FS7: Cinema lens advice for FS7 film shoot

Abaddon

Abaddon

Well-known member
I'm mostly using my FS7 for commercial/documentary stuff, so I haven't had the need to be too cinematic with my work. I am however about to shoot a short and wanna pick the right lenses for the job. I'll be shooting for a 2.35:1 aspect ratio at 4k. I've been looking at the Canon Cine lenses, Zeiss CP2, Sigma cinema etc. I don't have a huge budget but I don't want to go too cheap at the risk of having lesser quality images. Between these lenses, there's not a huge difference in rental price, so I'm pretty open. Also, some lenses won't require any rack focusing or the need for F1.4, so I wonder if going with a cheeper 24mm and 35mm would be a smart option if there's negligible quality difference between still lenses and cine. Any thoughts on all of this would be appreciated.
 
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Just because its "drama" doesnt necessarily mean you need prime lenses.. plenty of films are shot on zooms.. and if need to work fast.. ie low budget shorts !.. a couple of zooms will be a lot faster.. just a thought .. the cheapest rental is probably the Sigma Cine zooms 18-35/50-100.. both are T2.. they have their short comings at that price .. but could get the job done.. stills lenses would work but will be a nightmare for any focus puller I would think..
 
Just my personal recommendation -- that you stay with a matched set of lenses (whichever ones you choose) rather than trying to do a mix-and-match.
My feeling is that once the viewer gets used to a certain visual look, they will (perhaps subliminally) sense a change in optical style brought on by switching between lenses with different optical characteristics. So if you start 'switching brands' they will feel it happening.
If you're thinking about choosing the 'right' set of lenses I'd recommend doing a test at your rental house -- but light it the way you would be in the film - preferably use as a makeup test with your principal talent as well -- and then choose the lens set that best matches the look you're trying to achieve for the film. "Best" and "Right" are in this case a matter of personal preference. After all, sharper isn't necessarily better - it's just sharper. (Maybe that's the look you want, or maybe it's too harsh.)
 
My thoughts.

You wont be shooting 4k - you will be shooting about 2.5k broken into 4000 pixels - thats my guess at the resolution of the FS7.

Pretty much any lens can out resolve that.

Canon Fd on a speed booster for example is super cheap and good enough for the FS7.

Stills lenses are perfect until they are not.

When are they not?
When your 'show' requires a parfocal zoom
When you have extremely complex focus pulls
When you are applying G forces to the camera
When you need rock solid repeatable positioning like motion control capture.
Your schedule is so fast that moving a lens motor between lens swaps becomes an issue.

All the classic manual still lenses are agood option. Contax canon FD olympus, nikkor.

Budget is best placed on lighting and production design if you want a cinematic look.

Ive shot a pile of drama - mainly with a $120 nikkor 35-70 or a $75 nikkor 50 1.8 and the lenses are fine. Many other elements of the drama were not.
 
On the resolution thing.. super sharp lenses like the canon cine primes feed the sensor to much resolution.. and get you purple fringing that you wont get with a softer vintage lens.

The ideal lens on the FS7 is one that just under resolves the AA filter in front of the sensor.
 
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Canon Cine primes work well on the FS7, they are nice and warm.

Zeiss are great too, sharp as hell, more of a clinical, colder look.

I've not used the Sigma Cine Primes, but I do own the Sigma Art primes. Love the look of those on the FS7 and I'd happily use their bigger cousins for cine work.
 
Sigma Cine primes are all FF.. will still work of course but your FoV will be different.. the Sigmas cine zooms are s35mm .. they are the basically the cine -ized versions os the Art series stills zooms..
 
Donny 123 said:
Just because its "drama" doesnt necessarily mean you need prime lenses.. plenty of films are shot on zooms.. and if need to work fast.. ie low budget shorts !.. a couple of zooms will be a lot faster.. just a thought .. the cheapest rental is probably the Sigma Cine zooms 18-35/50-100.. both are T2.. they have their short comings at that price .. but could get the job done.. stills lenses would work but will be a nightmare for any focus puller I would think..
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I was thinking about the zooms as well. How do they compare to primes in regard to bokeh?
 
OnSet said:
Just my personal recommendation -- that you stay with a matched set of lenses (whichever ones you choose) rather than trying to do a mix-and-match.
My feeling is that once the viewer gets used to a certain visual look, they will (perhaps subliminally) sense a change in optical style brought on by switching between lenses with different optical characteristics. So if you start 'switching brands' they will feel it happening.
If you're thinking about choosing the 'right' set of lenses I'd recommend doing a test at your rental house -- but light it the way you would be in the film - preferably use as a makeup test with your principal talent as well -- and then choose the lens set that best matches the look you're trying to achieve for the film. "Best" and "Right" are in this case a matter of personal preference. After all, sharper isn't necessarily better - it's just sharper. (Maybe that's the look you want, or maybe it's too harsh.)
Click to expand...

I probably wouldn't mix brands. But I might, for instance, rent a set of Sigma cine lenses and Sigma Art lenses. From what I understand, the optics are practically the same. So I would rent the cine lenses for the shots that require rack focusing and the Art lenses for the shots that don't.
 
In terms of the Sigmas - it's my understanding that the Cine lenses use the same glass as the stills Art lenses.
I've been happy with the basic image from the Sigma Art lenses I own and have also done multicam shoots where one camera was using the Sigma cine zooms and the other was using the Sigma Art zooms - and I could discern no difference in IQ.
But that said, I'd be wary of the Sigma 50-100 Art lens for dramatic work because of the extent to which it breathes when you follow focus -- unless you want that 'mini-zoom' effect when you rack focus from one character to another.
One thing about Cine lenses that can be important is that they have a real iris ring -- allowing you to smoothly adjust exposure if necessary. So even though you may be thinking that a lens may not require a larger focus ring (such as the Sigma 24/1.4, which is one of my favorites for hand-held) the ability to smoothly pull iris as you move from one room to another may be something to consider.
After all, you're only talking about a few rental days -- not about buying the full set!
 
I think Liam was questioning why Full frame lenses on a s35 sensor would change the f.o.v. ?? Unless they were other lens mounts attached to a speed booster/focal reducer emount adapter?
 
The other question would also be whether it would be better to get E mount lenses over EF with a Metabones adapter, which I currently have. Would it make any difference?
 
Donny 123 said:
Sigma Cine primes are all FF.. will still work of course but your FoV will be different.. the Sigmas cine zooms are s35mm .. they are the basically the cine -ized versions os the Art series stills zooms..
Click to expand...

Not busting your b@!!s, Donny, but I’m just not quite sure how this mis-information still perpetuates today as many times as it’s been covered on here and and other forums/threads. A “Full Frame” lens and a “s35” lens of the same focal length will not create different fields of view on a s35 sensor, unless a speed booster type adapter is used on the “FF” lens.
 
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