FS7: Cine EI LUTS and Custom Scene Files

Doug Jensen said:
I am just trying to establish what should be the BEST exposure for this particular LUT because I don’t want to have to do a dozen different exposures of a dozen different LUTs and scene files when I do some further tests.
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..and that is why I am a fan of Slog3, not because I think it is the best use of the sensor in most situations - data in low DR scenes could be allocated more efficiently - but because there is a simple defined route to a final image.. Whites at 60 use a Sony LUT.

As soon as you 'freeform' you open a huge can of variables.. which is where I basically fell out with the F3 - not because a stunning image was not there 'somewhere' but because I could not consistently find it.

In designing your own look/lut/scene I think the first thing is to clearly identify what you are doing - your mission.

You have defined you mission.. '"ready-for-broadcast" look right out of the camera with virtually no grading."

Having a clearly defined mission is a great start.

It is not a 'mission' that I would follow because I personally want something different.. 'an image that works with a defined post workflow' (aka LUT)

The reason my mission is different is that I feel shooting 'tight' on the camera closes options too much.. you must expose perfectly and wont be able to handle high dr scenes without adding light or controlling the DR in some other manner.

I feel that pulling contrast ratios in post is cheaper than pulling them on set.. so my mission is different.
 
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Totally agreed on Abe's scene files.
Doug - obviously you may get nothing close to consensus - but think you should shoot a more "real world" scene to judge perhaps. Looking at the test again just a minute ago on Vimeo... here's some of my reasoning for choosing #2 (if perhaps flawed). I agree I initially felt (per chart) that 2 was clearly underexposed. But then, if looking mostly at the beach pic - matte/finish scratches begin to appear in #3 and become very visible in #4 (looking here in middle models hair) - and if I was choosing what would appear BEST in direct to air - I would still choose #2 - given this particular "scene"
 
Sam, I'm going to upload another test in a few minutes. If you could limit your discussion to the premise that THERE WILL BE NO GRADING to the footage in post, it would make things a lot simpler. I totally agree that anything that is recorded onboard the camera can always be improved upon in post. There is no question about that in my mind, but that's not what the discussion in this thread is about. There is a legitimate need to be able to have settings that a client can take and use right out of the camera with no grading. Got it?
 
I get that as a client spec. It is a client spec that I try to steer my clients away from, but I get that is the purpose of this exercise.

"agree that anything that is recorded onboard the camera can always be improved upon in post."

I think with enough lights/control good enough monitors etc it should be possible to get an image in camera that does not need improving.

S
 
Okay, here is another test with some real-world objects. Sorry no faces, unless someone wants to make a donation to hire a model.

The white card in the middle is an official Kodak card and all the exposure values listed below are based on that card.
What do you like? You can either identify the number X01 through X06, or identify the exposure by timecode in X07.

In X07, the exposure slowly ramps from 40% to 90%. You can give me the timecode frame number where you think this shot is properly exposed for this LUT.


X01 = 60%
X02 = 70%
X03 = 75%
X04 = 80%
X05 = 85%
X06 = 90%

X07 = 40% - 90%

http://vimeo.com/123502787
Password: LUT
 
morgan_moore said:
I think with enough lights/control good enough monitors etc it should be possible to get an image in camera that does not need improving.
S
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Send me what you think us your "perfect" shot in it's native file format, and I'll bet I can get most people to say they prefer my graded version of it. But that is a different topic. Please start a new thread if you want to debate this point. Thank you.
 
FYI this was my first effort at a 'ready' LUT, cant remember exactly the required exposure methodology - it is based around Slog3

Some thought it had too much punch - but I like punch in an image not the log look..

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/33167160/FS7_SMM_TestLut001_34.10StopGrad1.cube

In general I would think that doing a LUT not a Scene file would be better as it is so easy (in resolve) to know what you are doing, say a dip of the red sat, well that is just grabbing a curve.

S
 
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Hard to judge from that image... While, yes, the chart has a white chip that is supposed to be 90% reflectance, look at the girl on the left in the photo. Her skin is nuclear and is almost as white as the white chip. No bueno, in my opinion.

EDIT: referring to LT4, the brightest one, of course.
 
It's interesting that there is a 17 IRE difference in the range of what different people consider the best exposure for a "final" image.
 
For those of you who are still interested in participating in this exercise, please tell me which one of these choices you like BEST and which one you like LEAST. And why?
It's not just enough to vote, I would like to know the reasons for your choices. I do promise to identify what you are looking at some point in the future.
Please try to do your own judging before reading anybody else's comments that may come later in the thread.

Remember -- the goal is to choose settings that will not require grading. So assume that these are final images. Which one would you prefer to hand over to a client at the end of the shoot if these are your only chocies?

http://vimeo.com/123637675
Password: LUT
 
05

Actually right between 05 and 06 would be my choice.

06 with mids up a touch.

That is just looking on my MBP screen, I would prefer to actually check n my eval monitor. But I am quite used to what the MBP looks like.
 
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