Choosing cheap capable camera

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Disease8

Active member
Hi this may seem a stupid question but in the vast world of cameras I am sure I am missing some good options. I am looking for the cheapest most capable camera for video. I would love to have the freedom of some variable frame rates, I hate rolling shutter and I like small cameras. I have to shoot a feature film and I don't have a camera!

I have been looking at/tried these models:

Nikon J1:
I love the form factor, variable framerates, lack of rolling shutter, reasonably high bitrate recording..etc
Hate the lack of manual control over shutter for below 1/100 in pal countries and the lack of decent bright/wide manual lenses (c mount seems like a minefield).

Lumix cameras with hack:
GH1 was a great camera but it had that banding issue!
GF1 seems like an option but its does not have 60p, the hack for 1080 is only a stretched out mjpeg.
I love the lens selection for mft camera's and the cheap focal reducers on ebay.

JVC HD7:
This is the only affordable "pro" camcorder with decent manual controls and a manual lens focus ring. No rolling shutter as it is CCD. This camera would be the most convenient really, it has built in HD and good lens so just no worry about swapping lenses or the space the footage takes up...
But the footage is just a bit meh, it gets those lines with all ccd's with burnt out light sources..

Panasonic HVX200:
Probably the only REAL "pro" option within my price range (second hand but still pushing my budget).. Variable frame rates, 4.2.2 colour and pro standard footage. CCD no rolling shutter...etc
Problem with this is with the price of the P2 cards and a 16gb is only 16 minutes of filming in 1080 which means dumping footage a lot and having to deal with this unusual (for me) format...

I am really scratching my head about this, I guess I should just wait and hope I get enough money for a second hand GH4 which seems like the only camera on the market that actually does everything I want it to. Its just a bit of a gamble and I would like to be able to shoot on a cheaper camera.

If there are other options in the very low cost category please let me know if I am missing something.
I have use a lot of cameras and usually the rolling shutter seems way too bad for the shakey hand held style I love to shoot with.

HD7? I dunno but sometimes the footage looks great sometimes it looks terrible. At least it would be the easiest option.

Appreciate any help I am racking my brain and burnt out my eyes on internet researching.
 
I think a question that might help is:
how important is the image quality for your average audience?
Its like image quality vs usefulness and functionality.
 
What was your budget? You could get a used hacked GH2, but a Nikon D5300 would probably be a better option, because Nikon lenses are pretty cheap.
 
Imamacuser said:
What was your budget? You could get a used hacked GH2, but a Nikon D5300 would probably be a better option, because Nikon lenses are pretty cheap.
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Hi wow I usually get no response. I would say my budget is only up to £500-600 MAX..
I have been thinking about the Nikons they seem to be releasing firmware updates for 1080 60p on some of their cheaper models. And I noticed there are super cheap lenses new for some reason and they are fast and good.

I used to have a GH2, really nice camera. I found the rolling shutter a bit too much and I paid a lot of money for it and a very expensive lens. I really am looking for the cheapest option. I guess GH2 has come down in price a lot since then.
 
TheDingo said:
There's a DvxUser thread about rolling shutter speeds of different cameras...

Measuring rolling shutter: put a number on this issue!
Click to expand...

Hi that is very useful thank you, wow gh4 is so amazing!! I really just want a gh4 its the bee's knee's just a bit out of my price range. Nikon j1 should be on that list it is very good at rolling shutter and a great little camera considering its price. If I was in a NTSC country I would probably have kept that little beauty but not having my low shutter speeds is so distracting I hate cranking iso...
 
I was going to say Sony NEX but the rolling shutter on the NEX-5N and a7s is quite bad, and I'm not sure how much better tha a5100 and a6000 are. So, if that's very important to you, I wold say D5300. (no, I don't like any of the panasonics: they are really sharp but the DR always seems unimpressive).
 
Samuel H said:
I was going to say Sony NEX but the rolling shutter on the NEX-5N and a7s is quite bad, and I'm not sure how much better tha a5100 and a6000 are. So, if that's very important to you, I wold say D5300. (no, I don't like any of the panasonics: they are really sharp but the DR always seems unimpressive).
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Panasonics have no moire, aliasing and have the same 8bit as everything else. But I know what you mean about dr... I just love panny's always have...
 
Panasonic G6 (it's essentially a GH2.5, with peaking and 1080P60 like the GH4). Plus a $25 NIK-M43 adapter so you can use cheap Nikon lenses.

The G6 isn't listed on the rolling shutter post, but it's improved over the GH2.
 
Check this test on the G6: https://translate.google.com/transl...se-und-kurze-Gedanken--alles-.html&edit-text=

This is the G6 (with sharpmess at minimum):
1148-ISO340_schaerfe_runter-ISO340_schaerfe_runter.jpg


This is the D5300:
1227-ISO340-ISO340.jpg



The panasonic may *seem* sharper, but the D5300 is cleaner. And it has more DR.


By the way: if you don't need interchangeable lenses or a particularly shallow DoF, this is the Sony RX10:
sony_rx10.jpg
 
I think I've made this comment a few times recently, but when we see some real-world footage & useability tests of the Samsung NX1, that could be a game changer, or at least a valid entry to the "acceptable DSLR" world.

I think it should be shipping in the next couple weeks. Very curious.
 
Michael Carter said:
I think I've made this comment a few times recently, but when we see some real-world footage & useability tests of the Samsung NX1, that could be a game changer, or at least a valid entry to the "acceptable DSLR" world.
Click to expand...

I don't disagree, however the GH4 was out of the OP's pricerange, so it's likely the NX1 is too.
 
Michael Carter said:
I think I've made this comment a few times recently, but when we see some real-world footage & useability tests of the Samsung NX1, that could be a game changer, or at least a valid entry to the "acceptable DSLR" world.

I think it should be shipping in the next couple weeks. Very curious.
Click to expand...

Hi I don't think the NX1 looks like a game changer at all I think the GH4 was that and I will 100% be getting a gh4 as soon as I can. For something to be a game changer it needs hardly any rolling shutter, un compressed output, fps control.. blah blah you guys know.. For the same price as the gh4 I don't see what samsung are bringing to the table really. 4k does not interest me in the slightest. But thanks for all the replies I guess I have looked into everything really, just didn't notice Nikon releasing some cheap cameras that shoot 1080 60fps. I am not sure about investing into a different brand and sensor format. I guess I will look at second hand gh2's or something.. Soon there will be global shutter cameras coming out around this price range THAT will be a game changer! :-) Thanks for the information it is interesting.
 
Disease8 said:
Hi that is very useful thank you, wow gh4 is so amazing!! I really just want a gh4 its the bee's knee's just a bit out of my price range. Nikon j1 should be on that list it is very good at rolling shutter and a great little camera considering its price. If I was in a NTSC country I would probably have kept that little beauty but not having my low shutter speeds is so distracting I hate cranking iso...
Click to expand...

If you dont need shallow depth of field id go with a GH2 off ebay. you can probably get it with a stock lens for $500. I have used it with my GH4 and in editing I couldnt tell which camera was which. I dont think the GH4 is that much sharper than the GH3 or GH2 even when shooting in 4k, it just has better add ons.
 
Disease8 said:
4k does not interest me in the slightest.
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It has been my experience owning 3 cameras which were 4K or better, that starting with an image that is 4K produces a very nice HD picture.

Starting with a camera that is only HD ends up producing a picture with much less resolution than HD.
 
Hmmm. I disagree HD image is HD, I dont need a super sharp image, and actually the GH range is far sharper than a Canon 5D MKIII!!!!!. Yes the gh2 is similar image quality to the gh4 but it has SHITTY rolling shutter! The gh4 has rolling shutter up there with proper cinema cameras. I love my handheld not all this restricted up your arse DOP crap... I do appreciate the replies but a second hand GH2 is still out of my price range right now...

Anyway to let you guys know i got a GF1 with the hack in mjpeg mode it has quite good rolling shutter actually. And 4.2.2 colour and high bitrate and all the lenses and focal reducers I invest in will be easily apply able to the GH4 which is the best camera on the market right now under £10,000... It does 10bit raw output if you get an external recorder..
 
David W. Jones said:
You can disagree all you want, but the facts are the facts.

For example.
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Yes but resolution is not that important to me, I would shoot a film on a SD CCD camcorder because of the flexibility it gives, "sharpness" is not always that nice looking tbh. For me HD is more than enough.
My best friend is called David Jones. Good name ! ;-)
 
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