Coronavirus Impact

[OldCorpse]

Do we take what these scientists present at least as evidence to be examined, or do we rely on our "gut" that it's all just "blaming"? Are pandemics accelerating due to the causes I mentioned, or is it all invented by those "blaming" epidemiologists and environmentalists. From the paper I linked to:

"If one looks at the history of emerging or re-emerging infectious disease pandemics globally, on average they have appeared every decade but now, worryingly, the frequency between pandemics seems to be disturbingly shorter as evident with Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome (SARS) in 2003, Influenza A H1N5 (bird flu) in 2007, H1N1 (swine flu) in 2009, Middle East Respiratory Syndrome (MERS) in 2012 and Ebola in 2014.9 Overpopulation and poverty are the primary contributing factors that have brought about this change and are strongly linked with global warming, environmental degradation, habitat destruction, and increased human/host/reservoir interaction.10"

You can read the rest of the paper outlining the exact mechanism by which these pandemics are increasing in frequency - perhaps it's better to be prepared/shrug/.

 

[groveChuck]

Two sheriff’s officers, 38 and 39, die of coronavirus. They’re among the youngest to die in Florida.

Two South Florida law enforcement officers died Saturday from the coronavirus, both men in their 30s who provided proof that the disease can claim anyone.

Bennett called off sick from work on March 23 and checked into a hospital the next day. He tested positive for COVID-19 on March 27 and died before midnight Friday.

Symptoms to dead in 4 days.





https://www.sun-sentinel.com/corona...0200404-z2jnvz43ajeh3c6waq7c5dexpm-story.html

 

[ahalpert]

When coronavirus started to hit the news, I wasn't sure I was going to take a big hit. I regularly do livestreaming and educational type work. I also figured that some retail companies might put more resources into social media marketing and online video. And then reality hit and everything got shut down. I am not concerned that the economy isn't going to be healthy enough to support much of any video work at all. I also think the movie industry might completely crater if the appearance of coronavirus infection is enough to cancel a production and fear of attending movie theaters continues.

I also work in the arts. As bad as i think video might get hit, I think the performing arts is dead as a business.

This prediction is too grim for me to accept. Also, I think that as long as demand rebounds, the industries will survive. If movie theaters go bust, new ones will rise in their ashes as long as people want to go to the theater again after we have a vaccine. The question is if the current players survive...

I think that countries that managed the covid outbreak well and didn't have to shut down completely will thrive. I learned in college film history courses that Hollywood was a small player in global film production before WWI. But then it kept making movies while Europe destroyed itself and after the war there was a huge demand for new movies and Hollywood's market share grew. WWII cemented Hollywood's dominance.

I've been reading about the impact of SARS on movie theaters in Hong Kong and China, and it seems like demand was only temporarily suppressed:

"Some fear that audiences will return nervously and slowly after the all-clear is given, feeling it’s not worth the health risk to sit in close quarters. Others predict a rapid rebound, with demand pent up and people eager to meet friends and family and restart group activities — similar to what happened after the 2003 SARS crisis...

Meanwhile, the streaming giants, whose production expenditure now exceeds that of traditional broadcasters, are comparatively positioned for a windfall. Though likely unable to make new shows for months, they are in the interim reaping the benefits of supplying films, games and online advertising to tens of millions of citizens who are going stir crazy in quarantine or in cities under lockdown."

https://variety.com/2020/film/features/china-coronavirus-movie-industry-box-office-1203501046/

 

[Run&Gun]

I would not say that.
This event is a one in a hundred-year event, the arts have always been ready to inspire or sooth the soul, I hope this time it will be the same!

As much as I want that to be true, I don't think it will be.

 

[Barry_Green]

The business has certainly changed; heck, everything has changed.

If anyone cares, one of the biggest spectacles in live production, WrestleMania, has been altered dramatically this year. Normally it's held live in an arena or football stadium in front of about 80,000 fans; this year it's being presented in front of no crowd. It's ... very different. But the important thing is -- they did it. Well, they're doing it, today was day 1, it'll also have a second half tomorrow. They adapted, they adjusted, and ... well, nobody knew what to expect going in, and it's definitely different, but it's sort of working. And they're getting rave reviews for the last match of the night, the #BoneyardMatch, which was nothing more than a kinda cheesy short action/horror film presented in a cinematic style, something about on par with what we'd have had in one of our DVXFests of old, although with a bigger budget and more well-known characters.

In a world where basically all televised sporting events are pretty much shut down, these folks went forward, and they made something. They applied creativity to overcome adversity. Tiime will tell if the ratings are positive, if the audience accepts it or not, etc. Early chatter was that it was expected to be a disaster waiting to happen and they should have just cancelled the whole thing instead of turning out some lame pale imitation of a WrestleMania. But they didn't cancel. The show must go on, and it went on. And truth be told, there were times when it was kind of awful, and there were times when it was very entertaining.

I especially find it interesting that when everyone is saying "live streaming is the way forward", the WWE chose to do the opposite. Instead of live-streaming a live event (the way every one of their prior, what, 400 or so pay-per-view events have always been done), they instead pre-taped it, edited it, and even turned one match into a low-budget motion picture. And it kind of worked. Hats off to them for innovating and putting on something when the rest of the world is basically shut down.

 

[Run&Gun]

It's been entertaining seeing the local news shows do this with field reporters and weather done from their homes. Their doing remarkably well.

The main local station I watch has been doing this for a week or two and I have a feeling that it's just to "prove a point", because most studios have plenty of space to safely accommodate and properly distance one to two anchors, weather person and sports anchor(this station has a very spacious studio). Tonight they had an anchor in the studio, the second anchor in the field with a typical skyline shot, the sports anchor was in the parking lot with the station in the back ground(first time I've seen them do this) and their weather guy was "skyping" or "Facetiming" from his house(did it yesterday too, I believe) with a typical consumer hardwired cellphone single earpiece/mic dangling out of his ear. Unless they are withholding info(like he has CV) or he has a legitimate concern about contracting CV if he came in to work(which is perfectly acceptable), it was bush-league(mostly because of the stupid earbud/mic hanging out of his ear).

 

[Run&Gun]

The business has certainly changed; heck, everything has changed.

If anyone cares, one of the biggest spectacles in live production, WrestleMania, has been altered dramatically this year. Normally it's held live in an arena or football stadium in front of about 80,000 fans; this year it's being presented in front of no crowd. It's ... very different. But the important thing is -- they did it. Well, they're doing it, today was day 1, it'll also have a second half tomorrow. They adapted, they adjusted, and ... well, nobody knew what to expect going in, and it's definitely different, but it's sort of working. And they're getting rave reviews for the last match of the night, the #BoneyardMatch, which was nothing more than a kinda cheesy short action/horror film presented in a cinematic style, something about on par with what we'd have had in one of our DVXFests of old, although with a bigger budget and more well-known characters.

In a world where basically all televised sporting events are pretty much shut down, these folks went forward, and they made something. They applied creativity to overcome adversity. Tiime will tell if the ratings are positive, if the audience accepts it or not, etc. Early chatter was that it was expected to be a disaster waiting to happen and they should have just cancelled the whole thing instead of turning out some lame pale imitation of a WrestleMania. But they didn't cancel. The show must go on, and it went on. And truth be told, there were times when it was kind of awful, and there were times when it was very entertaining.

I especially find it interesting that when everyone is saying "live streaming is the way forward", the WWE chose to do the opposite. Instead of live-streaming a live event (the way every one of their prior, what, 400 or so pay-per-view events have always been done), they instead pre-taped it, edited it, and even turned one match into a low-budget motion picture. And it kind of worked. Hats off to them for innovating and putting on something when the rest of the world is basically shut down.

I have a working relationship with WWE and have been a part of some of these taped long-form skits before and I actually told one of my guys last week(who worked on one with me before), that that is what they should do. I guess great minds think alike... ; ) Vince is from NC originally, too... And yes, they generally come off somewhat cheesy, but the fans LOVE them.

 

[NorBro]

The business has certainly changed; heck, everything has changed.

If anyone cares, one of the biggest spectacles in live production, WrestleMania, has been altered dramatically this year. Normally it's held live in an arena or football stadium in front of about 80,000 fans; this year it's being presented in front of no crowd. It's ... very different. But the important thing is -- they did it. Well, they're doing it, today was day 1, it'll also have a second half tomorrow. They adapted, they adjusted, and ... well, nobody knew what to expect going in, and it's definitely different, but it's sort of working. And they're getting rave reviews for the last match of the night, the #BoneyardMatch, which was nothing more than a kinda cheesy short action/horror film presented in a cinematic style, something about on par with what we'd have had in one of our DVXFests of old, although with a bigger budget and more well-known characters.

In a world where basically all televised sporting events are pretty much shut down, these folks went forward, and they made something. They applied creativity to overcome adversity. Tiime will tell if the ratings are positive, if the audience accepts it or not, etc. Early chatter was that it was expected to be a disaster waiting to happen and they should have just cancelled the whole thing instead of turning out some lame pale imitation of a WrestleMania. But they didn't cancel. The show must go on, and it went on. And truth be told, there were times when it was kind of awful, and there were times when it was very entertaining.

I especially find it interesting that when everyone is saying "live streaming is the way forward", the WWE chose to do the opposite. Instead of live-streaming a live event (the way every one of their prior, what, 400 or so pay-per-view events have always been done), they instead pre-taped it, edited it, and even turned one match into a low-budget motion picture. And it kind of worked. Hats off to them for innovating and putting on something when the rest of the world is basically shut down.

I watched it (but I watch all of the shows and PPVs) and besides the last match with Taker/AJ (which actually has been done before many times like this in woods and abandon houses/yards, etc), all of the matches were very similar to the matches that have been going on at the PC the past several weeks. As you said it the other week, just absolutely no life...even with various stipulations, the bumps and storytelling are not the same without the reactions, the noise...the energy.

Most wrestling fans have already accepted what they are doing, but many others still think it should have been called off. Hopefully all of those people working were tested. Obviously the wrestlers are sweating and breathing on each other, but even the interviewees/ers/announcers get close during promos/announcing.

Vince had a double-whammy this year with the XFL also getting shut down early (amazing potential with that league by the way in its new format 20-years-later).

___

On a side note, mostly everyone on this weekend's card has already had a "WrestleMania moment" - which is one of if not the main goal of being a wrestler that everyone works towards - but one of the guys (Drew McIntyre) has had a heck of a career after being fired from WWE 10 years ago while mostly being a jobber towards the end of that run (the lowest status you can have), and coming back and skyrocketing his way to the top of main event status with a new look and attitude that the people got behind, and he's expected to win the WWE Championship from Brock Lesnar for the first time tomorrow night (tonight), but it will be a bitter sweet moment.

 

[Barry_Green]

I have a working relationship with WWE and have been a part of some of these taped long-form skits before and I actually told one of my guys last week(who worked on one with me before), that that is what they should do. I guess great minds think alike... ; ) Vince is from NC originally, too... And yes, they generally come off somewhat cheesy, but the fans LOVE them.

In the end, it all comes down to entertainment. I know a lot of people look down on the whole pro wrestling thing, but the way I see it is: they have actors/performers, they have a script, and they have cameras. How is it, really, any different from any other filmed entertainment? Other than that they do all their own stunts and it's usually live... and it's huge, huge business. It's mind-boggling how much content they produce.

Much of it is throwaway, much of it stretches the suspension of disbelief too far, but sometimes, every once in a while, it can be riveting. Specifically the recent Orton/Edge moments, that's been some well-scripted and very well performed stuff. And they produce a huge, huge, huge amount of content, between the 8 hours every week on TV, and then the dozen or so 3-6 hour pay-per-views, plus all the documentaries, behind-the-scenes, and everything else they do. I wonder how many hours of content they actually produce per year? It's got to be over a thousand finished hours of content every year.

Some of that content is -- um, well, below standard, sure. But some is actually really rather good, I saw a doc on R*Truth that really held my attention; surprisingly so. I thought it would all be throwaway content, but it sure seemed to me that the folks who made that hour really cared about the story they were telling.

 

[NorBro]

A mind-boggling amount of content; probably more than any company in the world. There is a video about anything and everything, plus all of the libraries they have acquired.

Barry, if you liked that last match from night 1, find this one below on the network (if you're interested):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juoTKFs7IQ4

 

[Barry_Green]

just absolutely no life...even with various stipulations, the bumps and storytelling are not the same without the reactions, the noise...the energy.

Yep. Everything feels "small". There's no spectacle, no larger-than-life.

Most wrestling fans have already accepted what they are doing, but many others still think it should have been called off.

Yes, I agree, and that's what I find interesting. How quickly people have adapted. The first time I saw one of those matches from the performance center, I thought -- this is awful. They can't go on with this, this will kill their whole larger-than-life, suspension-of-disbelief angle. I mean, it was as much of a difference as watching a 60i video feed vs. watching an actual film. It was so "off".

But people adapt so quickly now. I thought there was no way they could pull this thing off three weeks ago, but I looked around at some of the reviews to see how it was received and most were pretty positive. These folks have accepted the "new normal" already. Hopefully they'll find a working formula that will let them keep producing that content and keep the fans watching it, because there's got to be tons and tons of jobs involved in producing all that material.

but one of the guys (Drew McIntyre) has had a heck of a career after being fired from WWE 10 years ago while mostly being a jobber towards the end of that run (the lowest status you can have), and coming back and skyrocketing his way to the top of main event status with a new look and attitude that the people got behind, and he's expected to win the WWE Championship from Brock Lesnar for the first time tomorrow night (tonight), but it will be a bitter sweet moment.

It's so ... what do I want to say here ... tyrannical? Or dictatorial? Or ... well, one of those words describes the situation. Apparently Vince is "the guy" who makes the decisions on who gets a push or not, and sometimes he's just so far off. It's kind of incredible to hear the absurd amount of boos that a couple of the performers get, the audiences just really don't like them, and yet they get pushed so hard. An example being Roman Reigns, he just has no charisma, yet apparently Vince wants him to be seen as the face of the company, the new standard-bearer. On the other hand, there are some performers who are absolutely charismatic and just leap off the screen; a few being Rollins, Owens, Kofi, R*Truth, and yes, Drew McIntyre. I only ever saw bits of his prior run, but his incarnation as the Scottish Psychopath is great -- he's a villain that the crowd loves, and he has fun with that, and they have believably turned him into a credible threat. I doubt they're ready to have him beat Lesnar though; they're getting a ton of mileage out of Lesnar with Paul Hayman character. But we'll see; I like the Braun Strowman character but never would have predicted that he would be picked to defeat Goldberg for the title, that seems so rushed.

In any case, not to derail the thread into a discussion of actual wrestling storylines; the point of bringing it up is how one major media company is adapting to the challenges that the virus presents, and is managing to turn in content that, perhaps, audiences are accepting.

 

[Barry_Green]

A mind-boggling amount of content; probably more than any company in the world. There is a video about anything and everything, plus all of the libraries they have acquired.

Barry, if you liked that last match from night 1, find this one below on the network (if you're interested):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juoTKFs7IQ4

I had heard about it but didn't know how to look it up, thanks for the link. I don't know what to make of The Fiend character; it seems Bray Wyatt was kind of a failure in his prior incarnation, then when Finn Balor left and took his "demon" character with him, they apparently leaped on that idea and turned Wyatt into a megastar with a cheap rubber mask. The fact that audiences immediately accepted, embraced, and went crazy over such a twist is one of the things that I find so interesting about this business; I mean, years ago I declared it as basically "soap operas for men", but there's no denying that soap operas made truckloads of money for the networks for decades too.

 

[NorBro]

Yep. Everything feels "small". There's no spectacle, no larger-than-life.


Yes, I agree, and that's what I find interesting. How quickly people have adapted. The first time I saw one of those matches from the performance center, I thought -- this is awful. They can't go on with this, this will kill their whole larger-than-life, suspension-of-disbelief angle. I mean, it was as much of a difference as watching a 60i video feed vs. watching an actual film. It was so "off".

But people adapt so quickly now. I thought there was no way they could pull this thing off three weeks ago, but I looked around at some of the reviews to see how it was received and most were pretty positive. These folks have accepted the "new normal" already. Hopefully they'll find a working formula that will let them keep producing that content and keep the fans watching it, because there's got to be tons and tons of jobs involved in producing all that material.


It's so ... what do I want to say here ... tyrannical? Or dictatorial? Or ... well, one of those words describes the situation. Apparently Vince is "the guy" who makes the decisions on who gets a push or not, and sometimes he's just so far off. It's kind of incredible to hear the absurd amount of boos that a couple of the performers get, the audiences just really don't like them, and yet they get pushed so hard. An example being Roman Reigns, he just has no charisma, yet apparently Vince wants him to be seen as the face of the company, the new standard-bearer. On the other hand, there are some performers who are absolutely charismatic and just leap off the screen; a few being Rollins, Owens, Kofi, R*Truth, and yes, Drew McIntyre. I only ever saw bits of his prior run, but his incarnation as the Scottish Psychopath is great -- he's a villain that the crowd loves, and he has fun with that, and they have believably turned him into a credible threat. I doubt they're ready to have him beat Lesnar though; they're getting a ton of mileage out of Lesnar with Paul Hayman character. But we'll see; I like the Braun Strowman character but never would have predicted that he would be picked to defeat Goldberg for the title, that seems so rushed.

In any case, not to derail the thread into a discussion of actual wrestling storylines; the point of bringing it up is how one major media company is adapting to the challenges that the virus presents, and is managing to turn in content that, perhaps, audiences are accepting.

Goldberg was going to lose the title to Roman (to bring it back to a full-timer), but when Roman was pulled because of underlying health conditions and the current circumstances, they needed someone believable to beat Goldberg (who's a legend but only there for ratings 2-3x a year). When some guys come back, it's believable (like The Rock), but I can't get behind 53 year old Goldberg....every match he's been a part of the last 2-3 years was less than 5 minutes.

There is so much more I want to tell you, haha.

I had heard about it but didn't know how to look it up, thanks for the link. I don't know what to make of The Fiend character; it seems Bray Wyatt was kind of a failure in his prior incarnation, then when Finn Balor left and took his "demon" character with him, they apparently leaped on that idea and turned Wyatt into a megastar with a cheap rubber mask. The fact that audiences immediately accepted, embraced, and went crazy over such a twist is one of the things that I find so interesting about this business; I mean, years ago I declared it as basically "soap operas for men", but there's no denying that soap operas made truckloads of money for the networks for decades too.

Bray Wyatt was loved in The Wyatt Family!! People were very upset they killed that character/group. But Bray is very good on the mic so anything he does works. In that match from 2017 with Orton, he's still Bray there.

 

[Barry_Green]

Goldberg was going to lose the title to Roman (to bring it back to a full-timer), but when Roman was pulled because of underlying health conditions and the current circumstances, they needed someone believable to beat Goldberg (who's a legend but only there for ratings 2-3x a year). When some guys come back, it's believable (like The Rock), but I can't get behind 53 year old Goldberg....every match he's been a part of the last 2-3 years was less than 5 minutes.

I can see that angle; only thing I can say is that I thought Strowman was seriously under-utilized, I mean, he's a giant and he's charismatic but he was rarely put front and center. He seems like a believable champion, and yes he does seem like one who could potentially defeat Goldberg, but it seems like universally that match was the worst of the evening. Seems like nobody liked it at all.

Bray Wyatt was loved in The Wyatt Family!! People were very upset they killed that character/group. But Bray is very good on the mic so anything he does works. In that match from 2017 with Orton, he's still Bray there.

Okay, checked it out. Interesting in that yes, it was quite similar in some ways to the Boneyard match. And Orton and Bray are very good performers. I wonder how it was received by the live audience? I can see them sitting through a 30-second arrival or some silly backstage nonsense promo, but would an arena of 80,000 sit still and watch a 13-minute film up on the kiss-cam screens? I'm sure it was well received on the network, presented full-screen as it was, I'm just wondering how the live audience and the blogosphere reacted to it?

In part, because it seems like they filmed it specifically to maintain the suspension of disbelief in the action. What I mean is, it seemed like there were lots of cuts and such, but any time both performers were engaging with each other, the camera rolled continuously throughout the engagement. By doing so, it would maintain the perception that the action was "real" instead of "acted". The only cut I noticed during the action was during the actual tipping of the refrigerator, and it was jarring because it was so noticeable that they cut there to an overhead shot. In the Boneyard match, they didn't do it that way at all, it had cuts all over the place, like in any Hollywood fight scene... yet the audience seems to have received it quite well (better, in fact, than they received Undertaker's recent live matches which, to be frank, have been pretty awful). It is my understanding the Undertaker wanted a match to go out on a high, and that's why they chose to do it this way, and also why he reverted to his biker character.

In any case, yes, that was certainly comparable in production quality to the Boneyard match.

 

[ahalpert]

Wow this turned into a WrestleMania thread fast lol

 

[NorBro]

lol...my last post about it. (It was just a little break from all of the depressing stuff you guys write about.)

___

Nobody liked any of Goldberg's last matches because they were short and filled with nonsense.

There's a lot of deep history and dirt in wrestling and why certain things happen the way they do. I could write thousands of paragraphs explaining so much about everything, but it's obviously not the thread/forum for it.

With hall-of-famers like Goldberg, he's not going to lose to just anybody (it doesn't matter what Vince says; there are negotiations at that level of personnel). So Braun was probably one of the only available choices even though he's still pretty green. (And believe it or not, Roman Reigns is very respected in the locker room for his wrestling skills.)

Even though WWF/E has done lots of stuff outside (going back to the mid-late 90s), there was another company years ago that was more famous for these outside spectacles called "TNA/Impact Wrestling". Supposedly, Vince was not happy about what they were doing. The 'Hardy Boyz' in the video below were actually in WWE for many years - on and off. Matt just made his debut on AEW (which will undoubtedly challenge Vince more than anyone has in the last 20 years after WCW).

https://youtu.be/kiktBcRHABU?t=658

___

In wrestling, you always leave the business with a loss. You pass the torch (or title in some cases) to the next guy/gal. I doubt this WM was Undertaker's last match, but he's been in and out these past few years so who knows what he ultimately decides to do. He's the godfather of wrestling and no one has more power than him right now. His real last match was supposed to be when his WrestleMania streak was ended by Lesnar several years ago, but he --- like most of these guys --- cannot stay away from the business.

___

The house match from 2017 was a bit different; Wyatt and Orton actually ended it back at the arena later in the night. (It might have even been live, IDR.)

This 2020 Boneyard match was much more polished filmmaking (for their standards). Also, 3 years later...different minds/thoughts on the production and script.

 

[cpreston]

When this first hit, some of the professional theatres were talking about live streaming the shows they had in production. Mostly, they were just trying to think of some idea of maintaining some sort of social media presence in order to fundraise and convince people to donate to them. It isn't a long term solution, though. A live streamed performance sucks. That's why movies and TV's exist. A 100 years of perfecting the art of filmed storytelling. Musical performances might fare slightly better. Wrestling and sports could survive since they spent years learning how to present for a TV audience, but their business models would have to change.

My worry is that a fear of crowds and disease is being ingrained into the public. At this point, in the US the coronavirus is expected to kill the same number of people in the first wave as a bad season of the flu. Unless something changes, the public is going to expect that social distancing needs to be enacted any time an epidemic is reported. People are always looking for ways to feel safer. As an example, when I was a kid nobody wore helmets. Also, as we figure out better ways of keeping people alive for longer, people are going to become more susceptible to any type of novel disease.

 

[Cary Knoop]

For those who would like to understand the difference between case mortality rate and infection mortality rate and get an opinion on the current shelter-in-place policy:

Note, we don't even know the infection mortality rate!
But at the same time, people get presented charts claiming 2.4 million deaths if we don't lockdown!

Stanford finished their first serological test last Friday and Saturday in Santa Clara, my understanding is that the broad statistics are going to be finished today but I am not sure when it will be published.

 

[Paul F]

Cary, stay on topic ... Wrestlemania.

 

[ahalpert]

For those who would like to understand the difference between case mortality rate and infection mortality rate and get an opinion on the current shelter-in-place policy:

Note, we don't even know the infection mortality rate!
But at the same time, people get presented charts claiming 2.4 million deaths if we don't lockdown!

Stanford finished their first serological test last Friday and Saturday in Santa Clara, my understanding is that the broad statistics are going to be finished today but I am not sure when it will be published.

To some extent the actual infection mortality rate doesn't matter right now - our hospitals are getting so overwhelmed that they will have to let some people die who could have lived and we don't want that. And this is the case even though we started social distancing...