- Bob Elkind
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Thanks for the heads-up, Bob. I'll pass along the info. Cheers.
 
I have deliverables due today (dammit), but will bookmark this page and catch up later. Some point to ponder as I am a rookie but an inquisitive one like the rest of us:
1) Mosaic filter. Done no reading on it but I divine that it's positioned over the sensor array and lives between it and the lens - correct? If so, it defeats the objective of having razor sharp objectives. If it's something else, please hit me with an educational cross reference link. More on this later.
2) I used to have the target that i designed around here somewhere but tossed it. I have the digital file for the test target. Guys. One of the reasons you are going crazy trying to sort through all the feedback and example stills, frame grabs and footage is that there is no single fixed template for running tests. Again, I cite Phil for taking that part out of the dark ages. We MUST at least shoot some tests using THE SAME target for comparison. That's the heart and soul of empirical research - control.
OK. c-ya in 24hrs.
 
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