Cinema Lens vs. SLR???

J

JerryB

Well-known member
I am in pre-production (development/fundraising) on a documentary I will be shooting early next year. I currently own these lenses...

-Panny 14-140mm f.4-5.8 & Panny 20mm f1.7
-FD 50mm f1.8 & 28mm f2.8 (family hand downs in poor condition)

I am wanting to pick up a few "solid" lenses for this documentary. I love both the Panny lenses but the 14-140mm is slow and 20mm is great but a pancake. On some shoots I will be interviewing senators and other government officials. The illusion of professionalism can be just as important as being professional and the 20mm is very small and unable to have a mattebox on it (for strategic size purposes along with filters)

Is it worth the extra money to buy 35mm cinema lenses (not interested in 16mm as they do not adapt well and would like little to no vignetting) or just getting nice 35mm SLR lenses? ALSO, is there a good place to look for cinema lenses other than ebay? ALSO, what are some suggestions on 35mm cinema lenses at a decent price (I understand they are expensive)?

Thanks!
 
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I think that you can get quite great SLR lenses. But Cinema lenses are always cinema lenses. I think that you can get cheaper and still get great result with SLR lenses. Contax zeiss lenses seem to be a good example. With good lighting you can make pretty images. Here is a good example >>>> http://www.vimeo.com/13542014
 
Take a look at the Olympus range of high grade and super high grade 4/3 lenses, optically matched for the format and very high quality. They can be used with a low cost 4/3 to m4/3 adapter and retain some of their automatic lens control features.

http://www.olympusamerica.com/cpg_section/cpg_digital_slr.asp?section=lens

I would consider 35mm cine lenses if you plan to upgrade to a digital cinema camera in the future. Good lenses will be worth the investment for that. But you will need a good PL adapter for starters, like the Hotrod Cameras version at $1150.00.

Used lenses from reputable dealers are worth considering as they will be fully serviced and collimated when you buy them and carry a warranty.

http://www.visualproducts.com/store02.asp?ID=8

35mm still lenses are sort of a middle path.
 
Outright buying cinema lenses probably wouldn't be a great financial choice. But renting might be an option that you might want to look into. But it's also what sort of look you are trying to get. All lenses don't give the same look, if you can get a look you like with SLR lenses then I'd go with that. Because we would all love to shoot on the highest end gear but budget always will play the biggest part of gear choice.
 
heicky said:
But Cinema lenses are always cinema lenses.
Click to expand...

I don't think this is the case. From what I understand, the Zeiss Compact Primes cine lenses have the exact same optics as the Zeiss ZF stills lenses. In fact I'm pretty sure the ZF lenses became the Compact Primes by just having their aperture rings declicked, focus rings geared, and 80mm threads at the end. You can say that Zeiss 'cine-modded' their own lenses. I've talked to people who intercut between ZF and Master Primes with no viewable problems.

Cheap lenses are cheap lenses and expensive lenses are expensive lenses for a reason, regardless of whether they're 'cine' or 'stills' lenses. Use what looks good to your eye. Tough sometimes cheap lenses can work to your advantage. Lomography is pretty successful because of that!
 
vcassel said:
I don't think this is the case. From what I understand, the Zeiss Compact Primes cine lenses have the exact same optics as the Zeiss ZF stills lenses. In fact I'm pretty sure the ZF lenses became the Compact Primes by just having their aperture rings declicked, focus rings geared, and 80mm threads at the end. You can say that Zeiss 'cine-modded' their own lenses. I've talked to people who intercut between ZF and Master Primes with no viewable problems.

Cheap lenses are cheap lenses and expensive lenses are expensive lenses for a reason, regardless of whether they're 'cine' or 'stills' lenses. Use what looks good to your eye. Tough sometimes cheap lenses can work to your advantage. Lomography is pretty successful because of that!
Click to expand...


I kinda ment that Cine style lenses are built for shooting motion. For example focusing is much more better with these lenses. But I agree your point 100%. We live this great time when you can use much cheaper still lenses for shooting high quality video :)
 
vcassel said:
I don't think this is the case. From what I understand, the Zeiss Compact Primes cine lenses have the exact same optics as the Zeiss ZF stills lenses. In fact I'm pretty sure the ZF lenses became the Compact Primes by just having their aperture rings declicked, focus rings geared, and 80mm threads at the end. You can say that Zeiss 'cine-modded' their own lenses. I've talked to people who intercut between ZF and Master Primes with no viewable problems.

Cheap lenses are cheap lenses and expensive lenses are expensive lenses for a reason, regardless of whether they're 'cine' or 'stills' lenses. Use what looks good to your eye. Tough sometimes cheap lenses can work to your advantage. Lomography is pretty successful because of that!
Click to expand...

The Zeiss CP2 cine versions are complete rehousings of the Zeiss ZF optics, different iris with more leaves, longer focus throws, etc. They are true cine lens versions but significantly more expensive than the still versions.
 
vcassel said:
I don't think this is the case. From what I understand, the Zeiss Compact Primes cine lenses have the exact same optics as the Zeiss ZF stills lenses. In fact I'm pretty sure the ZF lenses became the Compact Primes by just having their aperture rings declicked, focus rings geared, and 80mm threads at the end.
Click to expand...
Q: What is the difference between the Compact Prime CP.2 lenses and the ZEISS ZF still lenses?
A: The Compact Prime CP.2 lenses are based on the ZF optical design. However, the lens housing and internal mechanics are completely new and the manufacturing process is a cine style process, similar to the process used for the other ZEISS cine style lenses.
When you hold a Compact Prime CP.2 and a ZF lens in your hand, you can immediately feel the difference. The Compact Prime CP.2 housing is rugged and robust to withstand the rigors of life on the set. Its solid design also helps when using lens motors. Fast and easy lens changes are ensured since all Compact Prime CP.2 lenses have the same dimensions, and all have focus and iris gears in the same position.
Operating the Compact Prime CP.2 lenses is also vastly different from working with ZF lenses. For starters, the focus ring turns in the direction all other cine lenses turn – cine style rotating angle. Their purposefully chosen larger diameter provides a larger rotating angle for more precise focusing. The calibrated scales serve the same purpose.
Optically, the Compact Prime CP.2 lenses have tighter mechanical and optical tolerances, a more precise optical adjustment during manufacturing and tighter quality control. Their unique 14 blade iris (not found in the ZF lenses) ensures precisely repeatable iris settings and organic, perfectly circular out of focus highlights and a pleasing bokeh.

http://www.zeiss.com/c125756900453232/Contents-Frame/b984d96f381f07fbc12575820044c5d7
 
xha8 said:
Q: What is the difference between the Compact Prime CP.2 lenses and the ZEISS ZF still lenses?
A: The Compact Prime CP.2 lenses are based on the ZF optical design. However, the lens housing and internal mechanics are completely new and the manufacturing process is a cine style process, similar to the process used for the other ZEISS cine style lenses.
When you hold a Compact Prime CP.2 and a ZF lens in your hand, you can immediately feel the difference. The Compact Prime CP.2 housing is rugged and robust to withstand the rigors of life on the set. Its solid design also helps when using lens motors. Fast and easy lens changes are ensured since all Compact Prime CP.2 lenses have the same dimensions, and all have focus and iris gears in the same position.
Operating the Compact Prime CP.2 lenses is also vastly different from working with ZF lenses. For starters, the focus ring turns in the direction all other cine lenses turn – cine style rotating angle. Their purposefully chosen larger diameter provides a larger rotating angle for more precise focusing. The calibrated scales serve the same purpose.
Optically, the Compact Prime CP.2 lenses have tighter mechanical and optical tolerances, a more precise optical adjustment during manufacturing and tighter quality control. Their unique 14 blade iris (not found in the ZF lenses) ensures precisely repeatable iris settings and organic, perfectly circular out of focus highlights and a pleasing bokeh.

http://www.zeiss.com/c125756900453232/Contents-Frame/b984d96f381f07fbc12575820044c5d7
Click to expand...

Thanks for the elaboration, but like I said, "same optics" and people on Reduser cut between them with no noticable difference to their eyes. Though marketing $4000 lenses probably demands this sort of write up, I'm not so sure the rehousing is ultimately worth it to a DSLR budget filmmaker. The ZF lenses are amazing; I think you'll see diminishing returns at the Compact Prime price point.
 
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