Cheap recorder that doesn't compromise

Sound Ninja, This was done with a AKG D5 and a Marantz Preamp for some of my videos, before to tell me is not up to British or American standars showme something better done by you.
Show me what you got my man

 
Noiz2 said:
Which is why IF you can record at 24 bit DO SO.
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This! That is simply my point I wanted to make sure comes across loud and clear, least someone stumbles across this thread and thinks it is ok to do anything lower (because basically all recorders these days can do 24bit).

Felipe Henao said:
Sound Ninja, This was done with a AKG D5 and a Marantz Preamp for some of my videos, before to tell me is not up to British or American standars showme something better done by you.
Show me what you got my man
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Voice overs with music laid over are basically quite low down on the difficulty charts. They're not exactly hard to pull off to a half ok standard, what exactly are you trying to prove anyway?!
 
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Felipe Henao said:
Sound Ninja, This was done with a AKG D5 and a Marantz Preamp for some of my videos, before to tell me is not up to British or American standars showme something better done by you.
Show me what you got my man

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First off I don't get into mine is bigger than yours arguments, they are inherently silly.
Second my signature has links to credits IMDB etc if you want to look me up. Or you could do what everyone does and type my name in google, really not that hard.

And last and maybe most important, you can hardly judge someones chops by watching any finished commercial work. There is a crew involved and a lot of people making decisions about what ends up in the final product. This clip is just you reading copy over some music with a lot of reverb tossed on. It sounds very radio ad like. Not a criticism and if you are looking for radio VO work a very good choice. But I'm not sure what it is supposed to demonstrate.

With that said my reels link is http://www.askincstudios.com/reels/Reels Page/reelspage.htm

I think you got offended because I don't think Azden mics sound good. You shouldn't because it doesn't mater what I think in the long run. My point was that if you feed a great recorder with a mic with limited bandwidth and a high noise floor it's going to be hard to tell different bit depths. One thing you get from 24 bit is more openness a slightly more spacious feel over 16 bit and that subtle quality will be completely swamped by the artifacts of a low quality mic.

Now I do not know that specific mic so maybe it is the gem in the Azden product line? And I have plenty of cheap mics and other gear. They work in certain situations or are things I bought and shouldn't have. If you know the qualities of the mic you can usually find a use for it at some point.
 
BTW my user name is Noiz2, the "sound Ninja" is something the site assigns, maybe on number of helpful posts??? Or how long you have been active, don't really know. It showed up awhile ago, sounds a bit silly but I have nothing to do with that designation. I assume there are a number of folks with the "sound ninja" status.

And thanks. I hadn't checked my website in awhile and I realize I haven't updated the credits in a few years.
 
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Alright, folks. This has gotten so far off-topic that the OP hasn’t returned. And it has turned into a pissing contest from a couple of you.

Many of us have different ways of doing things, means to an end. It’s one thing to disagree, but challenging other people either to prove what they know or to post samples that prove their worth is out of bounds. Name-calling is right out.

Reel it in please. Any more of the pissing match will be dealt with behind the scenes.
 
I don't think it is a problem to record dialogues in 16 bit, if you are getting it right in the field. When my mic placement is off and I increase the gain, there is noise which I don't like. Even crappy lavaliers placed well sound good in 16 bit. However, it is upto the client to decide on the specs.

A lot of broadcast clients ask for sound directly recorded to my C300. Almost all corporate clients want sound directly recorded to camera. Having said that I have just ordered one Sound Devices Mixpre 10T. It looks value for money for my small production.
 
Hey again. In spite of a lot of disagreements, I got a lot of useful information on this thread. Just wanted to know one more thing. To me, the most important part of the sound chain should be the mic and the preamp amplifying the signal (and a skilled tech of course). That's why I thought a recorder should be something that wouldn't compromise. All it had to do was record and don't screw up what the other components were doing. Is this not true? Of course, like I said, I'm not a sound tech so I'm out of my element here.
 
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You kind of get that functionality if you get a recorder that accepts a true line in. The real way to do it though is to use something like a MixPre D and go digitally to a recorder that accepts a digital signal. Then you have what used to be called a "bit bucket" that is keeping the signal exactly as it is coming out of your mixer.

With out delving back into the OT parts, you can get very close to a real "bit bucket" with a recorder that lets you use a real line in. Most recorders with a real line in though are not in the really cheap category. Ironically some of the cheap recorders have/ had (I haven't checked in awhile) digital in.

If I remember correctly (and I may not) the DR-40 has real line ins. If so that would be the cheapest solution that I know of. The F4 I believe does, and think I saw that the Marantz mentioned earlier has real line ins. So that gives you ~$160 to about $550 solutions.
 
Noiz2 said:
BTW my user name is Noiz2, the "sound Ninja" is something the site assigns, maybe on number of helpful posts??? Or how long you have been active, don't really know. It showed up awhile ago, sounds a bit silly but I have nothing to do with that designation. I assume there are a number of folks with the "sound ninja" status.
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I thought it was something yourself chose! Kinda cool name tag under your username to have.


David Evans said:
Hey again. In spite of a lot of disagreements, I got a lot of useful information on this thread. Just wanted to know one more thing. To me, the most important part of the sound chain should be the mic and the preamp amplifying the signal (and a skilled tech of course). That's why I thought a recorder should be something that wouldn't compromise. All it had to do was record and don't screw up what the other components were doing. Is this not true? Of course, like I said, I'm not a sound tech so I'm out of my element here.
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It is normal across the tech world to see a convergence of devices (just look at your smartphone!), to have one devices doing the jobs of many other things. Especially on the lower end (which is the case if you're looking for a cheap recorder), then there are substantial cost savings having one device doing multiple jobs than several dedicated pieces of hardware.

Thus I suggest you just get say a Tascam DR60Dmk2 or similar (or spend a bit more for say a Zoom F4 or MixPre3), then grab a mic and XLR cable (well, plus boom pole etc), and you're good to go!

No need to buy multiple pieces of hardware to do what just one device can do for you now.


You'll have a dedicated boom op / sound recordist with this? If so I suggest getting at least the Zoom F4, as you've got an URSA Mini 4.6K in the camera department, that way it at least almost kinda keeps the two departments "balanced" without being lopsided one way or another.
 
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"If I remember correctly (and I may not) the DR-40 has real line ins"

- I have a DR40, but I'm not sure it bypasses the mic pres in line level. In any case, it sounds good though and accepts nominal +4dB line level via XLR or 1/4" TRS.
OTOH, the DR-680 channels 1-6, totally bypass the mic preamps in line mode. Unfortunately it does not have TC and internal battery economy is abysmal.. though the mkII is allegedly a little better with batteries.
680_mic-line.jpg
 
I feel that all parts of the recording chain are important but the more different gain structures you introduce the more chance there is for potential problems.

There is also a lot of really good budget gear around now and with care and attention good results can be had even at 16 bit 48k.

I still always come back to a short drama I did a few years ago as a DOP and it was just one AT875r mic on a Gitzo carbon fibre boom with Rode PG2 and WS6 plugged straight into the back on my Panasonic HPX301 P2 camera recording at 16 bit 48k. How simple could you get and we peaked at -10dbfs for all the location dialogue.

I think I may get a Zoom F4 next as it seems a good value multi channel recorder although my camera can do four channels and that seems to cover most jobs with the addition of a Twelco budget mixer.
 
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