FS7: Custom Mode

bill totolo said:
Traditionally Sony ENG cameras were very good at this function.
If I'm shooting follow doc style with transitions from daylight to tungsten to whatever, what else can I do? (shooting rec709, not log, btw).
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off topic..
and it's hard to understand why a toy like the DJI Osmo pocket does that exceptionally well and a high end camera doesn't. Part of our equipment recently got stuck at customs in North Africa (that's another story) Before doing nothing we shot some scenes of a docu with the Osmo pocket. It unbelievable how this toy manages automated exposure and white balance transitions.
 
bill totolo said:
Traditionally Sony ENG cameras were very good at this function.
If I'm shooting follow doc style with transitions from daylight to tungsten to whatever, what else can I do? (shooting rec709, not log, btw).
Click to expand...

I just make it a point to stop for two seconds and white balance properly. Or if I can anticipate in advance that I'll have changing light conditions, then I'll have one WB saved in memory A and the other in memory B so they are ready to go when needed. Just flip the switch.

I can honestly say that in 35 years of shooting i have never used ATW once, and I'm sure I've been in the same hairy run & gun situations as anyone else have so I don't buy the argument that there isn't time. But, you may ask, if I've never used it how do I know it sucks? Well, because I've seen when a mess it makes every time I've tested it during the production of my numerous camcorder training videos. It is easy to fool the camera, and I'd rather err on the side of having a less-than-perfect white balance but that is inconsistent. That is easy to fix, but a fluctuating WB is a ***** in post. I'm not saying ATW is going to suck every time it is used, but often enough that I wouldn't risk it. It does not meet my standards and I recommend to others that it not be used for professional production.
 
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bill totolo said:
Traditionally Sony ENG cameras were very good at this function.
If I'm shooting follow doc style with transitions from daylight to tungsten to whatever, what else can I do? (shooting rec709, not log, btw).
Click to expand...

A lot depends on the situation and how crazy things are around you... If you can have several white balances already set in the camera (and the camera can be set to slow adjust so you don't have 'switch shock' from one to the other) you may be able to make it work with just those options. I never have ATW as an option on the WB switch because I don't want to give up that 'B' option. I'll set up ATW as one of my user buttons to give me the 4th white balance option if it's needed.
Yes, when following in a news/paparazzi situation often the camera MUST stay rolling continuously -- particularly when it's recording the primary audio and critical comments could come at any time. In these uncontrolled situations ATW can end up giving you something usable when stopping for anything is impossible. Part of being a professional is on one had being as ready as possible with preset balances for many possibilities, while at the same time knowing when an option like ATW will save you by making your footage usable. Yes, ATW will make your footage harder to deal with in post so I don't recommend keeping it on as 'normal', but I always want to have it available for those times when you need it. My feeling is that it's better to come back with something they can air immediately that may take more time in critical post than to come back with something that just looks wrong.
 
I guess it also depends on the type of shooting you're doing and what the client expects. I can't remember the last time I found myself in a situation where "just getting the shot" took priority over the technical aspects of getting good images. Even in a documentary it would be unacceptable for me or other cameras to use ATW. Clearly I don't shoot breaking news and I don't shoot for TMZ. Outdoors in daylight I never white balance anyway, so that simplifies things a little.
 
Doug Jensen said:
I guess it also depends on the type of shooting you're doing and what the client expects. I can't remember the last time I found myself in a situation where "just getting the shot" took priority over the technical aspects of getting good images. Even in a documentary it would be unacceptable for me or other cameras to use ATW. Clearly I don't shoot breaking news and I don't shoot for TMZ. Outdoors in daylight I never white balance anyway, so that simplifies things a little.
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You don't need to be shooting breaking news to be thrown into a situation where there can be 10 or 20 other crews all jostling for coverage - I've never shot directly for news, but often a documentary or magazine show will need me to be right in the press scrum. Many of these situations can involve courthouses or arenas containing numerous hallways with widely varying lighting fixtures, mixed window light, and security services that may change direction midstream for their clients. If you have 'enhanced access credentials' you may even find yourself moving from one press scrum to another, particularly if you have access to more areas than most of the news press. You need to keep rolling because you never know when that critical 5 second comment will be made that's vital to your piece.
 
Been there, done that. Still didn't use ATW.

It's tool on the camera, so use it if you want. I just choose not to.
 
Prefer if given time beforehand to store a couple of WB's under the A/B settings. On the FS7 if you are going to use ATW you can program an assignable button with the ATW LOCK option. At least that way if you have an auto track white that is looking okay for the location you can lock that setting in and stop the ATW wandering around giving you different white values all over the place. As previously mentioned the result of that is an absolute cow and time waster to have to chase down in post.

Chris Young
 
Clermond said:
so you do not know what you arguing against so highly? :D
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Did you not read the rest of my post above? I will repeat it here for your convenience . . .

"But, you may ask, if I've never used it how do I know it sucks? Well, because I've seen when a mess it makes every time I've tested it during the production of my numerous camcorder training videos."
 
A few random thoughts:

1.) Without mentioning names, I've noticed some cameras are better at ATW than others.
2.) If you shot SLog2/3 with a custom matrix, strictly speaking you've ruled out using a device transform in RCM or ACES as the transforms are unaware of your custom gamut science. I assume this matters not to you if you like the result.
3.) Not sure how much use the F55 gets in ENG or run-and-gun but if you did, white balance is purely a post adjustment in RAW as the camera is recording 4k sensor data directly, but a lut could be baked into a simultaneously recorded 1080p XAVC proxy to hand off for dailies.
4.) I had found manual white balancing of SLog2/3 custom mode to be somewhat iffy. As with peaking not working as well with flat log, so it seemed acquiring a manual white balance worked better if I switched to STD gamma for the measurement, then flipped back to SLog2/3 for the shoot. On the other hand, something could be wrong with that process and it burns time.
5.) Although I feel SLog2 has a few inherent advantages over SLog3, with RAW the only significant consequence is that it causes you to expose a little differently since the middle gray point is based a half stop lower. And on that point, if I choose SLog3 for the exposure when shooting raw and monitor with the 709 800% F55 internal lut, my exposure is almost always ideal, certainly with plenty of latitude for a tweak if needed in post.
6.) If I have time I will switch the off the 709 camera lut and monitor/check the SLog3 on the WFM, but if wildlife moves into the frame, I'm going to press the record button regardless of ready or not.
7.) Sometimes you have to just push the button.
 
To be more specific I'm shooting athletes for the Olympic Channel and have to transition from day ext. to gym interior, where the gym is lit with metal halide lamps. Some globes are old and green, some are newer and blue, etc. Then the athletes wander over to the floor to ceiling windows that can have weird gel on them, so there's no way to pre-load color temps. I'd rather get close than way off here. I can usually block the scene and load in some WB settings but not all the time.

My Amira nails the skin tones every time in AW mode. On the travel gigs with the team (Lima, Peru coming up for the PanAm games) I prefer traveling light with the FS7.
 
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